If Jesus resurrected, then Christianity is true.
Options
1) Jesus never died
2) The body was stolen
3) People were hallucinating
4) It is a legend
5) It happened
All historical accounts affirm he died. He was crucified & stabbed, very unlikely to survive. Pilate verified he died. No one at the time disputed he died.
What if someone stole his body? The location of the tomb was well-known, a large stone was rolled in front with a Roman seal, a trained Roman unit of up to 16 soldiers was guarding it, and the city was overflowing with Passover pilgrims who would've been witnesses. If the guards failed, they would've been executed. Bribery would've led to failure and execution. Neither the Romans nor Jewish leaders wanted the body to be tampered with. The disciples had no real reason to try to steal it and defile the body of their teacher while breaking Jewish religious law. The gospel accounts embarrassingly admit women first told the apostles about the empty tomb, which indicates honesty. If anyone showed Jesus' body, Christianity would've never existed.
What if people hallucinated Jesus resurrected? It is inconceivable that hundreds of people of average soundness of mind should suddenly experience all sorts of sensuous impressions, and that all these experiences should rest entirely upon hallucination.
Is it a legend? Legends don't develop while eyewitnesses are alive to refute them, but a creed mentioning the resurrection existed within only a few years. Legends aren't supported by critical historical and archaeological research. The legend theory doesn't explain the sudden courage of the apostles, who were scared, hid, and denied they knew Jesus, nor their bold preaching of his resurrection to the point of torture and death. Even the Talmud by Jesus' rivals says he was a real man who was killed for sorcery and apostasy. Virtually all historians agree that Jesus was a real man and reject the myth theory.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhl72lK_4iA&t=98
Anonymous
>>11704944 TL;DR:
Jesus comes telling humanity we live in a simulation, hacks the matrix and proves it, resurrects proving even more and tells people that now they can access the hacking code like him if they practice proper discipline taught by him. Discipline is important because if you don't have it you will be manipulated by the system simulation and you basically lose the power to control it.
Anonymous
>>11704945 It's more like the admin of the server spawning as a player to show us how to follow the rules and win the game.
Anonymous
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>>11704946 >It's more like the admin of the server It more likely the admin of the original server trying to explain how we went to a fake server which just want to enslave us for the lulz.
Imagine you accidentally spawn on some edgy kid server in minecraft and lose power to open the console and you have to grind every material and get spawn camped by creepers where the edgy kid mocks you for being inferior.
Anonymous
>>11704944 The resurrection has a symbolic meaning which does not require it to be true or false. The teachings of Christ, the dissident, are equally relevant regardless of any myth element. What about the abuse of Christianity by Imperial Rome? How about Paul the "apostle" effectively coopting the Christian timeline? There are enough holes in the story to keep poking, but the crux of the matter is do you believe or do you not? If this story leads you to God then it has served it's purpose. The path you took to realisation is less important than the realisation.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 Go read your Quran, faggot
Anonymous
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>>11704948 >the real lesson was the frens we made all the way...... Anonymous
>>11704948 holes in the story? like what? and it does require to be true. the bible even says that if it isn't true, then you shouldn't believe in christ
Anonymous
>>11704944 I can appreciate religion and all, but how the fuck are Christians going to get their subverted churches back under control?
You do realize people use the Bible to push for total globalhomo, right?
Christians allow for kindness to be exploited as weakness.
Anonymous
>>11704944 >If Jesus resurrected, then Christianity is true. Then Christianity is false. People do not come back to life. Glad we could clear that up, seems the rest of your wall of text is a little unnecessary.
>a large stone was rolled in front with a Roman seal, a trained Roman unit of up to 16 soldiers was guarding Was it? This is as bullshit as a Roman governor maintaining a tradition of releasing condemned prisoners.
>The legend theory doesn't explain the sudden courage of the apostles, who were scared, hid, and denied they knew Jesus, nor their bold preaching of his resurrection to the point of torture and death Oh yes, the old maxim of "if people die for their retarded beliefs they must be right". Why don't you kill yourself, that'll make you even more right
Anonymous
>>11704952 Why didn't Jesus do the same when he destroyed that jew temple?
Why does Poland reject the current pope because its obviously a fake satanic one?
Things take time and work.
Anonymous
>>11704944 Jesus wasn't even a real person, you Jewish cocksucker
>pic related Anonymous
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>>11704946 we are all admin, play the game as you wish but don't grief.
Anonymous
Watch this if you're not 100% certain you're going to heaven when you die.
https://youtu.be/cUH0G12qQJ0 Anonymous
>>11704951 I just pointed out a big one. Also Ananias was assassinated. A lot of the story could have been modified over the years.
Anonymous
Let's play spot the kike
(((
>>11704955 )))
well that was quick
Anonymous
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>>11704955 >lowqualitybait.jpg Anonymous
>>11704959 >Worships a literal kike as his personal Lord and Saviour >Calls everyone else a scheming Jew Anonymous
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By the way your so called Zeus Hero Jupiter was a rapist who raped Leda to produce Helen of Troy and the Trojan War nice heroes you have you sick fucks
Anonymous
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>>11704953 > People do not come back to life. Wrong.
Anonymous
>>11704955 Virtually all scholars who have investigated the history of the Christian movement find that the historicity of Jesus is effectively certain,[1][2][3] and standard historical criteria have aided in reconstructing his life.[4] Scholars differ on the beliefs and teachings of Jesus as well as the accuracy of the details of his life that have been described in the gospels,[5][6][7][note 1] but virtually all scholars support the historicity of Jesus and reject the Christ myth theory that Jesus never existed.[8][9][10][11][note 2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus [The Christ myth theory] is a fringe theory, supported by few tenured or emeritus specialists in biblical criticism or cognate disciplines.[3][4][5][q 2] It is criticized for its outdated reliance on comparisons between mythologies,[6] and deviates from the mainstream historical view.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christ_myth_theory Anonymous
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>>11704957 only based post in thread
Anonymous
>>11704944 Say it in red OP
Anonymous
>>11704964 You know that Wikipedia pages on Jesus are written by people like you, right...?
Anonymous
>>11704953 People do not. You're right. Jesus was God born as a man. Nobody dies for something they know is a lie that they made up, especially when torture is involved, and especially when many people are involved instead of just one who testifies it is true, and that they gained nothing but suffering and death from it.
Anonymous
>>11704958 paul becoming a christian is actually one of the biggest pieces of evidence. this was a guy who hated christians and persecuted them and then all of a sudden he becomes one? that would be like bernie sanders becoming the biggest trump supporter ever. not a hole in the story
Anonymous
>>11704967 Check each of the citations out.
Anonymous
>>11704953 do you really think an all knowing, all powerful being wouldnt be able to resurrect people from the dead?
Anonymous
>>11704967 You know the books that deny the historicity of Jesus are written by people like you right?
Anonymous
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>>11704969 >that would be like bernie sanders becoming the biggest trump supporter ever lol
Anonymous
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>>11704966 You glib fuck
everyone knows the Pyramid Ritual involves spending three days in there
give me a break you dross
Anonymous
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>>11704971 Yeah if he was playing the multicharacters, had them die and said
it was me all along
haha got you
Anonymous
>>11704968 >Nobody dies for something they know is a lie that they made up None of the stories of early Christian martyrs actually happened; they are all church propaganda from centuries later
Of course, you already know that and you're just trying to hoodwink us
Anonymous
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His body wasn't stolen because the Sanhedrin spent all their resources and time trying to find it and couldn't.
Anonymous
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>>11704969 >paul becoming a christian is actually one of the biggest pieces of evidence. this was a guy who hated christians and persecuted them and then all of a sudden he becomes one? Wow, in that case Jesus must be real, Hallelujah!
