/out/ - Outdoors » Thread #565370

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Anonymous Sun 02 Aug 2015 23:33:27 No.565370 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>565385 >>565692 >>565747 >>565759 >>566423 >>567044 >>567126 >>567971 >>568537 >>568936 >>570457 >>570595 >>570604

ITT: Surviving the apocalypse

Explain your choices why? how? etc.

Food: canned sardines
Why? They are good for 200+ years after packing. Honey
Why? doesnt spoil, it lasts forever.

Drinks: jack daniels.

Clothing: anything warm, i am heading north into the mountains.

Equipment: knee pads made from steep, hiking boots with spikes that come on/off, army helmet, coat for cozy warmth, large backpack, bayonet knife, flint and steel, watch, map, oil lamp (oil probably from animals i kill?), cooking pot, 300 meters of rope.

Transportation: anything

Shelter: nice mountain cave, which i can customize.

Weapons: shotgun, sniper rifle.

Btw does any of you guys ever think about these kind of stuff. Goverments around the world shut down and it is every man for himself.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 00:01:38 No.565385 Report

Quoted By: >>565390 >>565393

>>565370
difficult to decide when I consider the likelihood of this scenario includes eventually being forced to travel on foot and only able to keep or bring with me what i can carry in a backpack.
maybe i could use a mountain bike but it would need to be maintained. Fix flats, air up tires. Same thing for the possible dual sport motorcycle option. needs maintenance and fuel.
long term apocalypse scenario probably will be on foot and thus limited to a backpack full of precious few items and limited weight carrying ability.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 00:18:02 No.565390 Report

Quoted By:

>>565385
>long term apocalypse scenario probably will be on foot

Well, on somebody's feet at least.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 00:19:31 No.565393 Report

Quoted By: >>565673

>>565385
>long term apocalypse scenario probably will be on foot

Well, on somebody's feet at least.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 11:58:22 No.565673 Report

Quoted By: >>565701

>>565393
>horses leg breaks

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 12:17:24 No.565675 Report

Quoted By: >>565731 >>567073

At the first sign of suspicious apocalyptic what-not I would go armed to the teeth to the supermarket and grab all and I mean All of the canned shit, medication....I would recruit people and then we would travel together in convoy to a secret location....

>mfw people are waiting at home watching the news while I am perched on top of a supermarket waiting for the initial spark

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 13:14:26 No.565681 Report

Quoted By:

The most important thing is joining a reliable group of people.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 13:57:15 No.565692 Report

Quoted By: >>569913

>>565370
Rule A: Be afraid of every other person.
Rule B: Trust no one.
Rule C: Avoid the risk of getting injured/sick.
Rule D: Prioritize everything.
Rule E: Don't let fear to affect your thinking.

Don't be naïve and stupid! That's my plan.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 14:13:08 No.565696 Report

Quoted By: >>565717

id probably just hang myself

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 14:19:37 No.565701 Report

Quoted By: >>567919

>>565673
>Oh no! I'm stuck with dozens of kilos of easily preparable and edible meat in a survival situation! The horror!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 15:05:15 No.565717 Report

Quoted By: >>567120

>>565696
>id probably just hang myself
Well that's a great plan, anon.

You're just another one of the 99.9 percent who think it's impossible anything bad will ever happen. The truth is, if something actually happens, you won't be there hanging yourself.

If you were to hang yourself then, you would do it now and not wait the apocalypse.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 15:12:13 No.565719 Report

Quoted By: >>565724

>ITT: Dying a horrific death in the apocalypse
Fix'd that for you OP

Why do preppers always think THEY'RE one of the marginal few that will actually survive?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 15:26:26 No.565724 Report

Quoted By: >>565739

>>565719
>Why do preppers always think THEY'RE one of the marginal few that will actually survive?

