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CRRC, the future?

Anon Thu 02 Aug 2018 12:29:38 No.1220282 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>1220286 >>1220454 >>1220464 >>1220482 >>1220504 >>1220864 >>1227487 >>1232203

As an Australian (white) it is interesting to see more and more CRRC take over in my country. I would be interested to hear others thoughts on what appears to be a worldwide CRRC takeover.

There are stacks of CRRC (and CYR or earlier) freight and ore / coal wagons in AUS and the projects they're winning out from the likes of Bombardier, Siemens, CAF etc. seems to be increasing.

Thoughts?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 02 Aug 2018 13:01:15 No.1220286 Report

Quoted By: >>1220482

>>1220282
CRRC snagged the contract to build all-new fleets for the MBTA in Boston's two busiest heavy rail lines, totalling over 300 trainsets between the two. When the contract was awarded, I thought it was going to be a debacle like Hyundai Rotem was when they built our commuter rail bilevel cars back in 2010-2014.

https://youtu.be/TGBNDnbI96k
https://youtu.be/EqhP3BuzSsk
Right now though, after seeing the units they've delivered, I think that Bombardier, Siemens, Alstom, and Kawasaki all have soem very legitimate reasons to be very afraid right now. CRRC stuff seems like the real deal, and the quality of the trains the T is getting from them rival Bombardier's S Stock on the London underground, which I personally hold as the high-water mark for heavy rail transit hardware.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 02 Aug 2018 23:17:48 No.1220440 Report

Quoted By:

Not a fans of them given the quality of some metro cars they deliver in Hong Kong and also quality of some of their high speed trains especially like CRH6 (Although that's a development over Bombardier's platform)

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Screen-Shot-2017-03-15-at-10.29. (...).png, 949KiB, 1210x706

Anonymous Thu 02 Aug 2018 23:24:49 No.1220442 Report

Quoted By: >>1220504 >>1220789 >>1228311

The LA Metro red and purple lines (our two subway lines) are going CRRC as well. They don't look very exciting.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 02 Aug 2018 23:49:31 No.1220454 Report

Quoted By: >>1223933

>>1220282
Basically nothing but a tool of state power and runs on stolen IP.

>As an Australian (white)

Okay Wumao

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 00:53:45 No.1220464 Report

Quoted By: >>1220468

>>1220282
Dunno, I don't like chinks anything. And they want to build here in Chile high-speed railway between Valparaiso and Santiago (100-ish kms by road, or 160-ish by existing rails, that are used only for cargo).
I just don't trust them. 200 km/h on chink train is scary, considering that there will be no chink government and they will chink everywhere.
And yeah, I don't think that chinks have that much mountains and hills...

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 00:55:22 No.1220468 Report

Quoted By: >>1220472

>>1220464
There are many mountains in Western China.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 01:05:18 No.1220472 Report

Quoted By: >>1220753 >>1231793

>>1220468
But do they have railroads though them?
Anyway, there chinks were afraid of government, and here (or anywhere outside the china) they'll chink.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 01:39:51 No.1220482 Report

Quoted By: >>1220497 >>1220506 >>1220540

>>1220282
As a Western European I had to look up what CRRC was, so I think a worldwide CRRC takeover isn't gonna happen anytime soon. But them getting a lot of orders from Australia/America doesn't have to end in a debacle.

Chinese manufacturing has changed a lot in recent years. The cheap copies of western products they made in the past have been developed further into higher quality things that have actually become nice products of themselfs. Basically, their 'stealing and reproducing until we know how to do it' strategy is paying off pretty well. Chinese subway systems are maturing as well, new lines are no longer being built as soulless copies of western metro lines, but have their own style with lots of chinese decorations and stuff.

Honestly, with the amount of rail development going on in China right now, it's pretty much certain Chinese rolling stock manufacturers will get very good at it sooner or later. >>1220286
looks like a very nice train set. Looking forward to what is to come.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 02:18:14 No.1220497 Report

Quoted By: >>1220502

>>1220482
>with lots of Chinese decorations and stuff

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 02:31:32 No.1220502 Report

Quoted By: >>1220513

>>1220497
Eww...
This is even more uglier than 81-760s.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 02:37:39 No.1220504 Report

Quoted By: >>1224103 >>1224370

>>1220282

Their vehicles are neither Buy America nor FRA compliant so they can't be used in America, and this was before the tariffs began. Their attempt at building a HSR line between Las Vegas and Air China's proposed Mojave Airport both fell through due to the feds telling them they wouldn't be able to get reduced rate loans.