Anonymous
>>11704976 really? because even the bible talks about how several of them were arrested and executed. just read acts
Anonymous
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>>11704970 >Check each of the citations out. The citations have just been cherry-picked to match what a bunch of evangelical weirdos already believe. That's why no-one with even half a brain relies on Wikipedia for anything.
Anonymous
>>11704976 You posted a book by Richard Carrier. He goes against the consensus of the overwhelming majority of historians that Jesus was a real person. Now you want to lecture me about facts?
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>11704972 >You know the books that deny the historicity of Jesus are written by people like you right? Actually no, I'm not a degenerate limp-wristed faggot like Carrier. That's just a one-off aberration probably by caused by pollutants in the water or something
Anonymous
>>11704976 You can read Roman edicts on trying to persecute Christians lmao Literally look them up
Anonymous
>>11704944 The Romans raped him during his torture so maybe after he died they wanted some more of that ass.
Anonymous
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>>11704961 You are not supposed to suck Jesus dick wtf.
If a Jew told you to NOT jump from a building you would jump because he's a Jew and its literally tricking you?
Anonymous
>>11704944 The real argument for Christ’s efficacy as the messiah is that all of his disciples were eventually beheaded or otherwise crucified and tortured to death; while none of them rebuked his name, even upon pain of death.
Anonymous
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11704979 >really? because even the bible talks about how several of them were arrested and executed. just read acts Unfortunately Acts contradicts Paul's own letters, and contains endless improbable events like three (THREE!) prison breaks, clearly demonstrating that it is mostly fiction.
Even without those problems, it would still have been written much too late to be considered a reliable history of the early church.
Anonymous
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>>11704985 He raped them harder
He's Zeus the rapist after all
He caused the fall of whole nations by his raping
Anonymous
>>11704988 Read the argument and watch the video to understand the case being put forward in favor of it. Then you can intelligently evaluate the "if".
Anonymous
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>>11704961 Are people so ignorant that they don’t know Jesus told people to not do Newish things anymore? Like what kind of retard doesn’t know Jesus said to stop circumcision and all the kosher shit?
Oh that’s right, a kike shill
Anonymous
>>11704981 >He goes against the consensus of the overwhelming majority of historians that Jesus was a real person Bitch, you have never read a single academic historical journal in your entire life, you have no idea what the consensus of the "overwhelming majority" of historians is
Anonymous
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>>11704985 In fact he fucked the shit of Rome when he found Saturn and kicked his head in
Anonymous
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>>11704958 That must be why the earliest manuscripts match the later ones.
Dummy.
Anonymous
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>>11704985 Ask Virgil, he knows
Anonymous
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The main reason the story could have happened, is because Jesus was just an unimportant nobody that didnt matter. Nobody bothered checking his wounds, the tomb wasnt that secure, the guards didnt care, those hundreds of people where all part of a cult, nobody cares about eye witnesses in a foreign city, etc
Anonymous
>>11704984 >You can read Roman edicts on trying to persecute Christians So fucking what? No-one doubts that first-century Palestine was filled with faggot Jews wandering around claiming to be the Messiah, and over 6,000,000 cults dedicated to that.
Anonymous
>>11704982 this video is saying that paul calls himself an apostle and that's wrong, even though in acts he is made an apostle by God and says he doesn't feel like he is one but takes it anyway
Anonymous
>>11704994 You are peddling pseudohistory.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 >Legends don't develop while eyewitnesses are alive to refute them lol wat. In this same board, people believe the 'election fraud' meme and qanon idiocy, despide the lack of evidence
Anonymous
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>>11704944 story rings out the ages
the most printed book in human history
must be fake
the absolute state of atheism
Anonymous
>>11704987 >all of his disciples were eventually beheaded or otherwise crucified and tortured to death Citation needed, an actual citation from a contemporary manuscript though, not your Jewish fan fiction
Anonymous
>>11704990 again, do you really think an all knowing, all powerful being wouldn't be able to break someone out of prison?
Anonymous
>>11705001 >You are peddling pseudohistory. If that's true, then present a single piece of evidence supporting the existence of a historical Jesus. It should be easy, faggot. Go ahead, I'll wait.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 >dude magic lmao You're so far up your own arse its disgusting.
Anonymous
>>11705005 >again, do you really think an all knowing, all powerful being wouldn't be able to break someone out of prison? If you need the intervention of a deity to make your hypothesis work then you're just a faggot who isn't worth bothering with
Anonymous
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>>11704944 >He was crucified & stabbed, very unlikely to survive. Pilate verified he died. No one at the time disputed he died. Fun fact the "blood and water" flowing from the wound is actually a reference to red blood cells separating from plasma after bloodflow stops. In actual dead bodies, you can see this because parts of them get really red/purple where the (heavier) red blood cells sink due to gravity.
Anonymous
>>11705006 you do know every historian supports that jesus was real, right?
Anonymous
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>>11705000 Watch the whole video. Also you're trying to back up a source with itself. If Paul was a scammer then everything he said is suspect.
Anonymous
>>11705008 the book is literally about a deity intervening. if there is an all knowing, all powerful being why wouldnt they intervene?
Anonymous
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>>11704945 >Jesus comes telling humanity we live in a simulation, No, its more like
>>11704946 , but the admin also tells us that, if we win, we can log off and hang out with the devs.
Anonymous
>>11705006 Holy shit you’re a faggot. Links Wikipedia with various citations
>muh Wikipedia is just written by you those sources don’t count Go ahead, kill yourself. I’ll wait
Anonymous
>>11705006 Yes, let me build a rocket and let's launch into space ourselves to prove that the earth is round. Or, or... we can accept the consensus of the overwhelming majority of scientists who are experts in their field and have already done the work for us.
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>11705012 Atheists also ask this question. This is part of the problem. Faith does not need to include insisting on proving the existence of magic. This way atheists and fundamentalists are two sides of the same retarded coin.
Anonymous
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>>11704948 >The resurrection has a symbolic meaning which does not require it to be true or false. The teachings of Christ, the dissident, are equally relevant regardless of any myth element. true, but the Resurrection is also true. If I didn't beleive in God, I would still be Catholic/Orthodox.
t; The Grand Inquisitor
Anonymous
>>11705010 >you do know every historian supports that jesus was real, right? Yes, apart from all the historians who don't, none of whom you have ever read because you don't books, do you, you faggot
Do you want to know how I know, that you never read books? It's because if you did, you would now be posting "Ha ha that imbecile XYZ agrees with you, but he can't even read Greek" or something like that
Anonymous
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6) he belonged to a Jewish sect that wanted to scam goyim into giving them money and wealth
Anonymous
>>11705012 >the book is literally about a deity intervening. if there is an all knowing, all powerful being why wouldnt they intervene? Who the fuck cares. If you're going to use supernatural explanations then you can prove anything you like, which is why no-one has ever paid attention to you your whole life, you loser
Anonymous
>>11705010 Consensus is not proof. ( consensus fallacy )
Jesus is an example of an historically fake person. We can simply test for them by seeing whether they materialized in and out of existence by preposterous magical events performed by a magical Jew god using Jew god magic. Conversely, Judeo-Christians believe these magical events actually prove the existence of the magical Semitic god Yahweh.
Anonymous
>>11704954 >Why does Poland reject the current pope because its obviously a fake satanic one? they don't. He isn't fake. (unless he stole it from Benedict, which would make Benedict the real pope-I'm holding out for Benedict's death before I personally "certify" Franks election). He's probably just a shit pope. We have had them before.
Anonymous
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>>11705021 wow, resorting to an insult when you know you're wrong. very clever
Anonymous
>>11705014 Bitch, if you type the word Wikipedia once more I'm going to give you AIDS
Anonymous
>>11704944 the bible is not a historic document
Anonymous
>>11705015 Oh, so you don't have any evidence then. Why didn't you just say so?
