/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #19670503

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Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:17:30 No.19670503 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>19670864 >>19671703 >>19671780 >>19671992

"Smogon thought they could kill BP chains!"

>Complex ban backfired, neo-BP chain teams are possibly stronger than copypasta BP
>Smeargle+Espeon+Scolipede core still intact
>lots of possibilities for the remaining 3 teamslots, making them unpredictable
>you still need obscure shit like Haze Quagsire to counter them
>Deniss has already reached the top of the ladder with a neo-BP chain team
>his team uses the standard core + dual screen Deo-S lead + 2 BP recipients with Stored Power

Replays:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132125815
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132111820
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132129685
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-131835960

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:20:02 No.19670517 Report

Quoted By: >>19670561 >>19670640

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/survey-discussing-future-tiering-policy.3509505/#post-5531980

>"I'd also like to see the move Baton Pass and the Scolipede and Magic Bounce + BP complex ban added to the list of Suspect choices, because BP is still topping the ladder and some are arguing it is just as, if not more, broken than before, because of how varied the teams are. It's no longer just a team, but a play style"

NOW they see this as a playstyle. And they still want to ban it rather than adapt. Amazing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:20:49 No.19670522 Report

Quoted By:

fucking loser. 2 BP neo nazi team ftw. durrr. just play the fucking game. taking competitive battling this seriously is gay as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:22:11 No.19670531 Report

Quoted By:

So Smogon wanted to nerf the playstyle but instead they indirectly made it stronger. Glorious.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:24:21 No.19670544 Report

Quoted By:

> greentext asdad

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:29:20 No.19670559 Report

Quoted By: >>19670562 >>19673510

Hey I like to show how little I understand the competitive metagame too, can I join in with you guys? ^_^

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:29:52 No.19670561 Report

Quoted By: >>19671763

>>19670517
>adapt
I'm not sure if that's entirely possible.
You'd have to use Roar or Whirlwind on things that shouldn't carry it to phase not-Espeon before it happens and even then you'd have to watch for Spore and Stored Power.
Haze users (Unaware Quagsire being the best) are not that common, too. Trick Room could do the trick for a while, turning their speed boosts against them, but only for a few turns. And then there's Destiny Bond Mega Banette, which could function.

There aren't that many ways around it the way I see it, but then again, I'm mainly a breeder/collector.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:30:09 No.19670562 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670559
Go fuck yourself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:31:49 No.19670570 Report

Quoted By: >>19670575

I'm currently laddering on a new alt (currently in the 1600 range) and I'm seeing these teams popping up every now and then.
They run the standard Espeon/Scoli/Smeargle core and besides that I have seen Clefable, Kyu-B, Greninja, M-Venu, M-Gardy, Landorus, Deo-D/S, Sableye as team mates.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:32:30 No.19670575 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670570
cool story faget

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:36:52 No.19670598 Report

Quoted By: >>19670606

Every replay I see about BP teams has the opponent let them set up. Is it stupidity?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:39:17 No.19670606 Report

Quoted By: >>19670734 >>19670777

>>19670598
THose replays are from the top of the ladder and whenever you think they "let them setup" is because they have no fucking clue of what's going to happen since BP chains are more unpredictable now.
Like that Talonflame that used Taunt on Vaporeon, only to have the rest of the team swept by boosted Scalds.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:39:28 No.19670607 Report

Quoted By: >>19670627

They were whining about Deoxys-D last gen being too easy to set up screens/hazards and supporting hyper offense, so why the fuck isn't Deoxys-S banned yet?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:42:55 No.19670627 Report

Quoted By: >>19670642 >>19671737

>>19670607
Deo-D and Deo-S are getting the boot soon, it's a matter of time.
It doesn't matter anyway since Klefki will take up their role as a suicide lead (also expect Klefki to learn Stealth Rock via move tutor in ORAS since it's a steel type).

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:44:47 No.19670640 Report

Quoted By: >>19670671

>>19670517
>they
>1 poster
also suspect is not a ban you twat

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:45:05 No.19670642 Report

Quoted By: >>19670657

>>19670627
Klefki doesn't get Taunt though, wouldn't that make it quite easier to counter?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:47:40 No.19670657 Report

Quoted By: >>19671737

>>19670642
Magic Coat is also a tutor move and I could see Klefki learning it.
Or it could run Mental Herb I guess.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:49:03 No.19670671 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670640
Most suspects end up with a ban so I'll take my chances and assume so.
And it's just not 1 poster, take a look at Smogon's forum and enjoy the bitchfest.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:56:50 No.19670707 Report

Quoted By: >>19670724 >>19671997 >>19672064

Verlisify was right.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 12:59:56 No.19670724 Report

Quoted By: >>19670729

>>19670707
About what?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:00:34 No.19670729 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670724
About smogon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:01:04 No.19670731 Report

Quoted By: >>19670752 >>19670763 >>19670777 >>19670798

Why is it a problem that one guy who's good with the team stays at the top of the ladder, again? Hypothetically, even if they outright banned baton pass pretty much all the top teams would be HO, would they suspect HO then? Why is Baton Pass specifically singled out as a problematic strategy if the person playing it still needs to understand the meta?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:02:25 No.19670734 Report

Quoted By: >>19670777

>>19670606
so, yes, stupidity.

or in other words, being so used to the generic teams that they cannot handle when someone does something abnormal

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:05:54 No.19670752 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670731
That's how Smogon works. They periodically ban the current top strategy or Pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:07:55 No.19670763 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670731
Because this gen smogon's community has gone all ban happy. They ban anything that they dislike playing against.

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:09:51 No.19670777 Report

Quoted By: >>19670843 >>19671873

>>19670731
because you can get easy wins without actually knowing anything about OU
>>19670606
>>19670734
i think the use of bp chains have changed in a good way because now people can opt to be more creative

also with the bp "ban" people don't feel like they need to have a counter on every team

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO BisonYes.jpg, 16KiB, 469x320

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:10:51 No.19670781 Report

Quoted By:

Can I say Deniss is my nigga right now? Cause this carnage is delicious

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:14:18 No.19670798 Report

Quoted By: >>19671774

>>19670731
Remember these online simulators really don't any other thing besides bragging rights to the top of the ladder, or something like tournaments for cash prizes like VGC.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:20:30 No.19670823 Report

Quoted By: >>19672292 >>19672500 >>19673272

What a nuisance, Smogon has gone totally soft.