Why do you think they do? Surviving an apocalypse is not like a lottery. If it was, a prepper would have 10 000 tickets against your one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 15:38:50 No.565731 Report

Quoted By:

>>565675
That shit's not easy. Everyone else will be doing the same too. Get prepared now, at least partially. Food and first aid are easy to stock up on, and you can rely on it if you get laid off or evicted or during a storm.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 15:48:19 No.565739 Report

Quoted By: >>565745

>>565724
>Surviving an apocalypse is not like a lottery.
That's exactly what it is. Unless you own a sizeable amount of private land that's well stocked with the means of defense and are planning on bugging in then it's a bit more secure and foreseeable. But even that will require some luck. Bugging out, however, is a lot more flimsy of a plan and will require mad amounts of luck to survive. Of course, being well prepared with important skills and equipment will put you ahead of 99% of people. But you're still at the whim of an entirely unpredictable and unstable situation.

I live in a highly urban area on a small island with a population density of 662/square mile and very few natural resources. Realistically, I'm gonna die in a societal collapse scenario no matter how much planning preparing and stocking I do. Other people in different situations will fair better.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 16:16:06 No.565745 Report

Quoted By: >>565756

>>565739
>I live in a highly urban area on a small island with a population density of 662/square mile and very few natural resources. Realistically, I'm gonna die in a societal collapse scenario no matter how much planning preparing and stocking I do.

Only if you have to 'live off the land', but that's not realistic, that's fantasy. If you have water and some food to last you one week, that means you don't have to go out to the streets for a week. You're not stading in a line begging for water when a riot or a shootout breaks out.

The law and order will be established sooner or later. It may be a foreign country or what is left of local gangs, but what's important is that you're still alive.

Densily populated areas are the ones that receive help first and since all the roads are most likely blocked, people outside may be the ones on their own.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 16:24:53 No.565747 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
I have a good group of friends, all within walking distance. We have some loose apocalypse plans. We're on an island and one guy actually has a plan to take over the draw bridge. Fuck that going-on-the-road shit, I'm staying here. My island has everything it needs to sustain most of its inhabitants. Starting with a dedicated group of friends, I think we can get the whole Island (4,000 people or so) to work together and survive as a community; fishermen helping farmers helping ranchers. And we have homemade wines and moonshine. Hopefully I'm not being to idealistic. Most people on the island are nice people who know how to survive and look out for their neighbors.

In my house I have enough food and water for 2 people for 8 days. Whenever canned food is on sale, or pasta is buy one get on free I throw the extras in my supply stores. Beans, rice, pasta, freeze dried and MREs. Variety to keep it interesting. 3 buckets with lids hold the food, first aid supplies, maps and other stuff. Also have a garden, and know several farmers nearby. There's also plenty of woods for foraging wild edibles.

Guns, ammo, bows, arrows, knives, machetes, you name it, I have it and know how to use it. Weapons of choice: .243 hunting rifle, 357 revolver and a tomahawk, but would rely on on my recurve bow mostly for stealth and reusable arrows. Also have bikes and a sailboat, neighbors have horses.

My plan is to throw my important shit in my truck, haul ass to my meeting place (less than a mile away) and get sweet fortress built. Anything non-essential will be secured at my house so its there if I need it. I have multiple strategic locations on the island for fishing, trapping, oysters, clams, coconuts, hogs and wild edibles. A continuing steady food source is key to long term survival and trapping is the easiest. I have crab traps and a hog trap that would be set ASAP.

Couldn't upload a picture... I'll try again later

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 16:51:03 No.565756 Report

Quoted By: >>570373

>>565745
I'm pretty sure an Apocalypse level event isn't going to be over in one week. Even the aftermath of Katrina or Japan's Tsunami wasn't over in one week. From the OP:
>Goverments around the world shut down and it is every man for himself.

This is a complete societal breakdown scenario. Once your 2-3 months of stocked food runs out and the stores have been left bare (72hrs) then you will be relying upon natural resources for the foreseeable future. Although, admittedly, after the initial 2-3 months of chaos and the mass extinction things will settle down and become marginally easier. Which is why it's always more sensible to bug in than out.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 03 Aug 2015 17:01:01 No.565759 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
>Canned food
>Lasts for a long time

Until you drop it and it becomes oxidized on the inside.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 15:00:22 No.566392 Report

Quoted By:

I live in a a ghetto suburb of Atlanta and in a shtf scenario the nignogs in my area would be out of control and it would be extremely dangerous to travel far. I would move to a nearby location and bug in for a month or two. There's an abundance of deer where I live that would last a while and anearby nature reserve with a natural spring that has potable water that nobody would think of very close to my bug in location. After about 2 months when most people are dead, I would put some resources together to either make a stand where I live or head somewhere more wild. Even with all this planning I know the odds are against me and it's likely I would die.