>>1220442

It remains to be seen how much of that order goes through with Trump. The MBTA already has problems with their CRRC cars anyway, and most of the LACMTA's expansion is with light rail vehicles that are made by Siemens outside Sacramento.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 02:38:56 No.1220506 Report

Quoted By: >>1220630

>>1220482

>The cheap copies of western products they made in the past have been developed further into higher quality things that have actually become nice products of themselfs.

Not really, this is a meme produced by China's state owned media to try and justify their shit knockoff phones and electronics exploding/melting/causing fires.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 03:20:42 No.1220513 Report

Quoted By: >>1220527

>>1220502
All the text in the photo are slogans used to promote thoughts of current Chinese president

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 04:29:28 No.1220527 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220513
Somewhat similar to some trains in Moscow subway...Dunno

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 06:11:06 No.1220540 Report

Quoted By: >>1220630 >>1223933

>>1220482
>As a Western European

Jesus fucking christ stop fucking lying you propaganda-spreading scum

Western European my ass, I hope the endless pollution in China kills you and your family

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 13:19:29 No.1220630 Report

Quoted By: >>1220640

>>1220506
I don't think it's entirely a meme. A LOT of shit is still being produced but overall quality is going up. What bothers me is that the chinese including their state-owned media try to glorify their stealing as some kind of 'life-style' with ridiculous robin hood talk about stealing from the rich evil companies and giving it for free to the poor. If your entire economy was built by stealing from another culture than at least give them the fucking credit and maybe say..sorry?

>>1220540
>Jesus fucking christ stop fucking lying you propaganda-spreading scum
I guess that's your way of saying 'As an American'
The only reason I said it like that was to meme the 'Australian (white)' OP you total fucking autist. Anyway, what I meant to say is that CRRC is completely irrelevant here and probably won't stand a chance because all Western European rail operators have a decades long history with Siemens, Alstom, Caf, Bombardier, etc. The only reason CRRC has any success in murica and australia is because those countries don't have a decent rolling stock industry of themselfs so trains have to be imported from overseas anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 13:52:14 No.1220640 Report

Quoted By: >>1220661 >>1220688

>>1220630
CRRC will basically be to rail what Japanese cars were to the global auto industry. CRRC will sell trains like hotcakes in places like the USA, Canada, AUS, and Latin America, because none of them have any significant domestic rolling stock manufacturing capacity of their own, just as Japanese car brands took those markets by storm. Japanese cars, otoh, are a relative bit player in most of Europe, as the domestic competition is so strong that most countries have their own indigenous competitors. The same rings true with rail, and CRRC will likely be a bit player in Europe, largely unable to compete with Alstom, CAF, Siemens, ABB, whatever Breda is now, and Adtranz/Bombardier, though I'll bet they'll sell a few trainsets here or there in markets like the UK or The Netherlands that don't have their own local manufacturer.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 15:54:01 No.1220661 Report

Quoted By: >>1220684

>>1220640
It depends on quality. If those trains will be shit - they will not buy more.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 17:08:17 No.1220684 Report

Quoted By: >>1220731 >>1220747

>>1220661
Not true. Breda hasn't had a successful order in decades and they still get contracts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 17:16:04 No.1220688 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220640
>though I'll bet they'll sell a few trainsets here or there in markets like the UK or The Netherlands that don't have their own local manufacturer.
The UK might be an exception because of the brexit and other less-european orientation, but I don't see any of the other european countries without their own manufacturer go for trains from overseas, because the best manufacturers in the world are around the corner. Some countries not having their own manufacturer anymore is a result of the European rolling stock market being european focused for a very long time, and many manufacturers not being able to keep up with the competition from neighbouring countries. The Netherlands for example, used to have 2 glorious rolling stock factories called Beijnes and Werkspoor, but in the 50s the Dutch Railways decided to buy trains from Talbot in Aachen, Germany, only a few kilomtres away from the Dutch border, which in the europe-wide decreasing demand for rolling stock was enough to kill Beijnes and eventually Werkspoor too. In the end the European rolling stock market wasn't big enough to support 50+ manufacturers even if they were close by, so an outsider has to deliver something damn good to get in at this point.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 20:08:42 No.1220731 Report

Quoted By: >>1220732

>>1220684
Yeah, that guy clearly has no clue about low-bid contracts and how they work in the US.