I bet they would have thought SkarmBliss was a banworthy combo in gen III too. Pathetic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:23:05 No.19670843 Report

Quoted By: >>19670853

>>19670777
>because you can get easy wins without actually knowing anything about OU
if that was true, it wouldn't just be the same 1 or 2 people topping the ladder with them. Swagplay that argument actually works because it made everything a coinflip. To use BP effectively you still need to predict well.

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:25:43 No.19670853 Report

Quoted By: >>19671650

>>19670843
it's still pretty mindless
also every BP team was the same carbon-copy dennis team (scolipede/espeon/vaporeon/smeargle/sylveon/zapdos)

at least now people can pick their own supporting pokemon and BP can maybe become a legitimate strategy

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:27:34 No.19670864 Report

Quoted By: >>19670885 >>19670897 >>19670927 >>19672065

>>19670503
>http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132125815
>Rain
>Focus Energy Kingdra
Scrub
>http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132111820
>Spores Scolipede on the second turn it's out instead of immediately
deserved to lose
>http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132129685
The only replay worth watching. The suck my nick guy was trying too hard to bait a rage response or quit.
Opponent could have made some better plays like switching Heatran in on Scoli instead of lolkeldeo or some double switches but I doubt the result would be much different. Good match, commentary aside
>http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-131835960
>Latias does enough damage to break Scoli's sub with psyshock
>Scoli clearly outspeeds
>lol no I'll switch to draco meteor cause it's so strong
>0.5 Satk
Deserved to lose.

1/4 bring better replays next time. Being in the 1900s doesn't mean you're not battling scrubs. I fight more skilled players in the 1500s.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:30:02 No.19670885 Report

Quoted By: >>19670929

>>19670864
suck my nick is dennisss's alt

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:32:13 No.19670897 Report

Quoted By: >>19670929

>>19670864
Psyshock uses the enemy defense instead of special defense, so neutral Draco Meteor is going to do more damage than a SE psyshock at something at +4 defense

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:37:38 No.19670927 Report

Quoted By: >>19670944 >>19671124

>>19670864
>rain guy
i agree with the kingdra thing
also most of his team relied on rain and he never sent out politoed, wtf

>2nd guy
rock tombing deoxys was a retarded move
he rock tombed scoli predicting the sub, that was a misplay that cost him the game, and the miss didn't help either

>3rd guy
mispredictions all the time, lots of switching
denissss is a homo

>last guy
psyshock wouldn'tve broken the sub
iron defense, remember? idiot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:37:43 No.19670929 Report

Quoted By: >>19670940

>>19670897
She was breaking the sub, that's all that matters.
Latias lowered her SAtk for no reason forcing herself to switch out because next turn she'd do shit damage.
She should have kept Psyshocking the sub until Scolipede switched to something else.
>>19670885
1) who is he
2) why do I care

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:39:50 No.19670940 Report

Quoted By: >>19670975

>>19670929
1) #1 on the ou ladder, popularized baton pass team, most "good" baton pass teams you saw before the ban are carbon copies of his
2) you don't have to, but not knowing makes you look like a giant jackass

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:40:24 No.19670944 Report

Quoted By: >>19670985

>>19670927
>psyshock wouldn'tve broken the sub
>iron defense, remember? idiot.
>insisting
go to turn 7 and tell me latias didn't break the sub.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:42:19 No.19670975 Report

Quoted By: >>19670985

>>19670940
I knew of the "original BP team" but I don't care about OU other than casual plays/showderp so naturally I don't know who he is
UU is my favorite tier

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:43:37 No.19670985 Report

Quoted By: >>19670994

>>19670944
oh my bad
in that case, he mispredicted a switch to espeon or something

>>19670975
>showderp
username?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:45:28 No.19670994 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670985
I champ very rarely. 3-4 times so far.
I think I do well but no way anyone remembers me, having champed for so little.
Exbo and Exbomustgitgud

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO gabe-newell-deal-with-it-o.gif, 1MiB, 320x180

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 13:58:40 No.19671070 Report

Quoted By: >>19671123 >>19671217

So Smogonartist, Smogoncentipede and Smogoncat are still causing problems, huh?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1401741036858s.jpg, 2KiB, 125x77

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:06:42 No.19671117 Report

Quoted By: >>19671149 >>19671451

I feel that if Baton Pass was altered to some take a chunk of hp for every pass (say, 10-15%), people would quit whining about how OP it is.

or maybe it could pass status conditions like toxic poisoning and burning

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:07:18 No.19671123 Report

Quoted By: >>19671136

>>19671070
>mfw Verlisify was right

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:07:19 No.19671124 Report

Quoted By: >>19671217

>>19670927
>criticizing the top ladder players
Post your own replays against Denisss and show us how much better you are.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:09:34 No.19671136 Report

Quoted By: >>19671217 >>19671800

>>19671123
what did he say?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:11:40 No.19671149 Report

Quoted By: >>19671175 >>19671451

>>19671117
What is Stealth Rock?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:13:16 No.19671165 Report

Quoted By: >>19671178 >>19671217

I don't understand, if they wanted to ban Baton Pass teams, why didn't they just ban the move Baton Pass?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:14:30 No.19671175 Report

Quoted By: >>19671240

>>19671149
Wwhat is magic bounce

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:14:53 No.19671178 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671165
Because they're hypocrites who advocate against complex bans but they end up issuing them anyway.

