/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #17957352

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Theorymon

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:11:08 No.17957352 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>17957393 >>17957414 >>17960483 >>17960533

What if its Attack and Speed were swapped?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:15:29 No.17957381 Report

Quoted By:

Then we have auto priority that's really strong but low speed. Basically the roles it fills would still be the same, just more susceptible to priority itself. However I believe the choice band sets would undoubtably become the best on it.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:15:35 No.17957383 Report

Quoted By: >>17957394 >>17957398

What if its Sp Atk and Speed were swapped?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:17:49 No.17957393 Report

Quoted By: >>17957434

>>17957352
Banned to uber.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:17:54 No.17957394 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957383
I'd OHKO the fucker even more often before it can do anything

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:19:03 No.17957398 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957383
Then it would be on equal footing (for the most part) as gengar and alakazam. That speed drop would seriously hurt it, as that's what it relies on to get its kills coupled with some SpAtk boosting item.
Not good for it at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:22:16 No.17957414 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957352
Even more predictable than it already is, not that it'd matter though as all you have to do is take out rock, electric & steel types and then it's cruise control from there.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:27:36 No.17957434 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957393
It wouldn't be that broken. It would probably be worse because it would rely almost completely on Flying moves . Flying isn't a great offensive type by itself.

What makes it good is a mix of priority, two high power stabs and an excellent speed tier.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:35:15 No.17957465 Report

Quoted By: >>17957482 >>17957499 >>17957554 >>17960868

Favourte methods of killing this guy?

Tyrantiar?
Gyarados?
Rotom-W?
Focus Sash?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:36:38 No.17957470 Report

Quoted By: >>17957489

what if instead of 4 moves pokemon had 3 moves

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:39:06 No.17957482 Report

Quoted By: >>17957491

>>17957465
Stealth Rock, I guess. I honestly haven't had much trouble with it outside 3v3, which I pretty much never play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:40:51 No.17957489 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957470
It would nerf a lot of defensive Pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:41:01 No.17957491 Report

Quoted By: >>17957494 >>17957526

>>17957482
It's shockingly bulky

252 Atk Jolly Garchomp Outrage vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 261-307 (87.5 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:41:50 No.17957494 Report

Quoted By: >>17957507

>>17957491
>using Outrage on anything

Calem 3711-8693-5960

Calem 3711-8693-5960 Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:42:46 No.17957499 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957465
I enjoy using Rhyperior against it myself

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:44:15 No.17957507 Report

Quoted By: >>17957525

>>17957494
you would rather use dragon claw and have a 0% chance to OHKO?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:47:59 No.17957525 Report

Quoted By: >>17957556

>>17957507
I'd rather not be locked into a three-turn move. Also…

252 Atk Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 580-684 (194.6 - 229.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Garchomp Rock Slide vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 436-516 (146.3 - 173.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Talonflame: 428-508 (118.8 - 141.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Garchomp Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Talonflame: 320-380 (88.8 - 105.5%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:48:02 No.17957526 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957491
Here's a good one

252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 244-288 (81.8 - 96.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 258-304 (98.4 - 116%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO

Talonflame > Mega Gengar

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:54:57 No.17957554 Report

Quoted By: >>17957575 >>17960583

>>17957465
Omastar because it doesn't have to worry about will o wisp and I get a free autowin button (shell smash)

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:55:38 No.17957556 Report

Quoted By: >>17957566 >>17960840

>>17957525
What kind of shit Garchomp would run Stone Edge? unless it's Scarfed

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 12:58:50 No.17957566 Report

Quoted By: >>17957574 >>17957579

>>17957556
Right, ofc it would run Rock Slide because doubles are the only format that matters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:00:43 No.17957574 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957566
No, Rock slide is garbage too.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:01:04 No.17957575 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957554
Talonflame 2HKO's Omastar if you Shell Smash after the first turn (Brave Bird still has priority)

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:01:45 No.17957579 Report

Quoted By: >>17957606 >>17957615

>>17957566
no, it wouldn't run any rock-type move.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:07:50 No.17957606 Report

Quoted By: >>17957618 >>17957638

>>17957579
And next you're telling me it would run shit like Fire Fang in that slot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:10:51 No.17957615 Report

Quoted By: >>17957651 >>17957658

>>17957579
What kind shity Garchomp wouldn't run a rock-type move?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:11:18 No.17957618 Report

Quoted By: >>17957630 >>17957642

>>17957606
Outrage
Earthquake
Crunch
Flamethrower / Swords Dance / Rock Slide

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:12:32 No.17957630 Report

Quoted By: >>17957644

>>17957618
>crunch
if you don't know how to play the game don't post

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:14:15 No.17957638 Report

Quoted By: >>17957661 >>17957669

>>17957606
Yes, because otherwise shit like Ferrothorn and Scizor would wall the fuck out of it.