Anonymous
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>>11705022 it kinda is when they also show us the proof. that's like saying, "we dont know truly if the earth is round or not. are u just gonna stick to the consensus?"
Anonymous
>>11705006 Try all of the historical accounts and documentation from less than 20 years after his death. We have more documentation for Jesus as we do for Charlemagne.
Anonymous
>>11705027 do you want a photograph? guess what, they didnt have photos back then. and how do you know someone like alexander the great was even real? show me one historian who says he is, besides the overall consensus among historians that he was real
Anonymous
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>>11704999 You’re a retard. Kill youself. By the second century ad Christians were nothing like jews and weren’t even thought of as such. Since the death of Jesus Christians were persecuted in the first century they were just seen as the followers of Jesus
Anonymous
>>11705027 Carrier anon, I‘ve been reading your posts for years now.
At what point will you Unterstand that the christkeks here will never learn
Anonymous
>>11704992 Really poor arguments. Let's say he resurrected, as you claim. Resurrection is impossible. Thus the only way it could have happened is through divine intervention, which is your claim I assume. Therefore, if you believe divine intervention is possible, why would you stop at resurrection? Maybe God snatched the body for fun, maybe he pushed it into everyone's imagination, maybe he made people believe Jesus resurrected, etc. My point is, if you're going to base your argument on magic, you have to go through an exhaustive list of possibilities instead of using magic as an argument on your side and logic as an argument on the side you're attacking.
Anonymous
>>11705029 >Try all of the historical accounts and documentation from less than 20 years after his death Lol, what historical accounts? What documentation?
Are you talking about the Pauline epistles? You know that none of Paul's letters actually mention a historical Jesus, right...?
Anonymous
2,000+ years and you morons are still debating how much you believe the story of the dead jew who died on a stick. This is why religion is a mind trap
Anonymous
>>11705021 C.S Lewis once wrote...
"The Naturalist believes that a great process, of ‘becoming’, exists ‘on its own’ in space and time, and that nothing else exists—we call particular things and events being only the parts into which we analyse the great process or the shapes which that process takes at given moments and given points in space. This single, total reality he calls Nature.
The Supernaturalist believes that one Thing exists on its own and has produced the framework of space and time and the procession of systematically connected events which fill them. This framework, and this filling, he calls Nature. It may, or may not, be the only reality which the one Primary Thing has produced. There might be other systems in addition to the one we call Nature. In that sense there might be several ‘Natures’. This conception must be kept quite distinct from what is commonly called ‘plurality of worlds’—i.e. different solar systems or different galaxies, ‘island universes’ existing in widely separated parts of a single space and time. These, however remote, would be parts of the same Nature as our own sun: it and they would be interlocked by being in relations to one another, spatial and temporal relations and casual relations as well. And it is just this reciprocal interlocking within a system which makes it what we call a Nature. Other Natures might not be spatio-temporal at all: or, if any of them were, their space and time would have no spatial or temporal relation to ours. It is just this discontinuity, this failure of interlocking, which would justify us in calling them different Natures. This does not mean that there would be absolutely no relation between them; they would be related by their common derivation from a single Supernatural source. They would, in this respect, be like different novels by a single author; the events in one story have no relation to the events in another except that they are invented by the same author."
Anonymous
>>11705030 >do you want a photograph? guess what, they didnt have photos back then Bitch I'll accept your claim that John the Baptist was real and that he baptised people and got himself executed and that the Apostle Paul was real and had visions and stuff because there is actual manuscript evidence for those events taking place.
When you get some actual evidence for (((Jesus))) then get back to me.
Anonymous
>>11705033 That's exactly it. It's why he was God and not someone else. It's an exception. See
>>11705036 Anonymous
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>>11705032 >At what point will you Unterstand that the christkeks here will never learn Based AND redpilled, but it's not the Christcucks I'm trying to persuade.
Anonymous
>>11705037 nice job ignoring my second point because it proves how idiotic you are
Anonymous
>>11705034 >Are you talking about the Pauline epistles? You know that none of Paul's letters actually mention a historical Jesus, right...? I'm pretty sure I've been over this with you bong. He talks explicitly about Christ's "birth" "death" and "works." So, yeah, Paul does talk about a historical Jesus.
Anonymous
>>11705036 >C.S Lewis once wrote... C S Lewis was so stupid that it literally never occured to him that the Gospel accounts he was reading might not be 100% accurate.
Anonymous
>>11704961 Learn what that word means retarded kike
Anonymous
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>>11705038 >>11705033 To clarify, a "supernaturalist" does not role out divine intervention. So far, no alternative theories have been presented that hold up.
Anonymous
>>11705042 Oh but Richard Carrier is a genius, right?
Anonymous
>>11705019 Learn how to do history instead of relying on the authority of others. We have enough evidence to suggest that Jesus was real & there are historical accounts of people going back way before Jesus. We believe that Diogenes was real based on historical evidence. It's likely that Atlas was real as well, although he probably didn't hold the world up. Myths are based on reality and then go beyond it.
Anonymous
>>11705040 >nice job ignoring my second point because it proves how idiotic you are Mate, none of your points make any sense. Photos? Who cares? We have numismatic, archaeological and primary manuscript evidence for numerous figures of the 1st century. None of those things exist for Jesus.
Don't bother trying to argue about evidence until you have an understanding of what actually constitutes evidence.
Anonymous
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>11705043 Yes yes, you are a Jew if you dont worship a Jew who fulfilled all Jewish prophecies
Anonymous
>>11705046 >>11705047 this too. Was Socrates a myth?
Anonymous
>>11705041 >I'm pretty sure I've been over this with you bong. He talks explicitly about Christ's "birth" "death" and "works." Lol nice try Schlomo, but that passages about which you keep whining are visions, not descriptions of historical events. I've pointed that out to you several times and yet you don't seem to be able to understand the difference between someone on acid and someone who has seen something with their own eyes
Anonymous
>>11705042 You know 4 primary sources are better than your bulk sir speculation right me evidence?
Anonymous
>>11704944 Jesus never existed. The Pilot letter is literally a forgery.
Anonymous
>>11705047 still ignoring it i see
i said "and how do you know someone like alexander the great was even real? show me one historian who says he is, besides the overall consensus among historians that he was real"
Anonymous
>>11705047 >we don't have manuscript evidence for JC >>11705041 Ok, bro. What the fuck was Paul talking about? LMAO.
Anonymous
Sage
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>>11705025 Ok so you admit you’re a fucking retard that won’t accept sources even though you asked for them. Cool.
Nice bait, now it’s time for the herbs
Anonymous
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>>11705049 Can't handle the truth I see
Anonymous
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>>11705023 >He's probably just a shit pope. We have had them before. That is what I mean basically. He's shit so we have to realise that ourselves and reject what he's not doing properly. What I mean to tell is how a nation conscious of the mistakes reject supreme order from a Man. I do not blame the pope personally for his mistakes because he is still a man.
Anonymous
>>11705004 Dude you’re a fucking retarded Faggot maybe do a google search on the lives of the saints
Anonymous
>>11705038 >It's why he was God and not someone else. This is not true.
The god Godan ( God or ᚷᛟᛞ ) is the name of the chief god among many others in the polytheistic Germanic pantheon. He was called Wodan by Angles, Saxons, and Franks of north-central and western Europe, and Godan by the Lombards of south-central Europe. We know from the many instances where the name Godan and Wodan are contracted to God and Wod that this is where the name God originates. God is a name, not a word. God is always a name and an alternate spelling for the name of Godan. God is not a title, it is the Lombardic ( and shortened ) name of the Aryan pagan god Godan, or more commonly, Wodan. God is a name for the Germanic god Wodan ( ᚹᛟᛞᚨᚾ ) and the Norse chief god, Odin. Actually Godan is the only god whose name is literally God. God is not the only god, but still, he is the only god whose name is literally God ( Godan ).