Dræfend

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Dræfend Tue 04 Aug 2015 15:28:23 No.566399 Report

Quoted By: >>567057

>have canned food already
>have bows, swords, knives, axes, molotov cocktails, explosives, weapons, etc and air rifle
>Have wide knowledge of primitive skills

At the FIRST sign of shtf I would drive up to lake district or northumberland with my gear and chickens and live off the land (and hopefully recruit other people).

To deter raiders or marauders from raiding I would use guerilla warfare, eg: punji pits, ambushes, landmines, etc

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 15:37:57 No.566403 Report

Quoted By: >>566406

Im fairly well prepared for the situation.
I have a bug out bag that Ive prepared for about a year now as a last resort and plenty of water and food for years to come.

The question I ask is when it will happen, Im putting my money down for lateish september
around the 23rd.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 15:42:14 No.566406 Report

Quoted By: >>566412 >>567375

>>566403
Why does everybody keep said September?
>Inb4 Jadehelm

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 16:00:15 No.566412 Report

Quoted By: >>566413 >>566502 >>568959

>>566406
Most /x/ people will say its planet 7x colliding with earth which is bull shit doomsday cuck, However the greek government is collapsing and its going to pull the entire EU down with them
one southern Europe country at a time. this along with the chinese GDP steadily dropping along with Jade helm and the increased measures to counter terrorism before it happens
Aka imprison innocent edgy people. All of these things are following a trend that will climax this fall and thats why were preparing

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 16:01:17 No.566413 Report

Quoted By:

>>566412
America will be left the most well off however it will be near collapse until either racial tensions pull it down or some other bullshit.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 16:14:28 No.566423 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
>Honey
>Why? doesnt spoil, it lasts forever.
thats not true, my honey nut cheerios have an expiry date.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 17:42:55 No.566501 Report

Quoted By:

This depends entirely on your scenario. What kind of apocalypse are you thinking about?

A nuclear war is a massively devastating event. There will be only about 15 minutes warning, and that's assuming the government decides to sound the alarm at all. Then there's flash, blast, and heat. The psi your shelter can handle is critical, as is making sure you aren't sheltered near a likely target. Fallout for a few days. Then it's over. You come out to find a devastated landscape and environment, and possibly nuclear winter. But the nuclear event itself is pretty brief. Huge numbers of dead in the initial exchange, more from radiation and civil disruption. You can't count on any infrastructure at all surviving.

At the other end of the spectrum, you have an economic collapse. Everybody survives at first. If other collapses are a guide, then the military and law enforcement will be controlled by an increasingly desperate and corrupt government. Surviving requires co-existing with your neighbors and local government, and you want to avoid becoming a target for confiscation. The disaster takes years to play out, even though most infrastructure survives.

A Carrington event is a middle ground. Most technological infrastructure is destroyed, but nobody dies and they're all hungry. So it's like an economic collapse in a way, but more sudden. Same with a pandemic, except that here you can't trust your neighbors because they might be CONTAGIOUS. In a pandemic, I'd want to be in my stronghold innawoods, but in an economic collapse that's like painting a giant "confiscate me" sign on my property. And my nuclear bunker isn't much use against either situation.

So which version of the apocalypse you anticipate is important. If you're going to be generically prepared, then create a master plan around the most likely scenario and then run yourself through alternate scenarios and ask yourself what changes.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 17:43:27 No.566502 Report

Quoted By: >>566556 >>567062 >>569047

>>566412
Damn son you're dumb. First of all America has an independent currency not the bullshit euro. Second the Greece crisis it's contained for the next years. Third the other southern euro countries are actually paying their debts and improving their economy. No financial collapse will happen in the years to come.