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:19:39 No.19671217 Report

Quoted By: >>19671286 >>19671324 >>19671346 >>19671626 >>19671800

>>19671070
you forgot vaporeon which is smogonwatercat

>>19671124
k
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-113805592
don't laugh at me please

>>19671136
he said "hurr durr smogen sucks lolscrubs" without knowing anything about smogon

so he's basically /vp/'s messiah

>>19671165
protip: having baton pass doesn't make a team a baton pass team

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:23:05 No.19671240 Report

Quoted By: >>19671270

>>19671175
What is Mold Breaker?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO mb.png, 2KiB, 376x44

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:28:44 No.19671270 Report

Quoted By: >>19671289 >>19671299

>>19671240
An ability that does not affect Magic bounce.
plus, pic related
Are we really going to play this game again?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:30:20 No.19671286 Report

Quoted By: >>19671289

>>19671217
ulcer you are shit never come back

literally worse than elibump.

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:30:46 No.19671289 Report

Quoted By: >>19671324

>>19671270
>an ability that does not affect magic bounce
you're dumb and wrong
are we really going to play this game again?

>>19671286
<3

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:31:57 No.19671299 Report

Quoted By: >>19671324

>>19671270
Mold Breaker bypasses Magic Bounce and I was under impression that Excadrill is still one of the best spinners.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:36:22 No.19671322 Report

Quoted By:

errrr can i get an executive summary of this

what did they ban in the first place

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:36:25 No.19671324 Report

Quoted By: >>19671367

>>19671289
>>19671299
I could swear it only affects direct attacks... g2g check
Still having to run SR MB Exca is pretty annoying because it's best set is Scarf MB (isn't it?)
>>19671217
Excellent plays, 10/10 replay

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:38:36 No.19671346 Report

Quoted By: >>19671367

>>19671217
we're talking about neo-BP here, not "how to beat a dead playstyle that everyone and their mom learned how to counter after 3 months the team archetype was public knowledge"

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO shrugs.jpg, 100KiB, 500x715

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:40:37 No.19671367 Report

Quoted By: >>19671451

>>19671324
you don't have to run sr mb exca at all
his new bp team has some neato new breakers including but not limited to talonflame, chatot, cacturne, volcarona

also thanks :)

>>19671346
they asked for a replay of me beating denissss
i gave them one

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 5217a194c856110b13000006_736.jpg, 78KiB, 604x394

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:50:06 No.19671451 Report

Quoted By: >>19671538

>>19671367
This ruins the point of the discussion... Wasn't (isn't) SR MB Exca the only way to do >>19671117 >>19671149 this?
Not like it's necessary, as shown in your replay (again, 10/10, I yelled HAHA FUCK YOU when he broke sleep clause)
>Chatot
>Cacturne
Mold Breakers? Sub Breakers? Stall Breakers?
Wait, let me rephrase.
>Chatot and Cacturne
>in OU
pic related

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO based sylveon.png, 178KiB, 400x910

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:56:25 No.19671494 Report

Quoted By: >>19671538

Hey, I know i'm at a really low rank right now but am I at least on the right track for dealing with neo- Baton Pass?

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132337452

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 14:59:21 No.19671538 Report

Quoted By: >>19671586 >>19671620 >>19671671

>>19671451
err i thought we were discussing how to beat neo-baton pass in general
not "how to be 100% sure to lay down rocks on his team" which doesn't guarantee a win either
also he has a taunter so i guess exca has to be holding the anti-taunt herb

chatot kills cucaracha speed buggy 100% of the time and turns smeargle into setup bait, the two of which are required to start a working bp chain
also, cacturne in OU sounds a little silly (even though people were using murkrow/musharna and shit to beat baton pass before) but chatot definitely isn't unusably bad

sub-breakers work alright but the only thing that really comes to mind is cloyster and scolipede can probably outsonic and send in vaporeon which cloyster will get one-shot by

as you said, a very limited amount of things get mold breaker and i'm not sure what you want to do with that

hyper offense still shits all over denissss's team i hasten to bet

>>19671494
d00d standard denissss bp carboncopy scolipede carries anti-taunt herb :(

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:07:39 No.19671586 Report

Quoted By: >>19671637 >>19672069

>>19671538
Thanks, I'll keep that in mind.

But at least taunt Megados should be able to taunt Espeon and do decent damage? Or should more be done to prepare?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:13:20 No.19671620 Report

Quoted By: >>19672069

>>19671538
>hyper offense still shits all over denissss's team i hasten to bet

Actually neo-BP fares better against HO because of dual screen Deo-S that turns stuff like Smogonbird and Mega Pinsir into potential set-up baits.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:14:30 No.19671626 Report

Quoted By: >>19672069

>>19671217
As usual, even at the top of the ladder
>noooo muh chain is broken by a shitmon that shouldnt be OU :^(

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:16:58 No.19671637 Report

Quoted By: >>19671661

>>19671586
Not a good idea unless Sylveon is dead.

And if Sylveon is dead, youve already won anyway

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:19:18 No.19671650 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670853
So do you complain about carbon copy hype offense teams too?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:19:32 No.19671651 Report

Quoted By: >>19671665

If they decide to nerf this any further, what's oing to happen? Even with 2 BP users per team the Scolipede+Espeon+recipient core might still be too strong, so it's just 1 BP user per team or bust? That's one hell of a complex ban.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:19:58 No.19671655 Report

Quoted By:

Wait, so what exactly was banned before?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO politly.png, 2KiB, 240x240

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:20:57 No.19671661 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671637
Sylveon isn't a huge threat atm because I can stay regular Gyarados and still be able to do decent damage or boost myself with Dragon Dance.

I can also use Curse Trevenant to pass damage along the BP chain or force them to start over. It also has the advantage of being immune to Spore and it can auto-heal semi reliably with Sitrus Berry.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:21:28 No.19671665 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671651
BP+Magic Bounce?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:21:57 No.19671668 Report

Quoted By: >>19671675

baton pass sucks in doubles

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO i dont understand.jpg, 55KiB, 630x472

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:22:30 No.19671671 Report

Quoted By: >>19672016 >>19672069

>>19671538
>err i thought we were discussing how to beat neo-baton pass in general
Yes we were
>not "how to be 100% sure to lay down rocks on his team" which doesn't guarantee a win either
No but this one asshole thought we did
>chatot kills cucaracha speed buggy 100% of the time and turns smeargle into setup bait, the two of which are required to start a working bp chain
252 SpA Life Orb Chatot Boomburst vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Scolipede: 320-376 (99.6 - 117.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
mmm i see. And we don't use Exploud because...? It doesn't get Taunt?
In this case why not use Infiltrator Crobat or Noivern? They get Taunt too I think (Crobat definitely does)
I mean, apart from killing Scolipede, what good is Chatot?
And why use Cacturne when there's Bisharp?
>as you said, a very limited amount of things get mold breaker and i'm not sure what you want to do with that
Nothing, it was a part of the dumb conversation above