Stateside, you could honestly say the same thing about CAF as you did with Breda, given how their Amtrak order debacle is going.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 20:10:17 No.1220732 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220731
Honestly, given just how hard of a time everyone seems to be having building Amtrak hardware, I'm surprised someone hasn't bought the IP and tried to resurrect Budd. If you could get Trump behind it, it could work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 21:01:31 No.1220747 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220684
There are two sides to Breda - the signalling and the rolling stock. From what I can tell the signalling is actually a pretty good product, and now the rolling stock has been bought by Hitachi and the Italian retardation should be foiled somewhat by the pure autism of the new Japanese management.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 21:54:45 No.1220753 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220472
China's exports are far higher in quality than their domestic counterparts because they don't want their deals and contracts to be withdrawn, so there's not much to be worried about.
China has quite a lot of HSR lines in Sichuan, which is a somewhat of a mountainous province.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 03 Aug 2018 23:43:17 No.1220789 Report

Quoted By: >>1220836 >>1220864

>>1220442
At least CRRC make a modern interpretation of the classic styling instead of cobbling together some forgettable piece of shit like the new BART stock.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 04 Aug 2018 02:40:56 No.1220836 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220789
The new BART cars are fucking abominations. Ditto for the new Kawasaki WMATA cars.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 04 Aug 2018 04:21:29 No.1220864 Report

Quoted By: >>1221463

>>1220789
lol
>>1220282
https://www.enotrans.org/article/senate-agrees-to-one-year-ban-on-transit-rail-car-and-bus-procurements-from-chinese-owned-companies/

Bye felicia

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Aug 2018 20:56:18 No.1221463 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220864
>Bus
I heard that in many American cities they're now buying BYD trains?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 12 Aug 2018 04:22:52 No.1223933 Report

Quoted By: >>1223977

>>1220540
>>1220454
you have to be seriously fucked in the head to think that there are chinese communists shilling on /n/ of all places.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 12 Aug 2018 08:05:24 No.1223977 Report

Quoted By: >>1227662

>>1223933
There are. Because those alt-right on 4chan are similar to some rather mainstream politic view in China, so that attracted quite a few people from China to browse the site, and some of them would obviously go around and visit different boards and made posts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 12 Aug 2018 13:35:19 No.1224103 Report

Quoted By: >>1224115

>>1220504
They are buy American dumbass as the factory is in Springfield MA

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 12 Aug 2018 13:59:27 No.1224115 Report

Quoted By:

>>1224103

Not when they use mostly imported materials. This is exactly why they are impacted by Trump's latest tariff schedule that prevents them from importing cheap electric motors and microcontrollers from China, which will either raise the costs of their vehicle to the western price or simply cause them to suspend operations. Hence why cities who buy CRRC are asking Trump for tariff waivers (which obviously isn't going to happen). The only thing Trump isn't taxing is the carbodies themselves but I suspect he'll get to this eventually.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 13 Aug 2018 03:12:36 No.1224370 Report

Quoted By: >>1224877

>>1220504
>LACMTA's expansion is with light rail vehicles that are made by Siemens outside Sacramento.

Actually most of those are being replaced by Kinkisharyo trains, which afaik are built in Palmdale. On that note it's kind of a shame that all the new development is light rail, it'd be pretty cool if they went heavy and stuck with Japanese companies so we'd get something similar to JR trains running around LA.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 14 Aug 2018 02:18:12 No.1224877 Report

Quoted By:

>>1224370

You're right, I was thinking of the Metrolink expansions penned by CHSRA. Those will probably use refurb'd Bombardiers for quite a quite a while though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Aug 2018 19:04:35 No.1226851 Report

Quoted By:

Some CRRC high speed trains based on ICE (including some of those "self-innovated models") seems to be encountering some operational overheat problem on the Xian-Chengdu rail line. Is this a problem that also exists on the original ICE trains?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO download.jpg, 6KiB, 299x168

Anonymous Mon 20 Aug 2018 04:20:13 No.1227487 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220282
>can't take over our trains
>if there are no trains to take over

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 20 Aug 2018 12:56:29 No.1227621 Report

Quoted By:

The only ever appeal of buying CHINK will be their comparative advantage in price.

They lack the ethics to make a legitimately well developed and tested product.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 20 Aug 2018 15:06:07 No.1227662 Report

Quoted By: >>1227748 >>1230680

>>1223977
Google is blocked in China, so the only way to bypass Google's captcha is to buy a pass, but why would anyone from China give money to a jap just to shill on a Sudanese circumcision forum?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 20 Aug 2018 18:27:12 No.1227748 Report

Quoted By: >>1228778

>>1227662
There are enough Chinese people staying overseas and also enough Chinese people that are rich enough that the 4chan premium membership fee mean nothing to them

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 21 Aug 2018 15:53:34 No.1228217 Report

Quoted By: >>1228300 >>1231798

Sure, if people want to help China totally dominate the train market, then buy their trains.
They are already the biggest train producer wordwide.
But don't whine about lost jobs, technology and skills when China is flooding the market with only their products then.