Anonymous
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>>11705045 >Oh but Richard Carrier is a genius, right? No, he's a second-rate historian and a first-rate faggot. That's actually an above-average skill level in the field of ancient history, though, so it doesn't matter.
And Carrier has stated many times (as you would know, if you had actually read him) that the theory isn't even his. He (Carrier) is just applying a different statistical method to the claims to see if they still stand up to scrutiny.
Anonymous
>>11705046 >We have enough evidence to suggest that Jesus was real Great, just present what you think is your strongest piece of evidence and then I'll laugh at you or agree with you, whichever is appropriate
Anonymous
>>11705052 >I CANT READ >Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God— 2 the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures 3 regarding his Son, who as to his earthly life[a] was a descendant of David, 4 and who through the Spirit of holiness was appointed the Son of God in power by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord. I'm not seeing anything about a "vision" here, bro.
Anonymous
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>>11705064 >Just reinvent the wheel bro Anonymous
>>11705051 >this too. Was Socrates a myth? I don't know, any neither do you, but it's very difficult to ascertain if any of the earliest Greek philosophers were actual historical people. All the evidence comes from centuries later.
Anonymous
>>11705052 >I CANT READ >Galatians 4:4, NLT: "But when the right time came, God sent his Son, born of a woman, subject to the law. Anonymous
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>>11704944 Jesus is the sun. Pilate is Sagittarius the arrow of which pierces the sun in the side causing it to die in Capricon. There after 3 days in the tomb (22-25) it begins to rise again. Your risen savior and the light of the world born of Virgo, The manger in the sky above in Cancer, and the three wise men the belts of Orion there to pay homage.
Anonymous
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>>11705062 That doesn’t change the fact it’s used as a title you retard. All you did was find the etymology of the word
Anonymous
>>11705053 >You know 4 primary sources What 4 primary sources? What are you talking about?
Anonymous
>>11705052 >I CANT READ >Romans 8:3, NLT: "The law of Moses was unable to save us because of the weakness of our sinful nature. So God did what the law could not do. He sent his own Son in a body like the bodies we sinners have. And in that body God declared an end to sin's control over us by giving his Son as a sacrifice for our sins. " How explicit does the dude have to be? lmao
Anonymous
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>>11705071 he's talking about the gospels
Anonymous
>>11705055 >i said "and how do you know someone like alexander the great was even real?" Because we have archaeological, numismatic and primary manuscript evidence for him.
Anonymous
>>11705056 >Ok, bro. What the fuck was Paul talking about? LMAO. Paul clearly writes in Gal 1:11-12 that all his knowledge of Jesus comes from visions, and he never mentions any of source of knowledge, nor does he ever describe Jesus doing anything or saying anything in real life, not even once
Anonymous
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>>11705067 Yeah your id is right you are a jew
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11705052 >I CAN"T READ >5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in very nature[a] God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; 7 rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.8 And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to death—even death on a cross! Anonymous
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>>11705061 >Dude you’re a fucking retarded Faggot maybe do a google search on the lives of the saints Why would i do that? Is it going to reveal any first-century manuscripts that I haven't already read?
Anonymous
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>>11705062 The word God is comes from the work Good. The reason is because the Platonic form of the good, the goal of philosophy, is God. Jesus is this person, which is why the Bhagvad Gita, the innermost confidential knowledge of yoga is about the personality of the supreme Lord who incarnates as a human. Krishna is Jesus who is also Jehovah who is Allah. The people with the most divine love and wisdom know Jesus as the Lord and join him in his heaven when the shed their material body in death. This is a perfect kingdom, which influences earthly political systems through the true church, which in today’s world has no physical existence. People who cling to evil and falsity turn away from Jesus and drive themselves into hell after losing their body.
Anonymous
>>11705076 wow, that's literally the same for jesus, besides the numismatic evidence. also, theres ancient historians who talk about jesus like Tacitus
do you know how idiotic you sound right now? would've been better if you never responded to my post
Anonymous
>>11705077 He says that he had a vision, dipshit, not that all of his knowledge of him came from visions. We have multiple sources saying that he was in direct contact with the guys that knew him.
Anonymous
>>11705065 >I'm not seeing anything about a "vision" here, bro. That's because the first couple of lines are an interpolation by a later author, a fact you would already know if you had read a single book on the subject.
The big giveaway is that Paul is writing about himself in the third person for some reason.
Anonymous
>>11705071 Yeah, it seems to actually be 2 primary sources, with some details added here and there from the various oral traditions available to the authors.
Anonymous
>>11705064 If you are going to question the historical validity of Jesus then you may as well not bother. The prechristian jewish community was ripe for someone, anyone, to take the stage. Even with the greatest possible amount of skepticism I have to accept that revolutionary leaders develop when the conditions are right. The stories people tell about them are embellished. There is even suggestion that the god Odin was a real man.
Anonymous
>>11705075 Exactly, you can argue Matthew Luke and John may not be primary sources because they weee all written a century after his death but they just recount oral tradition, and mark was written 50-80 ad only a few decades post death. That’s a primary source if there was ever one. But you’ll read caesars campaign into Gaul and believe every word of it. You pick and choose which historical sources to trust because you are extremely anti-Jesus and know if he was real you’d be fucked with how you live your life in open resentment of Him.
Anonymous
>>11705038 You're missing the point. Your side can use divine intervention as an argument but the other side is crippled. Poor arguments.
Anonymous
>>11705068 >>Galatians 4:4, NLT: "But when the right time came, God sent his Son, born of a woman, subject to the law. Lol, nice try, but the original Greek doesn't actually say "born" but "fabricated".
See, this is what happens when to people who think that the KJV is the definitive guide to knowledge of Jesus' life; they just end up looking like chumps.
Anonymous
>>11705085 Thats normal rhetoric in the first century, you dipshit. The "Conquest of Gaul" was written entirely in 3rd person.
Anonymous
>>11705088 also, its not like they had paper lying around. a day's wage was the price of one sheet of papyrus paper back then so that explains why it took so long to write
Anonymous
>>11705090 >of a woman fucking retard
Anonymous
>>11705072 Wow, great quotation. Doesn't say the body was sent to Earth though, does it?
Obviously you already know that 1st century Jews thought there multiple spiritual realms besides Heaven, and that angels would occasionally get sent to lower realms to carry out errands and stuff, because if you didn't know that it would prove that you don't actually read books.
Anonymous
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>>11705089 I'd love to see some alternative theories that stand up under scrutiny. I really would, seriously. I'm not liberal with accepting cases of divine intervention.
Anonymous
>>11705074 >Embarassing... Bitch, that's not how you spell embarrassing. Anyway, you're wasting your time with the Plato analogy. I haven't read him or much about him, so I don't know any better than you do whether he was real or not.
Anonymous
>>11705094 dude you are just reaching now. you sound like the biggest idiot ever. stop letting your hate of christ blind you
Anonymous
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>>11705084 >We have multiple sources saying that he was in direct contact with the guys that knew him. Paul never says that he met someone who personally knew Jesus.
Anonymous
>>11705080 >being made in human likeness. Still doesn't say that Jesus ever visited Earth (until after the Resurrection, obviously, Paul is very explicit about a visit after that). Nice try, though.
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11705094 >27 They were pleased to do it, and indeed they owe it to them. For if the Gentiles have shared in the Jews’ spiritual blessings, they owe it to the Jews to share with them their material blessings.(A) You think you are Smart? Explain this HA
Anonymous
>>11705096 >Telling everyone to read books >Hasn't read Plato Confirmed LARP
Anonymous
>>11704944 Mods...get this fucking SHIT off the political board.