Why don't they let Manaphy back down to OU? Hydration isn't as bad with no prema rain and Heart Swap might be a good check to BP teams.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:23:11 No.19671675 Report

Quoted By: >>19671693 >>19671709

>>19671668
Doubles sucks in general

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:24:36 No.19671684 Report

Quoted By: >>19671695 >>19671704

>http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-132129685
okcoolyo mad as fuck

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:26:37 No.19671693 Report

Quoted By: >>19671697

>>19671675
nintendo hates singles

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:27:07 No.19671695 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671684
>Gamefaqs

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:27:27 No.19671697 Report

Quoted By: >>19671702

>>19671693
Nintendo hates competitive games

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:28:32 No.19671702 Report

Quoted By: >>19671712

>>19671697
things singlefags say

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:29:01 No.19671703 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670503
Can't they just ban Sanic Alien to fix everything forever?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:29:04 No.19671704 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671684
fuck off denis

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:30:02 No.19671709 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671675
this is what smogtards believe

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:30:19 No.19671712 Report

Quoted By: >>19671736

>>19671702
Things meleefags say

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:33:12 No.19671736 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671712
Even at 2K elo on OU you're still bad at the game because singles isn't supported by nintendo. Remember that friend

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:33:16 No.19671737 Report

Quoted By: >>19671747 >>19671756 >>19671769 >>19671811

>>19670627
>>19670657

>mfw Klefki gets Stealth Rock and Magic Coat from move tutors

If they're gonna ban Deoxys-D/S for hazards lead set, they ARE gonna ban this little prick if that happens right? ...right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:34:32 No.19671747 Report

Quoted By: >>19671753

>>19671737
They should have banned Klefki instead of banning Swagger as a whole.
Klefki was the reason PranksterSwag was a thing in competitive play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:34:54 No.19671752 Report

Quoted By:

What are the current bans against baton pass teams?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:35:05 No.19671753 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671747
But he wasn't the only abuser by far.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:35:19 No.19671756 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671737
Smogon Wars: Return of the Keys

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:36:26 No.19671763 Report

Quoted By: >>19671775

>>19670561
Malamar with trick room and topsy turvey really rustles jimmies

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:36:57 No.19671769 Report

Quoted By: >>19671776 >>19671781 >>19671811

>>19671737
>252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Klefki through Light Screen: 255-302 (80.1 - 94.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Nah who cares
Shuca Berry Klefki new meta

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:37:22 No.19671774 Report

Quoted By: >>19671806

>>19670798
They have zero influence on VGC besides making for a easy way to get some practice. If anything the VGC scene has gotten stronger lately because VGC ruleset cash prize tournaments have become more common now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:37:26 No.19671775 Report

Quoted By: >>19671788

>>19671763
>yfw malamar gets infiltrator

shit nigga you only need that, just dont die and you're set

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:37:31 No.19671776 Report

Quoted By: >>19671811

>>19671769
>Not running Balloon Klefki

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:37:54 No.19671780 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670503
Same old, same old.

They should have learned after 3 fucking generations that it's impossible to reach balance in Pokemon.

Smogon should be like Battle Spot, make some essential bans and let the metagame evolve naturally instead of constantly throwing it back into square 1 with every new restriction.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:38:10 No.19671781 Report

Quoted By: >>19671811

>>19671769
Air Balloon?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:39:25 No.19671788 Report

Quoted By: >>19671802

>>19671775
>Infiltrator Contrary Malamar

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:40:57 No.19671800 Report

Quoted By: >>19671826

>>19671217
>>>19671136
>he said "hurr durr smogen sucks lolscrubs" without knowing anything about smogon
>so he's basically /vp/'s messiah
Trust /vp/ to pick a scrub for a messiah.

Verlisify is a laughing stock in the VGC community because of how terrible he is despite presenting himself as a veteran. Good god the guy actually went under 1500 rating in the last tournament. That is like near fucking impossible unless you run some shit like HM Slaves.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO pls why.png, 270KiB, 500x344

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:41:15 No.19671802 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671788
why do you need contrary if you're only there to topsy turvy

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:41:47 No.19671806 Report

Quoted By: >>19671839 >>19671868 >>19672052

>>19671774
What kind of teams do VGC players use? Do they run stuff that Smogon considers broken such as Double Team, Swagger, Blaziken, Mega Gar and Mega Kanga?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:42:12 No.19671811 Report

Quoted By: >>19671824

>>19671776
>>19671781
You'd use something else like Psychic first to 1) break the Balloon and 2) to not get OHKOed by Magic Coat (yes Klefki doesn't get it yet but see >>19671737 and >>19671769)

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:43:43 No.19671824 Report

Quoted By: >>19671859 >>19673241

>>19671811
If Klefki lays down SR + 1 layer of Spikes it has done its job.
Again, this is assuming Klefki learns SR in OR/AS. Magic Coat is a nice bonus but not 100% necessary.
Also consider the possibility of Klefki learning Magnet Rise, since most steel types do.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO downez.png, 415KiB, 827x1048

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:43:54 No.19671826 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671800
The only person who ever took Verlisify seriously was the guy that made the copypasta which was probably Verlis himself

Just looking at the guy's youtube videos tells you he's talking out of his ass.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:45:21 No.19671839 Report

Quoted By: >>19671892

>>19671806
double team and swagger are almost never used
Kanga is everywhere but at least there are no broken legendaries like deoxys

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:46:04 No.19671846 Report

Quoted By:

fuck em up deniss

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:47:33 No.19671859 Report

Quoted By: >>19673164

>>19671824
I hate to be *that* guy but
>Mandibuzz used Defog!