The risks are like always natural disasters, terrorism and racial tensions which can escalate to some big ass riots. Being prepared it's really important but tbh I don't see a major happening to really happen in the horizon

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Aug 2015 19:04:37 No.566556 Report

Quoted By:

>>566502
>your tinfoil hat is the sux0rs
>my tinfoil hat is teh r0x0rs

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 11:15:02 No.567044 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
Once surviving for a while would you recommend making your permanent home in the city, in the rural farm areas, in forests or near a stream or lake?
I live in an area which is surrounded by all of these except it is freezing/cold most of the year but scorching hot for a month or so in summer

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 12:10:54 No.567057 Report

Quoted By: >>568323

>>566399
> yfw you step in your own pit or a landmine
How are you gonna know where exacrtly the traps are?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 12:50:25 No.567062 Report

Quoted By: >>567085 >>568332 >>568447 >>570330

>>566502
>No financial collapse will happen in the years to come.
The naïvety. You can't keep kicking the can down the road indefinitely without consequences.

Growth rates around the World remain minimal. Governments around the World are doing their utmost to move away from the Dollar as the reserve currency as quickly as they can. If that actually happens, the US is done. Governments around the World are repatriating their Gold or buying as much new Gold as they can. China is currently tanking. The Eurozone is still on life support. All that bailout money has been put into the stock market and balance sheets of investment banks, inflating a colossal bubble waiting to pop. There's still the 100's of Trillions of derivatives market stacked like a house of cards waiting to tumble down. Private debt is at an all time high. All major Governments of the World are inundated with colossal debt that will never be paid back. Sooner or later interest rates WILL rise.

The 2008 crisis was a de facto economic collapse. It was "solved" with the band-aid solution of injecting Trillions into the system. The underlying systemic problems that caused the collapse still remain and whilst it has the appearance of being fixed, literally nothing was fixed. In fact, the problem has been compounded and made worse. Meaning, the next collapse will be even more painful.

>other southern euro countries are actually paying their debts
No country is paying their debts. They're servicing the interest payments on the debts. The overall debt is still increasing. Very few countries operate a surplus:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_budget_by_country

>TL;DR you can't keep expanding debt indefinitely and think things will be fine.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 13:39:31 No.567073 Report

Quoted By:

>>565675
In what situation is this possible?
If it catches people off guard then there will still likely be police or invading military forces that will take out any crazy people claiming to be king of Walmart.
If it's a slow decent into lawlessness there will be nothing left in stores, panic buying or riots will empty it before you realize your time has come

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 13:54:41 No.567079 Report

Quoted By:

When the end comes:

Everything becomes food. Birds, Rats, bugs...

Everyone not family becomes the enemy, who is going to take what you have

Canned provisions will go first, then you're going to run out of ammo, then shoes and protective gear. Plan accordingly.

Learn how to basically survive now. The only way to survive long term after the end will be communal living.

Protected villages will crop up. those who have something to add to the group will be allowed in. Dead weight will not. The communes that allow any and all to come in will be overburdened with the dead weight and will fail

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 14:08:02 No.567085 Report

Quoted By:

>>567062
This, all fucking this

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 15:41:53 No.567120 Report

Quoted By:

>>565717
>max autism

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 15:51:35 No.567126 Report

Quoted By: >>567732

>>565370
>travel to my grandparents manor with whatever (70km from me)
>out on the country side
>family will probably be there so 35+
>600 acres of land
>good farm land
>4 giant fishing lakes
>Wood for a lifetime
>big Wine cellar

Gonna be like a vacation

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 05 Aug 2015 22:50:16 No.567375 Report

Quoted By:

>>566406
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkELgi6EkNo

Although in reality it'll probably be like 2012 all over again. Nothing happens, people make excuses and then move onto the next big happening date.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 02:07:13 No.567510 Report

Quoted By:

I shall head into the everglades and live among the gators and mosquitoes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 03:27:16 No.567555 Report

Quoted By:

>I shall head into the everglades and live among the gators and mosquitoes.

Shit, that was my plan.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 10:12:14 No.567732 Report

Quoted By: >>567754 >>568084

>>567126
good luck defending that from a starving population

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 11:58:00 No.567754 Report

Quoted By:

>>567732
Its gonna be easy as fuck. Moat around ~70% of the main buildings. Rest is open courtyard with 3 entry points. Easy to defend. The main house got a clock tower where someone can scout from

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 19:36:21 No.567919 Report

Quoted By:

>>565701
What if its a situation where you need to be bookin' it out if there? Better just learn to rely on the shoelace express.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 06 Aug 2015 21:07:54 No.567971 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370

Stupid, over done thread.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 01:26:01 No.568084 Report

Quoted By:

>>567732
From examples of local shtf like new Orleans and Homestead after hurricanes and the like, people will starve in place.