Anonymous
>>11705096 I knew you would say that
Anonymous
>>11705083 >also, theres ancient historians who talk about jesus like Tacitus Lol STFU, Tacitus wrote about someone with a similar-sounding name. Then some idiot scribe scratched out the original text and wrote Jesus over the top, not realising that later generations would invent x-ray machines that can see the original ink.
>do you know how idiotic you sound right now? Mate, you didn't even know about the interpolation controversy until three seconds ago.
Anonymous
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>>11705103 Religion is intrinsically political.
Anonymous
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>>11705092 They don’t wanna talk about that though only the government primary sources lol. They hate the rich yet only trust the history rich. It’s a hypocrisy as old as civilization
Anonymous
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>>11705099 >talks about his birth and ancestry lmao
Anonymous
Quoted By:
>>11705103 You are an idiot if you don't think religion is political, but race is.
Anonymous
>>11705084 >He says that he had a vision, dipshit, not that all of his knowledge of him came from visions Fuck off, it is right there in plain Greek: "I did not receive the gospel from any man but from a revelation of Jesus"
Also Paul never contradicts this statement in any of his letters
Also Paul never mentions any other source of knowledge for Jesus in any of his letters
Also Paul never mentions anything that Jesus did or said or taught in any of his letters
Anonymous
>>11705096 You haven’t even taken a basic collage philosophy course or even a high school level one and have the balls to go argue theology on /pol/. The average British 17 year old Muslim everyone.
Anonymous
>>11705102 >>11705104 Comparing Christ to Socrates is peak retardation because the latter had multiple different people talking about him that viewed him differently. He isnt a mythical person.
However people like Homer or the Pre Socraticd are disputed to have even existed.
Anonymous
>>11705105 >Lol STFU, Tacitus wrote about someone with a similar-sounding name. Then some idiot scribe scratched out the original text and wrote Jesus over the top, not realising that later generations would invent x-ray machines that can see the original ink. Source? That is speculation as far as I know. I'm pretty sure that manuscript is not availible
Anonymous
>>11705105 >But all human efforts, all the lavish gifts of the emperor, and the propitiations of the gods, did not banish the sinister belief that the conflagration was the result of an order. Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called "Chrestians" by the populace. >Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilate, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their center and become popular. >Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. he's obviously talking about Christ and Christians, the dumb nigger just couldn't spell
Anonymous
Quoted By:
>>11705110 He is saying he was given a divine revelation by Jesus. We know Paul never met him before his death, however, during the resurrection Paul was visited. What don’t ya get?
Anonymous
>>11704944 >>11704968 >>11704969 >>11704976 What about muslims who due for their religion? Does that mean Islam is the truest because they die for it and we can clearly see they die for it? Also if a christian converts to Islam then dies this mean that Islam is true because some guy just converted?
Anonymous
>>11705086 >Yeah, it seems to actually be 2 primary sources Possible, but there is no reason why Matthew couldn't have been simply inventing the so-called Q material, or using a lost source whose original source was Mark anyway. This is question to which we will never have an answer.
>with some details added here and there from the various oral traditions available to the authors. If there were oral traditions available to Mark, Matthew and Luke, it's a pity that they didn't use any of them. 90% of the text has been copied from the Septuagint and much of the rest can plausibly be traced to various Greek sources.
Anonymous
>>11705112 Name all the primary sources of his era that name him.
Anonymous
>>11704944 >All historical accounts affirm he died. He was crucified & stabbed, very unlikely to survive. Pilate verified he died. No one at the time disputed he died. There are no contemporary non-Biblical accounts that Jesus even existed. The closest we get are decades after his supposed death.
Anonymous
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>>11705087 >The prechristian jewish community was ripe for someone, anyone, to take the stage Yes, and his name was John the Baptist.
K̶̘͛n̴͘i̷̧̐g̶̹̈́h̸̰̃t̶̘̀m̴̹̏a̷̫͑r̷̩̚e̷͈̓z̴̼̆
K̶̘͛n̴͘i̷̧̐g̶̹̈́h̸̰̃t̶̘̀m̴̹̏a̷̫͑r̷̩̚e̷͈̓z̴̼̆ Tue 24 Nov 2020 19:10:22 No. 11705121 Report Quoted By:
>>11704944 option 6 : people wrote down lies.
Anonymous
Guys. Would it be possible to copy Jesus Christ's DNA via genetic engineering if his remains are somewhere hidden that "they" know for sure? Is a genetic copy of Jesus Christ our antichrist?
Anonymous
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>>11704944 >6) A dude pretended to be Jesus and said he came back to life Anonymous
>>11705091 >Thats normal rhetoric in the first century, you dipshit. The "Conquest of Gaul" was written entirely in 3rd person. Yes, but Paul is not written entirely in the 3rd person, so that argument does not apply. The passage described is obviously an introduction added by a later author, that later became embedded in the text because that is what always happened.
Anonymous
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>>11705094 >“For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified” (1 Cor. 2:2, ESV). >He was crucified, but only metaphorically. LOL
Anonymous
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>>11704944 You got suckered by a 1st century Jonestown cult
Anonymous
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>>11705093 Bitch, go away and learn Greek and then you can argue about whether Paul wrote 'born of a woman' or not. Until then you're just rustling my jimmies.
Anonymous
>>11705116 Nobody goes through torture and dies for something they KNOW for a fact is a lie they made up. Especially when it comes to multiple people, one of them will crack. In the case of Muslims, Muhammad who benefited greatly from Islam and did no miracles apart from the Quran may very well have been lying, but others did not know that. The apostles all claimed to have seen the resurrected Jesus with their own two eyes and died in the worst ways never once denying that. Different situations.
Anonymous
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>>11705097 Bitch show me a passage in Paul's letters in which he describes Jesus doing something or saying something that other human beings saw
Anonymous
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>>11705128 >The apostles all claimed to have seen the resurrected Jesus with their own two eyes and died in the worst ways never once denying that. And how do you know that? What is the source of this information?
Sage
>>11705105 I can’t imagine willfully being this retarded.
Pliny the younger, Josephus and other contemporary texts mention Jesus and there is never a question about his existence.
Fuck if you ignorant piece of shit
Anonymous
>>11705094 >“FOR SINCE WE BELIEVE THAT JESUS DIED AND ROSE AGAIN” (1 THESS. 4:14, NRSV) >died lol
Anonymous
Quoted By:
>>11704944 Remember when Elijah mocked Baal's priests for unable to summon fireballs from the sky because their god didn't exist?
Well go on and let any devoted christians try it and see how much difference does they make
Sage
>>11705119 How are you so ignorant?
Tacitus, Josephus and Pliny...
Anonymous
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>>11704944 Give a non bible source please
Anonymous
>>11705117 Q material+the source for John
Anonymous
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>>11705100 >4) to be made, finished Anonymous
>>11705101 Wow impressive, proof for a historical Jesus in a verse that doesn't mention Jesus.
Anonymous
>>11704944 How many people and other being were present when the tomb was opened?
If you have conflicting numbers why should I believe anything else?
Anonymous
>>11705102 >>Telling everyone to read books >>Hasn't read Plato Bitch, if you know of anyone on this planet who has read Plato then that person must have a fucking time machine because all of his writings are lost
Fuck me why is this board full of retards
Anonymous
>>11705124 Or it's an introduction by Paul himself, which is rhetorically consistent with other documents we have from the time. Use of the third person was not always as looked down upon as it is now. It's not obvious either way, unless you are imputing modern literary etiquette onto 1st century greeks
Anonymous
>>11705118 Aristophanes, Plato, Aristotle and Xenophon. Aristotle wasnt an exact Contemporary tho
Anonymous
>>11705140 >Bitch, if you know of anyone on this planet who has read Plato then that person must have a fucking time machine because all of his writings are lost nigga what? We have received shit tons of Plato.