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:49:11 No.19671868 Report

Quoted By: >>19671881

>>19671806
Yes they do actually and the VGC communities attitude towards stuff like Perish Trap, Double Team, Mega Khan is simply "Deal with it." But most of the time they just consider them cute gimmicks and will usually have a check anyway. A VGC player will likely respond to Minimize abuse "that was fucking annoying but it was my fault for not running Perish Song or Taunt".

VGC format is Doubles format, you bring a full team of 6 and during team preview you pick 4 to actually use. Bans are kept to a bare minimum, so event pokemon, top end legendaries and species clause are the only real rules.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:49:58 No.19671873 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670777
Not the guy you replied to, but I was hoping you could clear some stuff up.

This Denis guy that crafted the team basically sat down and figured out a way to manipulate play to win very frequently. By playing BP people have suggested that the team 'plays itself,' but it obv. must have taken smarts and creativity to top the ladder with something. Smognogs are now scrambling to figure out how to re-tilt the game in order to level the playing field again, is that right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:50:32 No.19671881 Report

Quoted By: >>19671887 >>19672070

>>19671868
and don't forget Item clause
because smogscrubs can't realize that there are more than 5 items

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:51:15 No.19671887 Report

Quoted By: >>19671894

>>19671881
There are only about that many that are actually usable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:52:12 No.19671892 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671839
>double team and swagger are almost never used

Double Team yes. Swagger no. Swagger is a VGC staple move, it was even everywhere beginning of Gen 6 and late Gen 5.

Lots of people will use it in conjunction with Safeguard for a Safeswagger or for general parafusion in an emergency however will not rely on it. It's used more in a scenario where they know they're going to lose and weight the odds and realize 50/50 is better than a 100% loss.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:52:39 No.19671894 Report

Quoted By: >>19671911

>>19671887
>mfw I legit run sky plate talonflame with no problems
be creative

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:55:23 No.19671911 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671894
>not sharp beak

Sushi

Sushi Wed 18 Jun 2014 15:56:40 No.19671917 Report

Quoted By:

Only one or two pokemon on a team can use baton pass. Fixed.
If you're having trouble with espeon in the knock off generation, you should go to another board now

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:05:31 No.19671981 Report

Quoted By:

>mah baton pass
>deniss and his alts are only good at it

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:06:48 No.19671992 Report

Quoted By: >>19672077 >>19672132

>>19670503
So BP becomes very common and centralized. Then those "uncommon" and "obscure" movesets and Pokemon to counter BP play style no longer becomes obscure but necessary. Keep it up and then eventually BP will not become as common and the meta game will eventually flow back and forth, isn't that how a Metagame is supposed to work, a continuously evolving and flowing part of the culture, instead of something you keep stagnant it's bans?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:07:24 No.19671997 Report

Quoted By: >>19672045

>>19670707
Verlisify is an idiot. He doesn't know shit (ex.his Charge Beam Furfrou, Slurrpuff counters Mega Khan and Shadow Sneak Gengar). He is only doing to get money. Even his "rants". He and his drones are all idots and mentally challenged.

I don't like what Smogon is doing in Gen 6. But Gen 6 is a big mess in Singles. I try to get into VGC (Doubles because there is NO such thing as VGC Singles) but it is hard going from Singles to Doubles.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Dennis the menace.jpg, 38KiB, 460x288

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:08:36 No.19672006 Report

Quoted By: >>19672046

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:09:44 No.19672016 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671671
manaphy has been OU the whole time retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:11:29 No.19672033 Report

Quoted By:

>not running haze mega blastoise

wow
ok

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:13:19 No.19672045 Report

Quoted By: >>19672064 >>19672083 >>19672086 >>19676838

>>19671997
Go check out Eggyemporium and Nuggetbridge.

They are the best places to learn to play Doubles/VGC format and also change your team building mindset/approach.

http://nuggetbridge.com/articles/three-habits-ineffective-players/

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1403107716224.jpg, 31KiB, 460x288

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:13:26 No.19672046 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672006
ftfy

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:13:51 No.19672052 Report

Quoted By: >>19672073

>>19671806
Double Team sucks in every format, period. Minimize is borderline broken, but not in VGC, where there is simply no time to set-up.

Swagger is mostly used as a pseudo-Swords Dance support move for your own teammates. It's popularity dropped considerably since gen V though.

Blaziken sucks. MegaGar sucks a little less, but it's still nowhere near the top of the rankings.(the normal form is more common in my experience)

MegaKanga... yeah, that's the top dog of doubles right there. Can't say no to dat balk and dat power. People pretty much adapted to her presence though, given the huge popularity of random Will-O-Wisp mons and Intimidate abusers. Mega Lucario has been gaining some popularity too (Inner Focus means the base form can't be stopped by Fake Out).

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:15:13 No.19672064 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670707
> Verlisify was right.> Verlisify was right.hahaha Verlisy. That fool doesn't understand shit and only does it for the money. His drones are just as stupid and mentally challenged.

I think Smogon isn't doing well but IMO VGC (doubles) is pretty hard to get into after years of Singles.

>>19672045
I know about Nugget Bridge but the playstyle is different

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:15:16 No.19672065 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670864
Judging from the damage on vaporeon I think it was Swift Swim + Focus Energy. Not too horrible but still a pretty weird set.

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy

buttscab !!TORtoOQMEfy Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:15:43 No.19672069 Report

Quoted By:

hey i'm baaaaack!