Dræfend

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Dræfend Fri 07 Aug 2015 13:59:34 No.568323 Report

Quoted By:

>>567057
Remembering where they are, signs that only my "tribe" would know (a split oak branch hanging off a tree for example).

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 14:22:29 No.568332 Report

Quoted By:

>>567062
this, when the bubble pops it's gonna be a goat rodeo of riots, looting, and self-destruction.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 18:53:19 No.568447 Report

Quoted By: >>568550

>>567062

Literally written by a twelve year old.
4/10 made me rustled

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 21:30:44 No.568505 Report

Quoted By:

I live in North Carolina in a mid sized city outside of Charlotte. When Hurricane Hugo came through in '89, we got a slight taste of disaster. You couldn't drive around for several days (downed trees everywhere). No power for a week to 10 days.
My camping equipment came in very handy. I was able to heat hot water each morning for all the neighbors. Standing in line for ice was the main activity each day.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 23:05:16 No.568537 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
The Apocalypse is the end of the world. You does not survive it, you die. You enter the afterlife like everyone else, and according to Christian mysticism, if you accepted the Zombie as your lord and savior you can live in Paradise.

You probably just meant "how to survive after an earthquake", but then, 99,9% of the people are not going to die.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 23:40:17 No.568550 Report

Quoted By: >>568566

>>568447
Nice counter arguments.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 23:41:32 No.568551 Report

Quoted By: >>568557 >>568566

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 23:42:57 No.568553 Report

Quoted By: >>568843

But that's fine, keep living your life in ignorance.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 07 Aug 2015 23:54:22 No.568557 Report

Quoted By: >>568559

>>568551
So, $US1 is now worth $US0.10?
How does that work?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 00:08:25 No.568559 Report

Quoted By:

>>568557
buying power decreasees due to inflation. a coke used to be a shiny nickel and now it's a nearly two paper dolla'

https://youtu.be/pk9IMyP85Ko

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 00:32:11 No.568566 Report

Quoted By: >>568569

>>568551
>>568550
You do know these two graphic counter each other for your argument.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 00:44:25 No.568569 Report

Quoted By: >>568836

>>568566
Please do explain why.

As the monetary base expands and debt increases, like that other anon said, inflation results. This reduces the purchasing power of the dollar and thus it's value decreases. I don't see how that's contradictory.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:01:28 No.568836 Report

Quoted By: >>568840 >>568841 >>568846 >>569979

>>568569
Well, according to the graphs, the national debt in 1947 was about 5 trillion in 1947 dollars. That would be 50 trillion in 2008 dollars according to the other graph.

According to the red graph the 2008 debt was about 10 trillion in 2008 dollars, so 1 trillion in 1947 dollars.

Sounds like things are getting better regardless of which way you look at it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:27:47 No.568840 Report

Quoted By:

>>568836
>Debt 1947: Under 500 Billion
>Debt 2015: Over 18 Trillion
>Getting better

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:28:59 No.568841 Report

Quoted By: >>568879

>>568836
capitalism isn't going to survive as automation takes over and we begin to reach a resource-based economy. as specialized machines get better and more versatile, fewer and fewer humans will be in any way necessary in the workforce, and there isn't anything in place in the US to support them during the transition to post-capitalism. the absolute best band-aid would be a universal basic income, but despite experiments showing how fantastically successful it is, the concept is totally against mainstream american values & is likely to be rejected in favor of bullshit government-sponsored busy work programs
now, i can't guarantee that this situation would get bad enough to require bugging out/in in every region, but the fact that it'll happen and be pretty rocky for quite awhile is inevitable

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:30:23 No.568843 Report

Quoted By: >>568849

>>568553
Citing the Von Mises Institute destroys any illusion you might've had of knowing what you're talking about. They are pseudoscientists and bullshit artists.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:35:03 No.568846 Report

Quoted By: >>569979

>>568836
If you want a better way to visualize the debt, how about debt as a percentage of GDP?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 11:39:56 No.568849 Report