Anonymous
Quoted By:
>>11704944 dear op,
in order for god to protect his prophet he took his body and soul to the skies and replaced him with what's theorised by muslim scholars:
a) a human who looks like him and will go to heaven after his death
b) an angel who died for god.
god would never let his "son" die on a fucking cross by a bunch of kikes.
and if jesus was a god he wouldn't have fucking died by a bunch of kikes.
in conclusion: christians have been deceived by the kikes since the kikes took control of the religion and edited the bible.
there was only one bible and now there is multiple. this is why god had to send another prophet for humanity and another religion which is islam.
islam and christianity are the very similar.
god didn't send another prophet or make a new religion because the quran to this day has not been edited. it remains pure and original.
Anonymous
>>11705111 >You haven’t even taken a basic collage philosophy course or even a high school level one and have the balls to go argue theology on /pol/. WTF are you talking about you retard? I don't give a shit about either philosophy (well, not ancient philosophy) and I certainly don't give the smelliest of shits about theology.
Jesus' existence is a historical question to be answered by historians. All of those retard theologians can blow me.
Anonymous
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>>11705096 >I've never read Plato you are just outing yourself as an ignoramus
Anonymous
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>>11704948 >If this story leads you to God then it has served it's purpose. Based.
Anonymous
>>11705145 >Jesus' existence is a historical question to be answered by historians. the vast majority of whom accept the preponderance of evidence that he was a historical figure, because it's fucking obvious from the texts that we have received
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>11705138 No but its proof that Saul wanted shekels from goyim. Please find a way to use it in your future arguments friend.
I want to see the Judeoworshipers explain that one lmao
Anonymous
>>11705113 >Source? That is speculation as far as I know. I'm pretty sure that manuscript is not availible Not only is it available but an actual photo of the doctored manuscript is visible in this post
And also right here in this post
Anonymous
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>>11704944 nicely done leaf
Anonymous
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>>11705122 Yes it would be. Because basis of all of it is that we are more then the body.
Anonymous
>>11705134 >Tacitus Was not alive when jesus supposedly lived, neither was josephus or pliny.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 6) Mind was transferred into cyborg body
Think I'm wrong, read the book of Thomas through the lens of transhumanism.
Anonymous
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>>11705139 nobody was present that we know of - it was a gigantic millstone - nobody was moving that without a massive effort.
Anonymous
>>11704952 People have tried by splitting off and starting (protest)ant churches but they get infiltrated by evil and subverted too. We must realize that nothing on this Earth is safe from evil. It must be constantly fought to maintain any control at all. The most important thing I think is to have personal faith and an understanding of what the creator would want and not want.
Anonymous
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>>11705149 Cool graphic. Given the linguistic analysis and obvious references to it in aristotle and others, I think we can safely say that we have received at least fairly good copies
Anonymous
>>11705114 >he's obviously talking about Christ and Christians, the dumb nigger just couldn't spell Possibly he couldn't spell, but what makes you think he is "obviously" talking about Jesus Christ?
Christ is a title, not a name. There were literally hundreds of Jewish faggots walking around claiming to be a messiah, Tacitus could have been writing about any one of them.
Even if he is writing about "our" Jesus, he is just repeating what he heard from Christians, which is what they read in the Gospels, which were in widespread circulation by that time. So it doesn't count as independent evidence for a historical Jesus in any case.
Anonymous
>>11705148 You know that many of them are centrists/leftists who think Yeshuah was just some preacher?
Anonymous
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>>11705151 give me a link, retard. I'm not going to just take your word for it
Anonymous
Didn't the bible say Jesus will return in 2000 years? Hence the end of the world hype in 1999. Nothing happened... Oh but the good goy scholars will know discover a new date that Jesus will return it is okay goys new date still keep strong! When will he actually return? Also I know I am already saved John 3:16 as well as Matthew 20:1 - 20:16. It doesn't matter when you start you can legit repent when Jesus returns from the sky and still be saved.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 kek, board is full of christkike shills recently.
Anonymous
>>11705160 Of course I do. I did history in college, so I am well aware of most historians religious tendencies. However, they don't do what the bong-tard does and outright deny his existence, because thats retarded
Anonymous
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>>11705157 >We must realize that nothing on this Earth is safe from evil. This is exactly what is told in the bible. Even old rituals will be turned into satanic rituals.
Splashing goat blood everywhere as a holy thing would shock most people today and absolutely would turn everyone away from god out of how fear will take an effect on them.
But no. Jews keep fucking cutting penises as something holy worshiping this ritual which is gross and absolutely unholy.
Anonymous
>>11705131 >Pliny the younger, Mentions Christians, but doesn't mention Jesus. The existence of CHristians is not in dispute.
>Josephus No Josephus manuscript before the 4th century mentions Jesus at all, you fucking retard
> and other contemporary texts All of the "contemporary" texts date to at least 150 years after Jesus' supposed death.
>Fuck if you ignorant piece of shit Bitch, I just stated three historical facts that apparently you didn't even know
Sage
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>>11705140 >Plato’s works haven’t survived >his works are known to be unique because they are the few that have survived Wow what a fucking retard
Anonymous
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>>11705112 Movements don't just appear. You can easily say that some of the more extraordinary elements of the story were retconned. Real or not, Homer is an ancient scholarly muse. Jesus is a political dissident, no one ever claimed he wrote anything.
Anonymous
>>11705132 >>“FOR SINCE WE BELIEVE THAT JESUS DIED AND ROSE AGAIN” (1 THESS. 4:14, NRSV) Still doesn't say that any of that happened on Earth.
Anonymous
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>>11705164 >because thats retarded There is little evidence he even existed
Anonymous
>>11705159 >what makes you think he is "obviously" talking about Jesus Christ? the bit about pilate, and the fact that his contemporary pliny corroborates the existence of these abominable creatures known as christians
>They were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food—but food of an ordinary and innocent kind Anonymous
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>>11704944 The behavior of the people in the world then, who interacted with him directly during the life and death of the God-man Jesus Christ points directly to resurrection. Nobody would've suffered what they suffered as ascetics and under torture and death if it were just a con. If they did it for glory and fame after death, which isn't outside the possibilities given the people in question, someone still would've cracked, there would be damning evidence. Even the stuff Jews write comes off as transparently bitter and revisionist. There's too much data, there are too many people involved, Jesus was far too famous in his own time. Some might even say his fame was evidence that it was a con, since it points to a person of extraordinary rhetorical, philosophical, and spiritual power. Hitler is the greatest speaker that exists in the audio record, he inspired the last great stand against the destruction of the West by International Finance, and people still turned on him after and he was about to die.
So what does that say about the personal and divine qualities of the Lord Jesus Christ? Apophatically, it's not hard to conclude couldn't have faked any of that, since so many miracles were so widely known and undisputed among every source there is.
Sage
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>>11705166 >Literally says they sang hymns to Christ as they did to God You are revealing yourself to be a huge mongoloid
Anonymous
>>11705136 >Q material+ Q no longer exists, and may never have existed, so you can't rely on it as evidence for a historical Jesus.
>the source for John Same answer, we don't have it so we can't make arguments using it. The text of John that we have now is most likely nothing like the original version (unlike the other canonical gospels, which are probably broadly the same).
Anonymous
>>11705162 >Didn't the bible say Jesus will return in 2000 years? no
Anonymous
>>11705162 I don't know when will Jesus return, He Himself said not to trust anyone about that, BUT:
>Didn't the bible say Jesus will return in 2000 years? Hence the end of the world hype in 1999. Nothing happened... Jesus died in 33AD. Therefore according to this theory he could come back in 2033AD.