>>19671586
taunt megados is guaranteed to be outsped and any decent bp player can see it coming from a mile away and can switch to something like sylveon/clefable/vaporeon to whittle it down
>>19671620
oic
but i still think the likes of talonflame can deal with deoxys before it fully sets up screens/rocks and u-turn out into an appropriate thing
>>19671626
talonflame, mandibuzz, and landorus are all ou
>>19671671
we don't use exploud because it's slow and it can't boost and taunt has nothing to do with it
i love my crobro but it can't beat espeon and noivern is even worse
cacturne is gimmicky and silly.

manaphy is back down to OU(or BL, i don't remember which) but it's mostly used for glowy tail and swapping that away is counterproductive

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:15:44 No.19672070 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671881
item clause is kind of pointless as far as balance goes, but it does make the game a little more varied and fun in my experience

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:16:33 No.19672073 Report

Quoted By: >>19672213

>>19672052
>MegaKanga... yeah, that's the top dog of doubles right there. Can't say no to dat balk and dat power. People pretty much adapted to her presence though, given the huge popularity of random Will-O-Wisp mons and Intimidate abusers. Mega Lucario has been gaining some popularity too (Inner Focus means the base form can't be stopped by Fake Out).
You also forgot to mention all Ghosts are a hard counter to M-Khan. Due to the fact Khan HAS to run a very specific set to be effective a ghost is pretty much a guaranteed stop to it long as you use your partner to protect it at all costs from Khan's partners.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:17:09 No.19672077 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671992
without BP, most team styles have a good chance against each other. But BP is this odd thing that completely goes against anything standard. And the problem is that teams that do well against BP are kinda shit vs other team styles.

Eventually you'd end up with BP < BP counterteam < everything else < BP

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:17:52 No.19672083 Report

Quoted By: >>19672101

>>19672045
>Many of you may have read Sirlin’s article on what makes a competitive game player a “scrub”, but if you have not, the gist of the article is that ineffective players will put arbitrary limits on what techniques or strategies they will use because they consider those strategies “cheap” or “unfair”.

hmm, sounds familiar

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:18:07 No.19672086 Report

Quoted By: >>19672113

>>19672045
I know about Nugget Bridge but the playstyle in Doubles is way different. IMO Singles to Rotation is an easier transition than from Singles to Doubles

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:22:09 No.19672101 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672083
You're missing the bit where Sirlin assumes an already balanced game, which Pokémon absolutely is not.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:22:47 No.19672113 Report

Quoted By: >>19672274

>>19672086
Rotation is basically a less broken Singles so that is obvious.

But yes Doubles actually requires so strong play, good prediction and reading of situations and matchups since you're always dealing with 2 threats at once instead of one. It's worth it though since you can pull off some pretty cool plays in Doubles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:25:42 No.19672132 Report

Quoted By: >>19672183

>>19671992
>isn't that how a Metagame is supposed to work, a continuously evolving and flowing part of the culture, instead of something you keep stagnant with bans
that's my biggest beef with smogon

they don't let the metagame evolve because they desperately want to keep the status quo by issuing more and more bans

bans have had a negative impact on players creativity too, they all have gotten incredibly lazy ("i don't want to run X to counter Y!") because they KNOW they just need to bitch hard enough to get the "undesirable" elements out of the metagame

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:27:19 No.19672143 Report

Quoted By: >>19672238

So how do you people think Smogon's metagame will end up? Will these 3 pokemon chains stay around and BP teams become an even more common thing but with different slots and more creative options? Will BP eventually just become another playstyle like Stall, balance & HO? Or will option 3 become a thing and BP teams are wiped out of the meta?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:30:26 No.19672183 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672132
>mfw not wanting every team to need mold breaker+ roar + dual chop haxorous is considered 'lazy'

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:31:31 No.19672193 Report

Quoted By: >>19672205 >>19672229 >>19672243

I still don't get why they won't ban double items.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:33:00 No.19672205 Report

Quoted By: >>19672218

>>19672193
Because HO would be forced to get creative.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:33:29 No.19672213 Report

Quoted By: >>19672243 >>19672255 >>19672263

>>19672073
yah, ghost are a pretty good counter against kanga too; sub aegislash in particular laughs at everything mega mom can throw at him

i also remember reading about some germanfag who made a defensive(-ish) gengar set with will-o-wisp and taunt that pretty much won him the toruney

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:33:55 No.19672218 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672205
>implying there is such a thing as 'creative HO'

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:35:01 No.19672229 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672193
Because most items are shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:36:00 No.19672238 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672143
I'm trying out 3 mon BP right now

Holy fucking shit the bullshit I'm running into, crits and flinches literally everywhere

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:36:35 No.19672243 Report

Quoted By: >>19672323

>>19672193
Because they don't want to.
>>19672213
Earthquake

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:38:00 No.19672255 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672213
That would be LinkYoshiMario, he is one of the main writers along with Wolfe for EggyEmporium and actually did a very cool retrospective specifically over there after his German National win report.

http://www.eggyemporium.com/random/yoshis-island-1-1-some-random-thoughts/

Running defensive Gengar was pretty much a stroke of genius and it's pretty much created a legion of copycats now who run it too to try counter Smeargle/Khan.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:38:44 No.19672263 Report

Quoted By: >>19672303 >>19672323 >>19672478

>>19672213
Aegislash doesn't want a EQ on switch in. And a good M!Khan player ALWAYS uses a Dark type move for Ghosts like Crunch or Sucker Punch.

IMO Singles is unbalanced. And IMO things like Mega Khan should be banned. IIRC even Masuda said it was way to powerful.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:38:56 No.19672267 Report

Quoted By: >>19672280

Why not simply ban Baton Pass?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:40:21 No.19672274 Report

Quoted By: >>19672692

>>19672113
>Rotation is basically a less broken Singles so that is obvious.
Debatable. Rotation is a massive "guess which pokemon i'm going to rotate now :^)" shitfest. It's a fun format, but incredibly hectic at times.

Speaking about Rotations, I can't wait for the new Eevee Cup. The first one was fun as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:40:45 No.19672280 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672267
Baton Pass has legitimate usage. Much like how Politoed and anything with Swift Swim didn't deserve to be in ubers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:43:09 No.19672292 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670823

>Skarmory
>Bannable

They wouldn't be this stupid... right? Right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:44:57 No.19672303 Report

Quoted By: >>19672328 >>19672379

>>19672263
>implying M-Khan ever runs EQ or Crunch in Doubles
There is a good reason for it too.

You don't EVER want to be stuck in a situation where you have to Earthquake your partner with M-Khan of all things just to get at your opponent, not to mention EQ would take a 25% damage penalty too.