Git gud

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:14:33 No.17957642 Report

Quoted By: >>17959261

>>17957618
>outrage
>crunch
is this a ruse right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:14:59 No.17957644 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957630
Would you rather be locked into Outrage?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:16:23 No.17957651 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957615
Sword Dance set

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:17:46 No.17957658 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957615
What exactly for would you need a Rock-type move?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:17:54 No.17957661 Report

Quoted By: >>17957680

>>17957638
>being neutral to earthquake
>walling Garchomp anytime soon
pick one and only one

You know who would wall the fuck out of Garchomp? Togekiss.
That's why you run a rock move

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:18:38 No.17957669 Report

Quoted By: >>17957694

>>17957638
Doesn't help if they switch in on your Outrage.

And as I'm playing doubles, let your partner handle it. Ferrothorn can't threaten Garchomp that much.
4 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 160-190 (44.6 - 53%) -- 30.5% chance to 2HKO on a max speed Scarfchomp

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:20:40 No.17957680 Report

Quoted By: >>17957733

>>17957661
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 97-115 (27.5 - 32.6%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

Well done

also
>2014
>togekiss being more common than ferrothorn and scizor

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:21:42 No.17957694 Report

Quoted By: >>17957706

>>17957669
why outrage?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:23:25 No.17957706 Report

Quoted By: >>17957732

>>17957694
Some other anon suggested that Garchomp would also run Outrage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:27:46 No.17957728 Report

Quoted By:

Switched Attack and Speed would be an incredible buff for Talonflame.

IMO what keeps Talonflame out of ubers, or stupidly-high OU at least, is its lackluster Attack stat. I think that GameFreak gave it base 81 specifically to keep it from being overpowered. Brave Bird outdamages Garchomp's Dragon Claw, priority Brave Bird off a higher Attack stat would be ridiculous.

But Talonflame with base 126 Attack? Ouch. It'd lose to Excadrill and Mega Pinsir with the lowered Speed, maybe be susceptible to Jirachi, and not be able to U-turn away from as many mons, but little would actually change for Talonflame. Most Steel types are slower than base 80, as are most priority users.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:28:12 No.17957732 Report

Quoted By: >>17957760

>>17957706
I actually run Mega-Chomp

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:28:15 No.17957733 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957680
>max Def Ferrothorn
If you run a sword dance set you can Brute force your way after a dance and if run a scarf set fire BLAST is a much better option.

Togekiss is B+ like Ferrothorn this gen, and thanks to the fairy retyping was used a lot at the beginning of this gen.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:33:44 No.17957760 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957732
Fuck do I know who is who and what set you are running. Point of the calculation using Scarfchomp was that Gyro Ball would deal max damage. (and Scarfchomp is default for that calc too)

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:39:06 No.17957802 Report

Quoted By: >>17957839 >>17957863 >>17957901 >>17957907

two questions.
>what if M-Gardevoir got the extra attack points it recieved instead put into its Speed stat?
>what if Pokemon had five moves instead of four?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:44:59 No.17957839 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957802
>what if M-Gardevoir got the extra attack points it recieved instead put into its Speed stat?
120BS Speed. Considering its 165BS Sp.Atk and excellent Special based movepool, that would be fun to see. Or you can remove half the points that go in Sp. Atk (2) put 20 in PV and 20 in Def. and it'd be better balanced. Or even swap Sp. Def and Phy.Def since most Dark in its tier are physical.

>what if Pokemon had five moves instead of four?
I'd love to run an Infernape if it was the case.

nicky

nicky Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:49:10 No.17957863 Report

Quoted By: >>17957897 >>17959117

>>17957802
>5 moves
>mega lucario with Swords Dance, Close Combat, Bullet Punch, Crunch, and Ice Punch

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:54:53 No.17957897 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957863
We must never let this information see the light of day, lest Game Freak see it and adopt it for Gen 7.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:55:26 No.17957901 Report

Quoted By: >>17959189

>>17957802
Everything would have too much coverage with 5 moves

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 13:56:00 No.17957907 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957802
>what if M-Gardevoir got the extra attack points it recieved instead put into its Speed stat?
Whit base 120 would be a very good mega, probably mid-OU.