Anonymous
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>>11705141 >Or it's an introduction by Paul himself, which is rhetorically consistent with other documents we have from the time So you say, but it could equally well be an interpolation. SInce there is no way of finding out, one way or the other, you can't use it as evidence for a historical Jesus.
You fucking retard.
Anonymous
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>>11704948 Heretic!
The resurrection proves Jesus Christ is God and has power over death to give everlasting life to all who come to Him.
Anonymous
>>11704944 6) "Yeshua" was an Essene terrorist playing the role of king in exile in contrast to the "illegitimate" Herodian puppet-king, following the pattern of resistance that was used during the Greek occupation of Israel. After the Romans executed him for agitating against their rule, agents such as Saul of Tarsus were implanted in the Essene in order to spread heretical teachings which would soften the views of the Jews toward Roman authority by undermining the ultranationalist character of the Mosaic tradition. These subversives warped the story of "Yeshua's" life to fit a model of a new type of messiah whose influence would pacify the Jewish zealots. At around the same time, Gnostic sects of Judaism picked up the thread of this new version of "Yeshua" and began adding their mysticism to the mix. No longer simply a man anointed by Yahweh, "Yeshua" became a god-man who embodied the Greco-Roman influenced philosophies of the Gnostic Jews. The Gnostics added all of the recognizable miraculous elements to the story of "Yeshua's" life in order to establish a link to divinity and represent their mythic archetypes; they were unconcerned with the true story of the man behind the figure of "Yeshua" and were likely the ones who changed his name to Yeshua in order to forge a mystical link with the Jewish scriptures.
The Essene purists were outnumbered and lacked the resources to protect their narrative from a semi-coordinated assault by Roman agents and Gnostic mythweavers. Further, the zealot forces were nearly exterminated in the revolt and their morale shattered by the destruction of the temple. From this point, only the Sauline and Gnostic cult versions of Yeshua remain. However, these versions, or at least the cults behind them, weren't necessarily compatible.
Anonymous
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>>11705169 >died >was crucified >was born >had anscestors >3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures, 5 and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. >was buried dude, you are seriously stretching this. The preponderance of his words indicates that he wasn't constantly speaking in goofy metaphors
Anonymous
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>>11705174 Book of Thomas bro
Anonymous
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>>11704944 It is religion
It is about faith
If you need to prove it, you don't believe
do you do this to the Odin larpers?
or the "I'm a real witch" lunatics - who we should just burn out of principal?
no you do not.
Anonymous
>>11705143 >nigga what? We have received shit tons of Plato. Nigga, they might be the words of Plato but they're probably the product of some later Platonic school. Plato's original ideas (mostly) but not his own words.
Anonymous
Paganfag here I really want a christian gf, I see it now If I admit the error of my ways can I repent and get a christian gf? How would one go about accomplishing things I ask it here because I didn't see a christianity general and I think other boards here are degenerate. I promise to pump her full of kids if I accomplish this, help a guy out, friends.
Anonymous
>>11705148 >the vast majority of whom accept the preponderance of evidence that he was a historical figure, because it's fucking obvious from the texts that we have received What fucking texts, you untermensch? Gospel of Mark and, errr, that's it.
Anonymous
>>11705183 What evidence do you have of that? Other than speculation.
Sage
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>>11705166 Josephus mentions him in Antiquities in 93 AD. What kind of fucking retard are you?
Anonymous
>>11705171 >>what makes you think he is "obviously" talking about Jesus Christ? >the bit about pilate Oh right, so anyone executed by Pilate MUST have been Jesus Christ. Because Pilate could not possibly have executed any other Jewish trouble-maker, not even once during his entire career.
Fucking someone kill me.
Anonymous
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>>11705176 So in 2033 is when I should be expecting happenings, thanks.
>>11705175 thanks.
Anonymous
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>>11705179 Several hundred years of competing Christian sects followed until a forced consolidation happened under Roman influence due to a need to forge a singular religion from the mess of cults as a desperate attempt at unifying at least a portion of a rapidly disintegrating empire. This consolidation process saw all non-official sects purged violently and their influences minimized or excised. The Gnostic Christian sects were especially targeted even though their influence on the emergent religion was impossible to remove. A New Testament without the Gnostic parts would be essentially be just the letters of Saul and a few scraps of gospel. The consolidation process saw the invention of an official history for the "Church" itself which hid away the turmoil of early Christianity in order to cast the orthodoxy as legitimate beyond question.
Sage
>>11705183 Full blown retard conspiracy status right here
Anonymous
>>11705186 >What evidence do you have of that? Other than speculation. No-one has any evidence either way, do they? It's just a waste of time trying to guess who wrote 2,500-year-old texts and anyway, as I have already mentioned several time, I don't give a shit either way
Anonymous
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>>11705140 Socrates is the lost philosopher you absolute shitskin. You don’t even know what youre talking about
Anonymous
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>>11705184 No, do not believe only to have a girlfriend. You have to honestly think it is true or else you would be living a lie. I am saying this as the OP.
Sage
>>11705188 You are now essentially arguing semantics about a name. If there was a historical figure that spawned the religion and they talk about him then they are effectively the historical Jesus.
The effort you are putting into this bait is exhausting.
Anonymous
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>>11705185 All four gospels, the prepondence of the texts of St Paul (unless you are operating under the assumption that the dude was talking in some crazy fucking metaphor which included people metaphorically getting crucified and buried. Also, Acts, which comes from a second gen source (including talking about "we" doing things) with the apostles. (who were probably, along with Mark, the source for Luke.
Anonymous
Also how come Christianity has been allowed to devolve into this? Compared to Islam where they still hold to traditions.
Anonymous
>>11705188 executed by pilate, in judea, and spawned a movement, which was in rome, and goes by the name chr*st, we know from pliny at the same period there existed a group there known as christians
i don't know how it could be clearer that tacitus just didn't know how to spell it
do you think there was a group of christians and a group of chrestians in rome at that time?
Anonymous
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>>11705142 >Xenophon So two students and a play.. idk not enough sources can’t believe he was a real guy
Anonymous
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>>11705191 >Full blown retard conspiracy status right here Describe the historical techniques and methods you would use to distinguish the writings of a 2500-year-old philosopher from the works of his followers, written in the style of the founding master.
I can't think of any fucking methods but perhaps you, with your gargantuan IQ, can do better.
Anonymous
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Jesus was a necessary consequence of God's injustice towards Job.
Anonymous
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>>11705192 Yeah, most historians and linguists believe that they were written by the same author, and that it was probably Plato. (unlike Aristotle, whose works seem to be a series of lecture notes by a student)
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11705197 Heretics have existed since forever. If anyone reads the Bible, it is clear that things like gay sex are sinful. There's no other way to describe these people.
Anonymous
>>11705195 >If there was a historical figure that spawned the religion and they talk about him then they are effectively the historical Jesus. Yes, but where are these manuscripts describing a historical figure that spawned a religion? We have the Gospel of Mark and, errrrr, that's it. The rest all date from the 180s AD and later.
Sage
>>11705154 But they wrote about him without a doubt of his existence. Who the fuck do you expect to write about Jesus as a contemporary other than his followers you dumb fucking retard?
Anonymous
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>>11705184 >If I admit the error of my ways can I repent and get a christian gf? No one really knows man. Churches say what they want but no one knows. If you were the creator of the universe would you forgive some guy who is trying to use you to get a gf or would you forgive the guy who sees the error of his ways and wants to help people and bring good things to his community and those around him.
I don't think "heaven" or realistically the union of all the souls that have ever existed will exist if "God" loses to "Satan". If humanity doesn't preserve life long enough to figure out how to solve heat death of the universe it will have all been for nothing.
