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Computational photography

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 22:36:49 No.3540554 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>3540561 >>3540584 >>3540657 >>3540851 >>3540856 >>3541054 >>3541107 >>3541217 >>3541301 >>3541346 >>3541352 >>3542016 >>3542053 >>3543231 >>3545155

>better low light noise reduction
>amazing dynamic range
>automatic shadow recovery
>software shake stabilization
>lossless sharpening
>fake bokeh
How long until DSLRs and mirrorless are obsolete?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 22:42:25 No.3540557 Report

Quoted By:

based brain dead consumerist
this will be my 70th hidden thread

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 22:52:04 No.3540561 Report

Quoted By: >>3540567 >>3540586

>>3540554
>How long until DSLRs and mirrorless are obsolete?
less than 10 years. maybe around 5?

a bunch of smaller cameras, when combined into a single image, can produce images that are better than those produced with a single, expensive, camera.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 22:59:57 No.3540564 Report

Quoted By:

but they both look shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 23:00:57 No.3540567 Report

Quoted By: >>3540573

>>3540561
>He says this while the Nokia 9 Pureview got shat on by DxO

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 23:08:20 No.3540573 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540567
>Nokia 9 Pureview
wait for Apple and Google to actually get that part right. Nokia lacks AI prowess.
new iphones have beasts of a chip in them that can do CNNs better than many desktops. just wait till the software catches up.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 23:24:48 No.3540584 Report

Quoted By: >>3540617

>>3540554
>How long until DSLRs and mirrorless are obsolete?
Sony will be the first to integrate computational photography into its mirrorless cameras.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 24 Sep 2019 23:27:51 No.3540586 Report

Quoted By: >>3540687

>>3540561
Merging and high res is meme on phones. Who'd even need to fuck with 100mb files on a phone?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 00:37:54 No.3540604 Report

Quoted By: >>3541461

phones are not going to surpass real cameras until they stop using microscopic sensors and that's quite literally all there is to it

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 01:25:48 No.3540617 Report

Quoted By: >>3540618 >>3540640 >>3540810 >>3540909 >>3541219 >>3541401

>>3540584

False, someone in the MFT consortium, likely Olympus, will be.

Doing computational photography on FF output is just not in the cards for the embedded microprocessors that meet the specs for a camera right now. Even MFT is pushing it, which is why the EM1X had to have two chips in it just to do handheld high res.

You're absolutely fucking delusional if you think Sony, with all of their sometimes fatal heat issues, are about to break into the compho game anytime soon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 01:38:57 No.3540618 Report

Quoted By: >>3540623

>>3540617
>the compho game

holy fuck lmao do you read what you write before you smash that post button my guy?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 02:00:17 No.3540623 Report

Quoted By: >>3540624

>>3540618

Are you fucking retarded? Do you not understand what I just said?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 02:03:57 No.3540624 Report

Quoted By: >>3540841

>>3540623

Do you not understand how ridiculous and poncey you look by trying throw around smarmy, bullshit portmanteaus combined with dated street lingo? We all know you aren’t some grizzled industry vet.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 03:03:46 No.3540640 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540617
stop trying to make mft happen, it's not going to happen

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 04:02:46 No.3540657 Report

Quoted By: >>3540667

>>3540554
>How long until DSLRs and mirrorless are obsolete?
I don't know but I do know photography as a profession will die completely soon afterwards.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 04:41:17 No.3540667 Report

Quoted By: >>3540825

>>3540657
>camera phone algorithms catch up to professional cameras
>computational photography replaces the need dedicated lighting, filters, or other gear
>every normie now carries a pro-equivalent camera in their pocket
>photography becomes 100 million monkeys snapshitting at random until a masterpiece photo is taken by pure chance

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 06:26:14 No.3540687 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540586
>t. Poor storagelet

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 17:14:09 No.3540810 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540617
>look at me guise, I hate sony too! Told you i'm not a redditor

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 17:41:45 No.3540825 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540667
and then they will say "i made that"

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO DSC_7462.jpg, 628KiB, 1936x1296

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 18:53:27 No.3540839 Report

Quoted By: >>3540878

Sometimes I wonder, are phone companies even trying, because after like a decade of development the highest quality phone cameras still look bad. Pic related is an out of focus snapshit I took of my gf with the lowest jpeg settings in my 2008 beginner tier second hand camera with a shitty Chink lens and it still looks better than most phone pictures. They need to step up up their game in bokeh and low light condition, their current solutions just don't look right

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 18:58:04 No.3540841 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540624

>smarmy, bullshit portmanteaus combined with dated street lingo

lol, you mean saying compho so I don't have to type it out and "game?" You are a literal autist. Dumbfuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 20:04:16 No.3540851 Report

