/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #12546718

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341KiB, 1029x850, 256 - metagross pseudo-legendary psychic_type rse shiny steel_type.jpg

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Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:27:03 No.12546718 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By:

You could fix pretty much all of metagross' coverage problems with stone edge

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:28:17 No.12546728 Report

Quoted By: >>12546743 >>12546757

metagross has no coverage problems

or any problems at all, aside from imperfect accuracy of its moves

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:29:45 No.12546743 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546728
Metagross' problem is specifically being unable to cover enough

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:29:56 No.12546748 Report

Quoted By: >>12546770

Levitate

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:31:20 No.12546757 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546728
Gravity or Hone Claws solves the problem.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:31:21 No.12546758 Report

Quoted By: >>12546765 >>12546817

You could actually fix all of Metagross' problems with Iron Fist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:32:16 No.12546765 Report

Quoted By: >>12546787

>>12546758
Nowhere near enough power to break throufh bulky neutral threats

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:32:47 No.12546770 Report

Quoted By: >>12546772

>>12546748
That would pretty much fix all of his problems.
Especially when people hardly ever use a fire type in OU.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:33:36 No.12546772 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546770
It only fixes defensive sets problems

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:36:28 No.12546787 Report

Quoted By: >>12546818

>>12546765

but the choice band set 2hkos everything except I think slowbro, and actually most things are OHKOed

with iron fist this would be uber material

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:39:14 No.12546801 Report

Quoted By: >>12546818

Metagross' only problem is that it's too slow. If Metagross got Shift Gear, that would solve pretty much all of his issues. Either that or recover, and then he could be a great defensive wall.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:40:40 No.12546817 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546758
>Iron Fist Shift Gear Metagross

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:40:47 No.12546818 Report

Quoted By: >>12546828 >>12546840

>>12546801
He already has agility. Speed is not the issue.

>>12546787
A lot of choice band pokemon 2hko everything. A lot of LO mixed attackers do as well. Like Hydreigon

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:42:51 No.12546828 Report

Quoted By: >>12547202

>>12546818
Agility sets need to be jolly to outrun anything good and he can't afford to not be adamant when he has no reliable way to boost its attack, two shitty STABs and EQ, none of which have a base power over 100.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 20:43:56 No.12546840 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546818

sure, but most of those can't switch into much

metagross is the only one that combines power and coverage, with the ability to switch into a lot of things

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:25:50 No.12547202 Report

Quoted By:

>>12546828
Metagross is the definitive jack of all trades pokemon. His strength lies in playing multiple roles at once for teams that desperately need to consolidate team slots

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:26:46 No.12547214 Report

Quoted By:

Physical Quiver Dance

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:28:03 No.12547226 Report

Quoted By: >>12547253

>people thinking pseudos need to be fixed when there's hundreds of pokemon waiting in line to be as good as them

Fuck off

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:30:31 No.12547253 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547226
>implying there is some sort of limit to how many pokemon can be fixed
>implying metagross lives up to being a pseudo

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:30:46 No.12547258 Report

Quoted By: >>12547330 >>12547711 >>12548268

Metagross's main problem is speed. Since the metagame is so hyper-offensive, Metagross's bulk is not going to help it survive more than a few hits. So it has to rely on its offensive skill. However, Metagross is just two slow to be that big of a threat. It does have access to Bullet Punch, but that's far too weak to be used as its primary attacking choice, and running both Bullet Punch and Meteor Mash severely restricts its coverage. It also has access to Agility, but that leaves it with 3 moveslots for offensive moves, which doesn't provide much coverage with Metagross's poor offensive STABs.

Two ways to fix it are:
>Shift Gear
Does what Agility does but also increases it's Attack, so that it can still hit hard with neutral moves.

>Auto-Gravity ability
This allows Meteor Mash and Earthquake alone to provide near-perfect coverage (Water/Grass and Water/Bug being the only two type combinations that resist both). On top of this, Meteor Mash gets an accuracy boost. Combine those moves and ability with Zen Headbutt/another coverage move and Agility and Metagross is a fast Pokemon with great coverage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:39:03 No.12547330 Report

Quoted By: >>12547374

>>12547258
This.

Metagross is too slow without agility, and loses too much coverage with it.

Of course since the coverage problem on agiligross comes down to thunder vs ice punch OPs stone edge suggestion is a step in the right direction

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:44:25 No.12547374 Report

Quoted By: >>12547478

>>12547330
Actually, Ice hits more Pokemon supereffectively than both Electric and Rock on Agility Metagross (assuming that you're also running Meteor Mash and Earthquake). Although when you choose that last move, you're basically choosing which half of the metagame you want to be walled by.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 21:59:35 No.12547478 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547374
His main problems are that the punches often only hit flying types and the levitators that resist mash neutrally, and they have a low base power. Stone edge lets you hit rotom, thundurus, gyarados, and ballontran harder

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:02:16 No.12547498 Report

Quoted By: >>12547512 >>12547617

Guys, Agility Metagross is crap, and even Stone Edge wouldn't help him. It is still outsped by many scarfers after agility, as well as weather sweepers. I can't actually recall anything using Agility that has ever worked, aside from Empoleon in D/P (sucks now because of mach punch, Rotom-W, and sun).