I would never let chinese companies buy western companies and get knowledge of "our" technologies.

In about 20 to 30 years (if nothing really changes) the chinks will totally dominate in every single sector and we are doomed to be the consumers. That this can't work in the long run doesn't need a rocket scientist to confirm.

With almost no national production left in the western countries, China will most likely force us to take loans from them to buy their products. When payment day is on the table, they will claim entire countries. Their military forces will help them to put that into reality if resistance is to await.

With China we woke up a monster, that we should have better let sleep.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 21 Aug 2018 18:41:59 No.1228300 Report

Quoted By:

>>1228217
This never would have happened if the eternal anglos weren't so keen on drug dealing.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 21 Aug 2018 19:25:37 No.1228311 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220442
>CRRC
>not buying bombardier
wtf

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 22 Aug 2018 21:17:11 No.1228778 Report

Quoted By: >>1228797

>>1227748
So as the opinion that China actually has good products, and not being paid by the party? Not the implication... But then it's anyone who thinks that, that's the whole point. You can be European or White Australian and support Chinese products.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 22 Aug 2018 22:56:31 No.1228797 Report

Quoted By:

>>1228778
Nuanced opinions aren't allowed here shill.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Aug 2018 08:11:03 No.1228903 Report

Quoted By:

Ah, seems like the Hainan tunnel proposal have been submitted to national authority for approval

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 26 Aug 2018 09:53:41 No.1229983 Report

Quoted By: >>1232687

New double decker high speed train demo unit by CRRC

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 28 Aug 2018 05:12:22 No.1230680 Report

Quoted By:

>>1227662
See what lead to the poster say >>>/biz/10844063 in that thread

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 31 Aug 2018 00:45:57 No.1231793 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220472
Chinese really love tunnelling through mountains. A lot of the world's longest tunnnels are in China.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 31 Aug 2018 01:01:21 No.1231798 Report

Quoted By: >>1231987 >>1232245

>>1228217
Countries like Australia are already lacking the manufacturing knowhow to build their own trains. Next they are thinking of moving onto rapid transit trains. Since Australia can't build it's own, or too cheap to do that, might as well buy from the Chinese.

Ideally they'd get smart and implement a technology transfer quid pro quo on China similar to what they did when speeding up the development of their native train production but hey, Australian politicians and middle management are not known for being smart.

>never let chinese companies buy western companies and get knowledge of "our" technologies.
Already happened.

>about 20 to 30 years
This post reminds me of that time they predicted the 2014 Hong Kong protests would lead to mass deaths, chaos and the coming of the Devil himself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 31 Aug 2018 15:10:06 No.1231987 Report

Quoted By: >>1232142

>>1231798
But the thing is, I would say that Australia does have the capacity to build their own rolling stock. We have Bombardier, Downer and UGL rail plants across the country. Additionally, there is no lack of skilled manufacturing workers from the recently deceased automotive industry.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 31 Aug 2018 22:53:36 No.1232142 Report

Quoted By:

>>1231987
Unfortunately with the state of the price of labour in Australia, I think our pollies are too stingy to buy rolling stock from local manufacturers. And we really don't have local experience, we'd need to build it up. Again that's something I doubt our pollies will see as a wise investment over buying dirt cheap from China.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 01 Sep 2018 02:41:40 No.1232203 Report

Quoted By:

>>1220282
i don't know.
we have train manufacturer that could cheaply produce "anything you wanted" as long as it had no more than 6 traction motors.
and guess what?
anything they produce is a piece of shit. i mean sure it's a step forward, but you can still hear this mind raping whine and over 65mph it rattles like it wants to tore itself apart.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 01 Sep 2018 05:52:15 No.1232245 Report

Quoted By:

>>1231798
>when you want to vote someone with management experience to run the public sector but they're all businessmen that just try to deregulate and lower taxes to line their own private sector pockets

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 02 Sep 2018 12:54:22 No.1232687 Report

Quoted By: >>1232693

>>1229983

its width dimensions are... interesting. I wonder where they put all the electric motors since the top is quite flat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 02 Sep 2018 13:25:30 No.1232693 Report

Quoted By:

>>1232687
Looking at the photo ... maybe the area between two train cars..?

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