I could be wrong but I imagine the point of fighting for good is that if you don't you lose and everything you hold dear dies.
Anonymous
>>11705203 Catholicism isn't far off. Didn't pope Francis say you can't be a Christian if you're a gun owner recently?
Anonymous
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>>11705197 The lack of prescriptivism in Christianity is why the west as a culture was so successful. The ideological strife that takes place to fill in the blanks that Jesus left was imperative to the enlightenment and everything we value in western society. The degenerates are just a side effect and unless you want to go back to the dark ages and get your shit kicked in by Muslims then you'll have to deal with it.
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>11704969 >its okay guys, THIS time Jews are cool and we can trust them! Anonymous
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>>11705198 >executed by pilate, in judea, and spawned a movement, which was in rome, and goes by the name chr*st, we know from pliny at the same period there existed a group there known as christians Yes, it was definitely Jesus and it definitely could not have been a single one of the other Jewish Messiahs who got themselves executed by the Romans
>do you think there was a group of christians and a group of chrestians in rome at that time? Lol WTF are you talking about. Not only was there definitely a group of "Chrestians" who were nothing to do with the Christians, but the actual early Christians didn't even call themselves Christians until a few decades later
Fuck me this is tiresome
Anonymous
>>11705183 He literally expanded upon the forms argument. Like do you even have any idea of what you’re arguing about. Plato has written works, same as Aristotle. You probably wouldn’t even be able to read Aristotle I’d I’m being honest.
Anonymous
>>11705206 >But they wrote about him without a doubt of his existence Pliny and Josephus never wrote a single word about Jesus, you fucking Christian liar, and Tacitus wrote about someone called Chrestus, which might be a variant spelling of Christ or it might not.
Anonymous
>>11705208 We are in a rough spot currently, not gonna lie, but we haven't embraced full on degeneracy yet (and we won't). Those problems are also unironically Luthers fault too.
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11705203 But Orthodoxy literally practices Idolatry?
>>11705204 But in a normal religion they would be dealt with. These people would not be allowed in Islam they would be beat accordingly.
Anonymous
>>11705210 >>180 s ADWhat's that? You didn't know that the first extra-canonical manuscript describing a historical Jesus were written by Iranaeus in the 180s AD?
Catholic Anon
If you truly seek God then He will reveal himself to you.
Anonymous
>>11705213 Mate, just stop. I don't give a shit whether Plato existed or not. Those Greeks were all retard faggots and the Romans should have genocided the lot of them.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 6.) All made up bullshit to get stupid people to have something to live for.
Anonymous
>>11705215 The Catechism of the Catholic Church is quite conservative in its morals, banning divorce and even contraceptives. I don't know what this Pope is doing but he will be replaced somewhere. I hope you can see why the Orthodox Church views him as an important bishop among equals and not infallible.
Anonymous
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>>11705218 >extra-canonical Anonymous
so what was up with the first part of zeitgeist? did the jews completely rip off horus and the egyptians or is that debunked?
Anonymous
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>>11705219 I was like that I went to seek G*d I feel like he showed himself to me and practiced, but over the course of time it waned. I still believe but he doesn't pull me to him as hard maybe it is because he knows I know he is alive and well?
Anonymous
>>11705217 >But Orthodoxy literally practices Idolatry? It literally doesn't. GTFO iconoclast
Anonymous
>>11705220 Romans were a tiny little city state at the time of Plato you idiot. You’re historically illiterate yet want to debate the existence of Jesus. You’re just a fool
Anonymous
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>>11705216 Ah saw it on pol earlier but didn't check.
>>11705215 >(and we won't) Hopefully..
Anonymous
>>11705217 It's better for Christians not to act like violent animals like in some other faiths...
Anonymous
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>>11705224 It’s complete bullshit.
Anonymous
>>11704944 historical evidence actually shows that "jesus" is a collection of tall tales about several travelling "prophets" in the area at the time. there was no one man named "jesus" like the bible describes.
Anonymous
Anonymous
>>11705222 >I hope you can see why the Orthodox Church views him as an important bishop among equals and not infallible. Papal infallibility is VERY limited, which most people don't understand. It's also why Frank has to toe such a very fine line. Honstly, I feel like it kind of keeps him in check a little bit (if we didn't have it, frankly, we wouldn't care so much about schisming constantly-like orthos do every 50 years during a political conflict)
Anonymous
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>>11705226 Keep doing what you do maybe you will power up sooner or later.
>>11705229 I can see the reason in that if Christians just beat every gay and non-believer we would be no better than some 3rd world civilizations.
Sage
>>11705214 I’m sorry that you are so ignorant, but Josephus mentions Jesus twice in antiquities, once referencing James, the brother of Jesus who is called the messiah.
At this point you should just go back and do more research because you are out of your league.
Anonymous
>>11705227 >Romans were a tiny little city state at the time of Plato you idiot. BItchshow me where in
>>11705220 I state that the Romans were genociding the Greeks at the time Plato was alive.
Anonymous
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>>11704944 The Quran answers this. Chapter 4
[155] (Furthermore, they’re in such a state because) they suppressed (God’s truth), made unfounded accusations against Mary, and boasted, “We killed Jesus, the Messiah, the son of Mary.” However, they didn’t kill him, nor did they crucify him, but it was made to appear to them that they did. [189] Those who argue about it are full of doubts and have no (concrete) information. On the contrary, they only follow theories, for they certainly didn’t kill him. [156-157] Certainly not! God raised (Jesus) up to Himself, for God is powerful and wise. Each of the Followers of Earlier Revelation must believe in (Jesus) before they die, for on the Day of Assembly, (Jesus) will be a witness against them. [158-159]
Anonymous
>>11705233 He also approved of gay civil unions (not marriage) not long ago. Evil exists in the church and clergy as much as in anyone else.
Anonymous
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>>11705235 >I’m sorry that you are so ignorant, but Josephus mentions Jesus twice in antiquities, Mate, I repeat, no Josephus manuscript before the 4th century contains those passages. There are six separate sources attesting to this fact.
You can kvetch all you like, but that won't change the fact that (((Josephus))) wrote about John the Baptist, and about Jesus ben Damneus, but not a single word about Jesus of Nazareth.
Anonymous
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>>11705238 Well, like everything Frank does. He basically said "yeah, thats fine" then "thats not what I meant, lol." He basically lives to muddy the waters.
Anonymous
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>>11705224 Let's put it this way
The Genesis narratives are stolen from Sumerians/Babylonians.
The practice of Gematria and the sacred geometry behind the ark of the covenant and hypothetical temple of Solomon (that never actually existed) were stolen from Egyptian numerology.
The Exodus narrative was made up wholesale during/after the Babylonian captivity.
The gospels of the New Testament and several other books such as Revelation are filled to the brim with Gnostic mysticism which was itself ultimately descended from Egyptian mystery cults through the Greek philosophic tradition.
Just about the entirety of the Bible, OT and NT, is plagiarized fiction.
Anonymous
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>>11705238 >Evil exists in the church and clergy as much as in anyone else. this is true though
Anonymous
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>>11705236 The romans got all of their classical thought and architectural technology from the Greeks you retard even their gods. Why would the romans want to genocide a people they didn’t consider barbarians? However, you made it seem that Rome had the power to genocide them at that time. Not my fault you write like an idiot
Sage
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>>11705231 Source for this absolute retard conspiracy take?
Should be easy to find that historical evidence you speak of
Anonymous
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>>11704944 shut up muslim/jew cunt
Anonymous
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How the fuck is this a baby thread but threads that clearly break the rules are left up for hours lmao o
Anonymous
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Imagine being a christcuck. Now, imagine being a jew-hating /pol/ack. Now, imagine being a jew-hating /pol/ack that worships rabbi yeshua and yahweh. That's christcuckery.