Quoted By:

>>568843
So use any other metric of money supply then, whichever way you look at it, it's expanding.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 13:16:50 No.568879 Report

Quoted By: >>568917

>>568841
eat shit commie shill
>>>/reddit/

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 15:15:55 No.568917 Report

Quoted By: >>570342

>>568879
>anyone who pays attention to the path of technological progress is a communist

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 16:00:57 No.568936 Report

Quoted By:

>>565370
a 500 people agricultural community in a wider net of similar villages who work together to defend themselves.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 17:08:11 No.568959 Report

Quoted By:

>>566412
>mfw the grandfather of a friend of mine is a former banker and thinks a second Depression will hit at the end of this year

Probs won't happen, won't be surprised if it does though.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 08 Aug 2015 20:17:37 No.569047 Report

Quoted By: >>570370

>>566502
hmm yuropoor here, east german to be more precise: the poor folks from the tail of the train are already on their way to the front(africa, middle east, southern eu -> nothern eu or central america -> north america). we put the refugees who make it over the mediterran sea without drowing in tent camps here(yes one camp is located in dresden, but the mass media pays more attention to the fact which soccer team is on top of the league) we have the hottest summer since the measurements started, beats the last record(2003) and the former second record (2006) , see the pattern?
the € crisis in greece is made by the german finance mininster and could be ended in a blink.
the "growth" in the us markets is based on six (SIX!) companies (i.e. amazon, google, apple and 3 other companies which literally produce nothing but interwebs) all other values only know one direction, down. the whole system is going down but everyone pretends that everything is going to be fine. or to bring up one of my favorite quotes : All around you the coal mine canaries are dropping dead and you won't take the hint

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 05:28:50 No.569897 Report

Quoted By:

My plan is to post up at my grandfathers cabin in the idaho mountains, have a pint, and wait for all this to blow over.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 06:00:53 No.569913 Report

Quoted By:

>>565692
>Rule A: Be afraid of every other person.
>Rule E: Don't let fear to affect your thinking.

walking dead fanboi spotted.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 09:49:18 No.569979 Report

Quoted By: >>570000

>>568836
>>568846
Surely the difference here though is that in 1947 the USA had just come out of a World War (not to mention was also paying for rebuilding of Britain, France and West Germany) whereas now the debt has been created purely due to poor fiscal policy.
Obviously it's not anywhere near "imminent collapse" stage, but changes do need to be made, and they need to be made soon.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Government_debt_gdp.jpg, 300KiB, 1357x628

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 11:43:07 No.570000 Report

Quoted By:

>>569979
That's precisely the difference and why the current situation should be so alarming. Over 100% of GDP is simply not sustainable.

>Obviously it's not anywhere near "imminent collapse" stage
Only given the fact the US Dollar is the World reserve currency and the USA is the most powerful country. Given the current and future trends, America is on the decline as an empire.

Also, given the fact that we've already had an economic collapse within the last 10 years, there's no reason another one can't happen in the next 10 years. The economy is unstable as fuck since 2008.

> but changes do need to be made, and they need to be made soon.
Yeah, that's not happening. Which is why my outlook for the remainder of the century is so bleak.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 22:47:41 No.570330 Report

Quoted By:

>>567062

I'm a professor in an econ-related field. Not all this is 100% accurate, but it's close enough. I personally don't believe it will get that bad but there's certainly a good argument to be made that it will.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 23:08:08 No.570342 Report

Quoted By: >>570448

>>568917

Capitalism isn't an ideology, it's what happens when people make economic decisions without coercive interference. Prosumptive, post-scarcity societies will probably be very different, especially in labor-capital tradeoffs, but free markets will still follow the laws of economics.

If you don't trust the Mises graphs, make your own. This is all publicly available information. Graphing inflation-adjusted debt (per capita or as a percentage of GDP) takes 30 min in excel. If you don't trust the cpi, then denominate it in ounces of your favorite precious metal.

The anon's graphs look accurate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 23:33:26 No.570370 Report

Quoted By:

>>569047
>soccer
You're european and saying shit like that proves that you're a cuck who deserves nothing. It's FOOTBALL, F_O_O_T_B_A_L_Ll you shithead, show some respect and end yourself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Aug 2015 23:37:11 No.570373 Report

Quoted By:

>>565756

Depending on the crisis, this.