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:04:07 No.12547512 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547498
That's why it needs either Shift Gear or auto-gravity.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:08:23 No.12547559 Report

Quoted By: >>12547571

Short of Ice Punch, even with Stone Edge it won't be doing much to Claydol.

Not that anyone ever USES Claydol.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:09:24 No.12547571 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547559

CB Meteor Mash is probably an OHKO.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:15:14 No.12547617 Report

Quoted By: >>12547678

>>12547498
>nothing has ever used agility well
>landorus. Terrakion, genesect while it was OU
>inb4 rock polish doesn't count

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:23:49 No.12547678 Report

Quoted By: >>12547695

>>12547617

I think those suck too, (aside from maybe Genesect), because 1. they have very few opportunities to set up; 2. they are weak to priority, especially Terrakion who is destroyed by 2 common priorities and 2 other rare ones. Besides, they lack power to sweep after using RP anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:25:53 No.12547695 Report

Quoted By: >>12547708 >>12547718

>>12547678
You realise SF lando with RP is THE sweeper in OU right now right? Its fine if you recognize their shortcomings but its completely untrue to say they don't use +2 speed well.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:27:40 No.12547708 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547695
Do you know that FG is HF in YB?
Neither do I, because I keep using all those fucking acronyms.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:27:52 No.12547711 Report

Quoted By: >>12547976 >>12548264

>>12547258

Maybe it's because of the idea of an "Auto-Gravity" ability, but I suddenly pictured naming a Metagross with it "Nightmare". Resemblance isn't too close but thematically the whole living machine thing works.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:28:53 No.12547718 Report

Quoted By: >>12547943

>>12547695

I have honestly never had a problem with him. When I think "OU's Sweeper", what comes to mind is Gyarados, Volcarona, and even Lucario. Their set up moves are simply better than Agility/Rock Polish.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:55:24 No.12547943 Report

Quoted By: >>12547964

>>12547718
>Lucario

>Sweeping anything

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:57:32 No.12547964 Report

Quoted By: >>12547985

>>12547943
Lucario and Gyarados are shit sweepers

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:58:19 No.12547976 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547711
that fucking boss battle brings back horrible memories, many tears shed and hair pulled out... why anon do you remind me

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 22:59:08 No.12547985 Report

Quoted By: >>12547995 >>12547996

>>12547964
Gyarados is alright with Moxie after it gets one DD. I've swept many opponents with him.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:00:28 No.12547995 Report

Quoted By: >>12548035 >>12548084

>>12547985
He's pretty slow even after a DD, and he's fairly easy to wall.

He's decent in rain definitely, just he's a poor man's dragonite.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:00:37 No.12547996 Report

Quoted By: >>12548028 >>12548084 >>12548179

>>12547985
He has shit coverage though. Honestly he should be UU.

Along with Lucario.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:04:05 No.12548028 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547996
While theyre both somewhat subpar they both bring unique assets with them. Bulky dancer with rain boosted stab and Swords dance plus Espeed

Better than Haxorus who should definitely be BL soon

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:05:05 No.12548035 Report

Quoted By: >>12548103

>>12547995

Gyarados has much more set up opportunities than Dragonite, for example on water types with Ice Beam, Scizor, Mamoswine, Ice Fang Gliscor, the mighty sheer force Landorus, and fighting types with Ice Punch.

Lucario is the best sweeper in the game once set up, because it doesn't give two shits about priority, scarfers, weather sweepers, or just naturally faster pokemon, while all the others do.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:11:16 No.12548084 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547995
After one DD, he outspeeds most opponents that aren't scarfed and that pose a threat. Not as good as MoxieMence, but still fairly effective.

>>12547996
Waterfall, Earthquake and Ice Fang give pretty good neutral coverage, and after those attack boosts, he's hits everything hard. He could do with a more powerful Ice move but most Pokemon that end up getting hit by Ice Fang usually have a x4 weakness.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:13:05 No.12548103 Report

Quoted By:

>>12548035
If its faster and isn't OHKOd by Espeed it wrecks Lucario's shit. And Dragonite has pretty much a free set up turn always when multiscale is in tact.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:19:37 No.12548179 Report

Quoted By: >>12548319

>>12547996
I don't know what you're talking about. With Lucario's movepool it is an amazing sweeper. One swords dance and it can destroy teams.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:28:14 No.12548264 Report

Quoted By:

>>12547711

They should name the auto-Gravity ability "Einstein"

Then it would make sense for Metagross to have it because he's supposed to be some sort of supercomputer

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:28:35 No.12548268 Report

Quoted By: >>12548479

>>12547258
Pardon the newb question, but, how is Psychic a poor offensive STAB when the meta is chock-full of fighting types?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:34:47 No.12548319 Report

Quoted By: >>12548448

>>12548179
It is also 2HKO'd by resisted hits and non-stab E-speed is walled very easilly.

If Weavile is a glass cannon than Lucario is a paper mache pistol.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:47:22 No.12548448 Report

Quoted By:

>>12548319
Lucario is a glass cannon except slow, ruining the point

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 04 Jun 2013 23:49:25 No.12548479 Report

Quoted By:

>>12548268
Fighting is all it hits, resisted by steel and other bulky/defensive psychics, and being a frail psychic type makes you pursuit bait.

Though its slowly becoming good again because poison types have been rising to beat fighting types.

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