Sucker Punch over Crunch is basically a requirement because you'd just be asking to get flattened by anything above 100 speed which makes Khan so much less terrifying. Sucker Punch stops Mienshao getting a free kill on you or Garchomp revenging you, or you getting flinch haxed by Aerodactyl.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:46:59 No.19672323 Report

Quoted By: >>19672379

>>19672263
>>19672243
Almost nobody runs EQ on Kanga in VGC, because for some reason spread moves only hit 1 time in Doubles. I literally never saw Crunch being used, be it in singles or in doubles, and I've ran into crap like all-special Mega Kangaskhan before.

For your knowledge the standard M-Kanga set is Fake Out/Return/Sucker Punch/Power-Up Punch, with Substitute, Protect and Double Edge sometimes added into the mix.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:47:36 No.19672328 Report

Quoted By: >>19672379 >>19672455 >>19672493

>>19672303
Yo, in singles is Mega Kengaskhan is Fake out/Return/Poweruppunch/EQ in general? I am in fear of getting walled by airborne ghosts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:52:49 No.19672379 Report

Quoted By: >>19672455

>>19672303
>>19672323

Sorry I was talking about Singles.

>>19672328
In Singles they mostly run PuP/EQ/Return/Sucker Punch or Crunch
Bulky MegaKhan can run Seismic Toss for consistent 200 damage per turn.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:58:54 No.19672455 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672328
No it's Fake Out/Return/Power-up Punch/Sucker Punch. More recently Double-Edge/Fake Out/Sucker Punch/Hammer Arm has become popular for immediate KO power.

Khan's most popular partners tend to be Smeargle for the dreaded Dark Void/Transform strat. Amoonguss for Rage Powder to draw away fighting attacks and defensive Gengar for breaking Smeargle/Khans and ghosts who like to stop Khan.

>>19672379
I know about Singles Khan and no problems but previous posts were clearly talking about Doubles/VGC.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 16:59:55 No.19672478 Report

Quoted By: >>19672544

>>19672263
>IIRC even Masuda said it was way to powerful.
he never said that, stop repeating shit /vp/ says but actually doesn't have a clue about

if you actually read the link some people posted here as a "proof", you would now that masuda basically tip-toed around the question saying things like "of course the new mega evolutions are a great way to enhance the gameplay (blahblah)". Some people in the comment section even DEFENDED mega kangaskhan saying she's not that hard to play around

face it, they're not gonna do shit about her at least until gen 7

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:01:34 No.19672493 Report

Quoted By: >>19672522

>>19672328
Singles Khan doesn't run Fake Out, it's strictly a Doubles thing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:02:46 No.19672500 Report

Quoted By: >>19672557

>>19670823
If smogon was around when gen I and gen II were played Tauros and Snorlax would have been banned 100%. Just a food for thought.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:05:16 No.19672522 Report

Quoted By: >>19672539

>>19672493
> Singles Khan doesn't run Fake Out, it's strictly a Doubles thing.
People do use fake out on mega kang is singles. They're just bads. Most people are bads.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:07:30 No.19672539 Report

Quoted By: >>19672602

>>19672522
Japs love to run Fake Out on M-Khan on the BS Singles ladder for some reason.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:08:51 No.19672544 Report

Quoted By: >>19672575

>>19672478
I said if IIRC so I could be wrong.
But in Singles running a pokemon with a specific set just to counter Mega Khan is stupid and a liability for your team.

GF isn't doing anything to make Singles balanced because it is not in their interest. For them only VGC matters. For Doubles I think Mega Khan isn't that broken.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:10:28 No.19672557 Report

Quoted By: >>19672598

>>19672500
Smogon was around in Gen 2 though under another name but with members who later founded Smogon, they were mostly mIRC based, hell I remember the old Gen 2 IRC simulator script before Netbattle came along and made it irrelevant.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:12:08 No.19672575 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672544
Even in Doubles/VGC M-Khan is still pretty broken and unhealthy for the game, just everyone learnt to deal with it. If it suddenly had it's Parental Bond boost nerfed I could assure you nobody would cry about it except the noobs and scrub kiddies.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:16:20 No.19672598 Report

Quoted By: >>19673177 >>19673318

>>19672557
You mean this?
http://www.math.miami.edu/~jam/azure/forum/tuff/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=7;t=001212
>mfw the dude basically predicted abilities

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:16:56 No.19672602 Report

Quoted By: >>19672621 >>19672633

>>19672539
Fake out is good where one of the most common items is focus sash.

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:19:21 No.19672621 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672602
Not only that but priority damage, making you able to 2HKO several pokemon with sucker punch, return, and other moves.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:21:39 No.19672633 Report

Quoted By: >>19672645

>>19672602
>Focus Sash
>Against Mega Kanga

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:22:49 No.19672645 Report

Quoted By: >>19672659

>>19672633
>Reading comprehension
>You

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:25:36 No.19672659 Report

Quoted By: >>19672674

>>19672645
>Japs love to run Fake Out on M-Khan on the BS Singles ladder for some reason.
>Fake out is good where one of the most common items is focus sash.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:27:34 No.19672674 Report

Quoted By: >>19672755

>>19672659
MK hits twice with parental bond.
Why use to slashbreak?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:29:03 No.19672692 Report

Quoted By: >>19672702

>>19672274
>eevee cup with no tutor moves
n-nintendo wouldn't do that, would they?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:30:24 No.19672702 Report

Quoted By: >>19672723 >>19672736

>>19672692
The only moves that are relevant are Umbreons Foul Play, Flareons Superpower and Sylveons Hyper Voice

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:32:49 No.19672723 Report

Quoted By: >>19672741 >>19676474

>>19672702
flareon also wants iron tail and leafeon wants knock off

yes, their movepools are THAT shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:34:13 No.19672736 Report

Quoted By: >>19672741 >>19673292

>>19672702
oh and jolteon wants signal beam

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:34:46 No.19672741 Report

Quoted By: >>19673276

>>19672723
>>19672736
God fucking dammit ORAS better have tutor

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera

Tariq 4699-7157-1718 IGN Magenera Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:36:33 No.19672755 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672674
Gengar, but as I stated from my other post hit can make for 2HKO. That and Kanga isn't fast on first turn so that free damage with no one doing shit to you usually unless inner focus, but those are usually Lucario's. You can kill a mon in two turns with out taking damage, you can break sash on ghost. Fake out is probably losing play for crunch and earthquake though, because of gengar WoW. 3v3 is fast,and if you can get by with out taking damage, it means your team is going to be that much harder to go down. Outside of that it's just free damage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:41:19 No.19672800 Report