>what if Pokemon had five moves instead of four?
Holy shit lots of thing would love that.
Another slot for a coverage move or a utility move would help lots of thing a lot.
For example you could run Substitute on everything without loosing coverage.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:37:03 No.17959079 Report

Quoted By: >>17960770

What if its Special Attack and Speed were swapped?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:41:00 No.17959117 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957863
>not MegaLuc with Nasty Plot, Flash Cannon, Vacuum Wave, Shadow Ball and HP Electric

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:49:25 No.17959178 Report

Quoted By: >>17959200

Here is one for you:
What if Flygon could use quiver dance?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:51:32 No.17959189 Report

Quoted By: >>17959194

>>17957901
Lilligant

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:52:15 No.17959194 Report

Quoted By:

>>17959189
Flareon

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:52:48 No.17959200 Report

Quoted By: >>17959223

>>17959178
>Special Flygon

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 16:56:40 No.17959223 Report

Quoted By: >>17959919

>>17959200
>flamethrower, earth power, drain breath, quiver dance

Do you even know how to play the game? It's special stat would get good with just one boost, and that speed boost

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 17:03:05 No.17959261 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957642
Outrage is still fairly standard on Scarfchomp, simply because the extra BP allows it to revenge kill and usually, when you need to use it, you absolutely need to get the revenge kill or you are going to lose.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 17:17:01 No.17959357 Report

Quoted By: >>17960557

>You are now able to swap between Mega and non-Mega forms at will at the beginning of each turn.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 18:10:52 No.17959919 Report

Quoted By: >>17960499

>>17959223
>drain breath

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:04:26 No.17960483 Report

Quoted By: >>17960587

>>17957352
Base 120 priority stab of 127 Atk. It's like you want to make a regional bird stronger than Arceus.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:06:10 No.17960499 Report

Quoted By:

>>17959919
giga suckle

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:09:27 No.17960533 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957352
What if all of its stats were just buffed to 150 and give it an ability that is Gale Wings + immune to rocks?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:11:45 No.17960557 Report

Quoted By:

>>17959357
That idea would put a bit of strategy, but with how broken they are I say eff to the no.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:14:25 No.17960583 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957554
>+2/+2/+2 fucking omastar
>autowin on anyone decent

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:14:56 No.17960587 Report

Quoted By: >>17960625

>>17960483
>implying it wasn't already
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Abra: 838-987 (438.7 - 516.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Abra: 726-855 (380.1 - 447.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:18:22 No.17960625 Report

Quoted By: >>17960730 >>17960740

>>17960587
>can kill abra
ITS OP GAMEFREAK PLS NERF

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:27:04 No.17960730 Report

Quoted By: >>17961389

>>17960625
>not realizing that I was using a Pokemon neutral to both to show how 252+ Choice Band vs. 252+ Choice Band was against a neutral Pokemon

You sure are autistic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:28:19 No.17960740 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960625
Would you prefer Blissey?
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Blissey: 426-502 (65.3 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Blissey: 369-435 (56.5 - 66.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:29:16 No.17960747 Report

Quoted By: >>17960755

What if we could use 8 mons instead of 6?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:29:56 No.17960755 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960747
What if Pokemon could use 2 items?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:31:13 No.17960770 Report

Quoted By: >>17960785

>>17959079
Banned in Ubers

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:32:53 No.17960785 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960770
Not really that OP, Mega Mewtwo Y or X is still better and is not banned.

Also Scolipede can be used to offset MChomps speed with a sash/batonboost

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:38:03 No.17960840 Report

Quoted By: >>17960981

>>17957556
>What kind of shit Garchomp would run Stone Edge?

One that doesn't want to be completely walled by Togekiss?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:39:20 No.17960854 Report

Quoted By:

Still has gale wings?
It's straight up broken.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:40:30 No.17960868 Report

Quoted By:

>>17957465
Avalugg is my personal favourite.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:43:08 No.17960917 Report

Quoted By: >>17960936

What if it had thick fat?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:44:16 No.17960936 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960917
choice scarf slaking - truant = straight to ubers

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 19:47:25 No.17960981 Report

Quoted By: >>17961332

>>17960840
>what is iron tail

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 20:10:51 No.17961332 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960981
>75% accuracy with shit coverage
>80% accuracy with a better crit chance and bigger coverage
Pick one and only one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 10 Feb 2014 20:16:07 No.17961389 Report

Quoted By:

>>17960730
>i was joking around
>getting mad over this and calling someone autistic
the definition of irony

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