The us dept of homeland security recommends that Americans each have a 72 hour kit, because that's how long it will take for help to arrive. If TSHTF, then help will never arrive. In that case, you obviously need much more to survive until your own food production kicks in.

That's not counting whatever you need to survive the disaster itself. I'm just talking surviving the social disruption ie the "secondary effects".

So then your choice is: hunting and gathering (very /out/ way to do it), in which case be advised that hundreds of thousands of other amateur campers are doing the same thing in the same places. Hunting all the game, gathering all the berries. It's not just a question of whether there's stuff there, it's whether there will be enough there for all the people trying to collect it. The answer is no.

Farming is also an option, but again be advised that you now have something worth stealing. So it WILL be stolen, either by bandits or the government. Either way, they'll be motivated by desperation rather than criminality-- which just makes them that much worse.

A middle option is to shelter in place for a LONG time, living off supplies and waiting for things to quiet down. That migth be as long as a year or more-- or even decades in an economic collapse. You need people, capital equipment, and supplies. And know-how. You can't know everything, but knowing valuable things that most survivors don't is useful, and knowledge is the one thing that can't be stolen, looted, destroyed, or confiscated.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 01:53:39 No.570448 Report

Quoted By: >>571406

>>570342
capitalism is defined by private ownership of the means of production, not "people mak[ing] economic decisions without coercive interference" (you cannot make uncoerced economic decisions when your very life depends on the goodwill of the select few groups in charge). trade will obviously continue to exist after we reach a resource-based economy, but capitalism cannot.
anyway, while I'm certainly not an economics expert, i don't see how general information on our current & past economic health could accurately inform us on how the massive amount of upcoming job disappearances will affect our economy. wouldn't you have to focus specifically on sectors where widespread job displacement has already begun, like assembly lines or retail? even then, as technology gets better there will be less need for the replacement jobs we've seen in the past that revolve around handling and maintaining these machines & programs. those jobs will still be necessary, but not nearly as many people will be required to perform them.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO rc.jpg, 59KiB, 576x379

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:08:32 No.570455 Report

Quoted By: >>570463 >>570586

i'm gonna go live in the c.1690s root cellar in the woods. it's big enough for like 5 people to lay down in. just me, my gear, my stove. i just have to build some sort of way to conceal the entrance.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:10:07 No.570457 Report

Quoted By: >>570459

>>565370
>Honey
>Why? doesnt spoil, it lasts forever.
Hope you're making your own then. The stuff you buy is just honey flavoured sugar now

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:14:45 No.570459 Report

Quoted By: >>570460 >>570474

>>570457
what's the deal with honey and olive oil? countefeit, all of it. and they're allowed to call it "100%" too. shit's fucked right in the dickass if you ask me tbh

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:15:43 No.570460 Report

Quoted By:

>>570459
Damn right, bro

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:20:02 No.570463 Report

Quoted By:

>>570455
Anon that is a SWEET hideout

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:36:05 No.570474 Report

Quoted By: >>570475 >>570476

>>570459
really? i didn't know that
does this mean i actually have reason to visit a farmers market after all?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Photoxpress-honey-with-comb.jpg, 165KiB, 1200x886

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:42:45 No.570475 Report

Quoted By:

>>570474
you might, yes. once honey is pasturized and filterd it has basically the same chemical structure as corn searp, minus some minerals and natural impurities. sooooo, lots of honey (mostly from chiner) is filtered and then diluted with corn searp. it looks like honey, tastes pretty much like honey, and passes rudimentary tests. however, thorough tests done of US honey show that 3/4 of our honey is counterfeit with the other quarter being likey partially counterfeit. also, like many other things, china exports like 22x more honey than they produce, so you know it's all garbage and shit.

i buy my honey once a year from the Big E. plus i always gets a block of honeycomb with it which is just godly to chew on

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 02:45:06 No.570476 Report

Quoted By:

>>570474
oh also, regarding the olive oil thing. it's even worse a situation than the honey. it's like 99% counterfeit. i saw a documentary about it once and it blew my balls. they had various chefs taste various oils and try to guess which one was real olive oil and they pretty much all failed. at best you and i have had diluted olive oil, and much of the world population has never had actual olive oil at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 07:30:36 No.570586 Report

Quoted By:

>>570455
Can you give us some more pics of that? Looks sweet af.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO aquariuswindow2.jpg, 179KiB, 600x900

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 08:00:35 No.570595 Report

Quoted By: >>570598 >>570622

>>565370

I choose the impossible.