Quoted By: >>19672802

I don't know if I am a scrub or not, but why doesn't anyone use a Phazer like Swampert, or fucking Skarmory against BP?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:41:46 No.19672802 Report

Quoted By: >>19672829

>>19672800
Magic Bounce shits over Phazing

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:45:05 No.19672829 Report

Quoted By: >>19672839 >>19673055

>>19672802
How about something with Sturdy + Red Card? Too gimmicky?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 17:46:00 No.19672839 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672829
Yes, the new BP team runs Rocks now, so Sturdy Card is a pretty bad gimmick

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:09:37 No.19673055 Report

Quoted By: >>19673517

>>19672829
there's no point in trying to come up with counters to BP, everyone is going to try to claim it unbeatable

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:20:26 No.19673164 Report

Quoted By:

>>19671859
Because Mandibuzz using Defog has totally stopped Bisharp and Thundurus from murdering her and the rest of her team.
That's the point. Even if Deo-D/S are banned, once Klefki gets SR (very likely in OR7AS) people will just run that instead.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO WaiLOL.png, 32KiB, 679x427

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:21:58 No.19673177 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672598

>Wobbuffet and Psyduck should pop out of their balls and replace your current battler
>as an ability

Get on it, GF

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO derp.jpg, 18KiB, 225x225

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:29:41 No.19673241 Report

Quoted By: >>19673315

>>19671824
>Klefki with Stealth Rock, Magic Coat and Magnet Rise

All of them have been tutor moves in the past and all of them make sense on Klefki.
If that does happen expect the little bastard to shoot up in the top 20 range and HO dominating until it gets banned.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:33:22 No.19673272 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670823
They actually banned Hidden Power on legendaries in Gen 2 for a while because Zapdos and Raikou with HP Ice/Grass/Water to get past ground and rock types were too str0nk.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:33:38 No.19673276 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672741
joke's on you, the eevee tourney is before ORAS

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:35:20 No.19673292 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672736
Jolteon wants to be a less awful M-Manectric.
And Raikou.
And Rotom-W.
And Zapdos.
And Thundurus-I.
And Thundurus-T.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:38:10 No.19673315 Report

Quoted By:

>>19673241
Klefki @ Focus Sash
-Spikes
-SR
-Magic Coat
-Magnet Rise

Pair it with Bisharp and/or Defiant Thundurus-I + Heatran.
Now tell me what's stopping it from laying down SR+Spikes and crap all over anything that tries to Defog/spin.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:38:17 No.19673318 Report

Quoted By: >>19673332 >>19673333

>>19672598
>http://www.math.miami.edu/~jam/azure/forum/tuff/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=7;t=001212
Some guy said the classic Charizard->dragon (happened)
Also pic related
9 years earlier he predicted imposter Ditto and 12 years earlier kind-of predicted mega evolution

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:39:16 No.19673332 Report

Quoted By:

>>19673318
Everyone has stupid ideas, including GF.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO imposter.png, 21KiB, 1426x344

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:39:20 No.19673333 Report

Quoted By: >>19673420

>>19673318

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:46:15 No.19673395 Report

Quoted By:

Smogon pussying out and implement and unecessary complex ban instead of dealing with the root of the problem is nothing new, in fact this is Gen 5 all over again.
Instead of banning Drizzle (fucking LEVEL 1 GROUDON AND KYOGRE where proven to be broken in Gen 3 and 4) they left it there and banned Drizzle+Swift Swim, Manaphy, Tornadus-T, Thundurus-I and almost banned Keldeo too.

I hope they learned their lesson this time and stop fucking around with complex bans when the culprit is easily identified.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO espeed.png, 16KiB, 1445x279

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:47:28 No.19673420 Report

Quoted By:

>>19673333
>checked
Guy 1:
12 years later, I'm still wishing anon
Guy 2:
There is a 120BP priority move anon. Good news, Snorlax didn't get it. Bad news, Neither did Pidgeot

Guys, this thread has legitimately the most feels of all of /vp/s "feel threads" with the same pics posted again and again
These are the wishes of people some of which now probably never played pokemon in the last 10 years and now have a family and kids
That's some deep shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:58:53 No.19673510 Report

Quoted By:

>>19670559
>Oh no someone made a synergistic team
>It's OP lets ban it
>Haha you guys dont get the metagame my HO teams cant OHKO them so they cant be fair

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 18:59:45 No.19673517 Report

Quoted By: >>19673537

>>19673055
Many ways to beat BP, but they all involve something too niche to be useful against standard meta. Competitive would devolve into BP>Standard>Anti-BP>BP rock-paper-scissors with victory determined by the roll of the matchmaker.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 19:03:09 No.19673537 Report

Quoted By: >>19673588

>>19673517
You mean like the metagame right now is HO>stall>bulky offense>HO rock/paper/scissors?
In that case BP adds more diversity.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 19:09:13 No.19673588 Report

Quoted By:

>>19673537
HO>stall>bulk is a generality, BP-based triangle is a strict hierarchy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 23:38:20 No.19676474 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672723
What would Flareon even do with Iron Tail? At least wish for it to get Superpower back so it has something resembling coverage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 18 Jun 2014 23:50:06 No.19676601 Report

Quoted By:

My favorite way to shut down BP teams is Tentacruel.
He's fast and bulky, carries Haze, Toxic Spikes to spread poison on passing, and when holding a Focus Sash he's almost guaranteed to survive and shut it down. Plus he's got a lot of unpredictability with Rapid Spin, Knock Off, Magic Coat for Taunt, and even Mirror Coat to reflect back a Stored Power when sashed. Though they're all egg or tutor moves, so certain combinations are limited. But he's really useful and unpredictable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 19 Jun 2014 00:14:23 No.19676838 Report

Quoted By:

>>19672045
>you do not get CP or tournament wins for style points.

Kek.

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