Quoted By: >>3540853 >>3540857 >>3541356

>>3540554
Does the iPhone actually allow for aperature adjusting or is this just a camera trick that’s meant to mimic depth of field? Snapchat does it in portrait mode. It just picks out the foreground and blurs the background

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 20:10:22 No.3540853 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540851
I'll bite
It's like Snapchat but you can change the amount of blur

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 20:22:36 No.3540856 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
But that f/2 looks fake as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 20:24:03 No.3540857 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540851
Some phones capture depth mask along with picture as it's taken, that way it's possible to add (somewhat) accurate blur later. Besides inaccuracies, the big problem is that accurate blur takes processing power, with phones on batteries, they employ cheap versions that will never catch up with desktop options.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 21:07:02 No.3540878 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540839
They can't violate the laws of physics. That's why they're resorting to fake images using "computational photography."

It looks like shit but a segment of IG posting normies eat it up.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO menu1_orig.jpg, 15KiB, 500x343

Anonymous Wed 25 Sep 2019 22:40:39 No.3540909 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540617
Well my first gen e-m1, from 2013, already has a lot of "smart" feature like bracketing built in

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO focos_main.jpg, 312KiB, 1185x670

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 03:36:30 No.3541054 Report

Quoted By: >>3541265 >>3541355

>>3540554
wtf is bokeh obsolete now

beethy !7RV9YIDUYA

beethy !7RV9YIDUYA Thu 26 Sep 2019 07:15:21 No.3541107 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
Probably not until phone photography can be handled by cloud computing. Which is expensive to run and most people probably won't care for it.

To properly emulate dSLR visuals, you'd need software that doesn't exist yet. It's incredibly complex with transparent materials and intricate backgrounds with varying layers of depth.

CPUs in mobile phones cannot improve a great deal over the new few years due to size and heat issues. Which is why the computing side would need to be done via cloud services.

tl;dr probably never or at least 10-20 years.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 15:03:28 No.3541217 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
2017.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 15:05:00 No.3541219 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540617
Truth hurts, yo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 15:32:41 No.3541227 Report

Quoted By: >>3541267 >>3541278

>multi billion, probably trillion dollar industry
>insane competition world wide
>photos still look like shit
Yep I think I'm keeping my dslr for now

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 17:49:10 No.3541265 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541054
>large aperture and real bokeh
>real bokeh
>lol k its actually fake bokeh but lets say its real

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 17:51:52 No.3541267 Report

Quoted By: >>3541278

>>3541227
This

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 19:00:53 No.3541278 Report

Quoted By: >>3541297 >>3541354 >>3541443

>>3541227
>>3541267
no matter how much gimmicky tech you put in it, a very tiny sensor is still going to be a very tiny sensor

giannis

giannis Thu 26 Sep 2019 20:03:31 No.3541297 Report

Quoted By: >>3541357 >>3541362

>>3541278
Why do you assume that computational/machine learning techniques can only be applied to phone sensors?
Bigger sensors don't have that much higher resolution than 12MP, it's usually ~24 to ~36MP for aps-c and full frame. That's at most 3x the pixels on a phone camera.

So it's no that much more expensive computationally to apply all those tricks to bigger sensors. It's within the realm of modern mobile SOCs.
The only way phones will further cannibalise the aps-c/full frame market, is if camera companies don't use the same tricks because they lag behind in the SOC area. Which isn't that crazy of an idea, seeing the massive leaps mobile processors have made lately, while cameras are still stuck to pissold ones.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 20:14:19 No.3541301 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
The artificial bokeh looks like shit but what phones do with hdr is pretty insane. and the colors look very nice, especially on iphones.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:01:55 No.3541346 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
>>lossless sharpening
wat

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:23:30 No.3541352 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
That fake bokeh it's absolutely disgusting

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:27:28 No.3541354 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541278
this

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:29:53 No.3541355 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541054
AAAAAAHHHH these colours hurt my eyes

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:30:26 No.3541356 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540851
it's the amount of fake bokeh added to the picture, basically a gimmick

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:37:52 No.3541357 Report

Quoted By: >>3541358 >>3541364 >>3541443

>>3541297
there will not come a day when software will replace better hardware. "Machine Learning", and "AI" are just buzzwords for statistics, algebra and a lot of conditionals. It has a place amongst amateur photography, that's all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 26 Sep 2019 23:47:12 No.3541358 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541357
... said the man before he was replaced by a robot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 00:35:00 No.3541362 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541297
12MP phone still looks worse than 12MP dlsr/dslm. Phones have shit tier lenses and tons of noise that kills all the details. If you ever crop a phone image you'll see that.

giannis

giannis Fri 27 Sep 2019 00:39:04 No.3541364 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541357
>there will not come a day when software will replace better hardware
But you're making this false dichotomy. Why better hardware can't have *also* better software?