There's room for 5 more people in this thing but then I'd have to split the dehydrated food stores 6 ways

Make the case that you're an indispensable crew member

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 08:26:52 No.570598 Report

Quoted By: >>570600

>>570595
i have brazzers premium account , kush by the lb and the ol lady has a nice set of tits u can play with

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO aquariusinterior2.jpg, 255KiB, 940x705

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 08:30:21 No.570600 Report

Quoted By: >>570622

>>570598

You're in. You can be Sparks or Stormy. Your gf is white debbie unless a hotter girl comes along

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 08:43:21 No.570604 Report

Quoted By: >>570681

>>565370

I always thought it'd be better to stay in a big city in an apocaliptic environment.

Just join a big warband from a powerful warlord, your chances are much higher.

If you go alone or with your family, you not only expose yourself to the risks of wildlife and self-reliance, but also the risk of humans , and more importantly, humans with guns.

The safest bet by far is joining your country's army

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 10:27:56 No.570622 Report

Quoted By:

I'd latch onto some beta that knows what they are doing to survive. That's my master plan.

>>570595
>>570600
I'm not too overweight, can I join your club?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 11 Aug 2015 14:43:28 No.570681 Report

Quoted By:

>>570604
Hmmm, not sure I entirely agree with that. A large metropolitan area is gonna have a high population density. It's effectively going to be synonymous with a war zone. You're not necessarily going to be accepted by a warlord or gang, they could easily just kill or loot you because why the fuck not. If accepted, you're likely to face at least one if not multiple other powerful gangs on a daily basis, fighting over resources, territory and power.

>and more importantly, humans with guns.
There will be millions of people with guns in any large US city as well. Even in no gun countries, hundreds if not thousands of illegally possessed firearms will be on the streets.

>The safest bet by far is joining your country's army
If we're talking apocalyptic societal breakdown scenario, the military ceases to exist or at least operates as a vastly diminished entity who will be underpowered and understaffed. Of course, this depends on the severity of the scenario, but without the backing of a state and money, why are soldiers going to continue wearing their BDU's? Some may form civilian militias as part of their every day survival. Perhaps you'd be better off joining one of those instead of a warlord?

Whilst I'd agree, bugging out with whatever's on your back into the wilderness doesn't offer great survival odds especially if you're not skilled/knowledgeable enough, neither does staying in an urban center in my opinion.

The best BEST odds of survival, I think, is to have a huge property in the middle of nowhere with a mix of wooded and agricultural land that's well stocked, well manned with trusted people and well defended and self sustainable in all vital areas. That's the ideal. But very few people will have that opportunity.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 12 Aug 2015 18:45:56 No.571406 Report

Quoted By:

>>570448

You're using a marxist definition and assumptions. Marx took free market economics, which at that point was a positivist science, and argued that it was actually an ideology imposed by the ownership class. Hence the term "capitalism" which implies that it's an ism to begin with.

Which is not to say, "don't be a marxist". Believe what you want, but it's worth knowing that you're starting from a particular 19th century ideology that basically no actual real modern economist believes in. (Obviously, marxism as a political/social theory is a totally different ball of wax and has many adherents in and out of academia.)

This is totally off-topic to /out/ but you ought to read about labor / capital substitution, which has been an ongoing process since the industrial revolution and actually increased standards of living drastically.

Also, just as a quibble: the problem isn't that people need jobs. It's that they want the standard of living that we trade our labor for. Productivity improvements and wealth creation result in both lost jobs and lower prices. That frees capital to allow people to buy things that they wouldn't have been able to afford before, which generates demand for more jobs. The invention of robotics, for example, killed millions of jobs but created millions of other jobs. Overall, things got better.

If there's an economic collapse, it'll be a debt crisis, which in fairness has been happening on and off to societies at least back to ancient Greece, and probably much further.

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