Because otherwise (worse hardware+better software vs the opposite), the difference might be too small for people to care enough to buy the better hardware.

If you want to see what effect software can have, remember that most cameras have bayer sensors and interpolation, i.e. their resolution is mostly the result of software and not hardware.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 00:56:34 No.3541368 Report

Quoted By:

Phone cameras are a shit experience.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 02:31:27 No.3541401 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540617
>likely Olympus
Olympus has only ever invented one truly innovative product: the microcassette. And fun fact: Sony is a large shareholder in Olympus.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO image5.jpg, 573KiB, 1600x1160

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 04:26:42 No.3541443 Report

Quoted By: >>3541454 >>3541570 >>3542031 >>3542442 >>3542593 >>3542651

>>3541357
>>3541278
>no matter how much gimmicky tech you put in it, a very tiny sensor is still going to be a very tiny sensor
Can your single sensor DSLR get this much dynamic range?

>b-but i can just tripod and stitch in post
no you can't, not for moving subjects

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 04:43:40 No.3541454 Report

Quoted By: >>3541460

>>3541443
As computational photography becomes more common in phones, i would'nt be surprised if camera maker starts adding these sort of features in their camera to be able compete.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO a33.png, 45KiB, 558x614

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 04:51:26 No.3541460 Report

Quoted By: >>3541463

>>3541454
>implying you can fit two sensors that go off at the same time behind a single camera lens

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 04:53:11 No.3541461 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540604
/thread
Should have an hero this thread right here

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 04:55:59 No.3541463 Report

Quoted By: >>3542431

>>3541460
I don't mean putting multiple sensors in and single interchangeable lens camera, i meant that camera makers might want to improve their cameras processing power to be able to do such thing without editing in post.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 27 Sep 2019 09:17:30 No.3541570 Report

Quoted By: >>3542431

>>3541443
>Can your single sensor DSLR get this much dynamic range?
Can a phone put all this dynamic range into a RAW file?
check-mate atheist

Jesus

Jesus Sat 28 Sep 2019 07:53:22 No.3542016 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
If that smeared abomination on the left is seriously what I'm supposed to be impressed by, then I think dedicated cameras have decades more time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 28 Sep 2019 08:46:24 No.3542031 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541443
Even an ancient DSLR has more DR than this

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 28 Sep 2019 10:11:47 No.3542053 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
Not going to happen, phone cameras are stuck with tiny sensors that suck in low light conditions.
While a FF can now produce decent pictures at up to about ISO 12800 or 25600, phones start to get shitty at about ISO 400 or 800.
Then there is the issue with lenses, diffraction and effective resolution.
Larger sensors tend to be less limited by diffraction than smaller ones and the lenses in phones will never be as sharp as their larger counterparts.

Besides, any advance in software can be used with either system.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 29 Sep 2019 04:56:32 No.3542431 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541463
>>3541570
how else do you think they got so much dynamic range in a phone snapshit? With a dual-camera dual-sensor set up, you expose one camera for highlights and the other for shadows, and you get instant HDR in post

>b-but my canon rabal comes with HDR
Consecutive shots for HDR doesn't work for moving subjects

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 29 Sep 2019 05:34:18 No.3542442 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541443
>Can your single sensor DSLR get this much dynamic range?
... yes? have you never used the highlights/shadows sliders on a raw file or something?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 29 Sep 2019 15:09:59 No.3542593 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541443
>can your single sensor DSLR get this much dynamic range?
well yeah of course, my 2010 DSLR's *usable* DR is about 8 and up to 10EV, more than the latest iPhone in real world situations. They'll tell you that DR is full 12 stops but that's on paper, there's just no competing.

No amount of gimmicky software, or even real software for that matter, can or will replace better hardware and that's all there's to it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 29 Sep 2019 18:19:14 No.3542651 Report

Quoted By:

>>3541443
That top picture is done through a surprisingly long series of stills that are then stacked and tuned by the phone. In the time it takes to shoot it a five second exposure would have done way better. Hell, even a raw with the exposure cranked in post would be better.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 01 Oct 2019 00:25:41 No.3543231 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
That doesn't look anywhere near as good as a camera with a decent sensor, even from one as far back as 2012. Until smartphones have giant sensors and the ability to put a big piece of glass on them, they will never be as good as a real camera.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 05 Oct 2019 06:07:03 No.3545155 Report

Quoted By:

>>3540554
Not before phones have large sensor and big interchangeable lenses. And I don't think there is market for that kind of phone or cameras would already have built in phone.

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