/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #20252924

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VGC General

Anonymous Wed 30 Jul 2014 22:48:03 No.20252924 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By:

Welcome to VGC General!

Worlds is just around the corner, here is the invite list
http://nuggetbridge.com/articles/2014-pokemon-world-championships-invitee-list/

>I want to get into VGC, can you help me?
http://nuggetbridge.com/
http://www.eggyemporium.com/
http://www.oldmanvgc.com/

>old man vgc isn't loading
Refresh the page

TotT: What are your Worlds predictions?

Cybertron lands 3rd place because of Swagger again, Ray wins it all again... talk about boring

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 30 Jul 2014 23:25:36 No.20253495 Report

Quoted By:

bump

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 01:22:26 No.20255137 Report

Quoted By:

bump

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 02:04:32 No.20255787 Report

Quoted By:

So who here has an worlds invite besides Jeudy who posted his in the last thread?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 02:08:46 No.20255845 Report

Quoted By: >>20258421 >>20262097 >>20262115

ToTT: Ray Rizzo wins Worlds with Dream Ball Aegislash

I've been an on and off again VGC player since X&Y first released and have been trying to use Pokemon that would normally be overlooked along with standard Pokemon. I haven't found a good balance though due to the increased amount of Garchomp, Mega Kangaskhan, and legendaries.

What are some lesser known Pokemon that can counter these bigger threats?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 03:57:46 No.20257335 Report

Quoted By: >>20258421

Is anyone watching the nuggetbridge invitationals this saturday?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 04:09:09 No.20257477 Report

Quoted By: >>20257521

Can this Zapdos be of any use? If so, what sets do you recommend?

Zapdos
Nature: Bold
IVs: 30/31/20/31/31/31
HP: Ice

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 04:12:28 No.20257521 Report

Quoted By: >>20258504

>>20257477
Zapdos has been picking up steam late metagame with most of Korea being dominated by zapdos, japan winner using agilidos, and zapdos showing up even in America.

For a bold set I'd recommend tbolt/hpice/twave/roost

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 05:24:17 No.20258421 Report

Quoted By: >>20261848 >>20262141

>>20257335
I'm working, so no

>>20255845
There is no true Garchomp counter until Togekiss is legal, so for now, Garchomp has a way to hit pretty much everything VGC legal for good damage, which is why it's so popular

Countering Kang is a matter of building your team with Kang in mind, like having 3 normal resistances or something

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 05:28:42 No.20258504 Report

Quoted By:

>>20257521
Everytime I see Zapdos, I assume Swagger because of Rizzo

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:29:39 No.20261831 Report

Quoted By: >>20261856

oh cool someone else decided to make a general.
>implying ray won't win worlds with six dream ball mons

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:31:57 No.20261848 Report

Quoted By: >>20261866 >>20262104

>>20258421
>There is no true Garchomp counter until Togekiss is legal
It would still get 3HKOd by rock slide I'd imagine, I never had much trouble against chomp. I always felt its damage output was a bit low with those STABs (dclaw 80, EQ 75 in dubs.) life orb garchomp is the way to go imo

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:32:33 No.20261856 Report

Quoted By: >>20261876 >>20261927

>>20261831
the dream ball shit is getting old
everyone is acting like he hasn't cheated to save time on getting Pokemon like the rest of us

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:33:47 No.20261866 Report

Quoted By: >>20261885

>>20261848
sure it may be 3KOed but Dazzling Gleam can be a 1-2HKO on Chomp

I wouldn't be surprised to see Togekiss to be 4KOed, Pokemon get really bulky

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:34:56 No.20261876 Report

Quoted By:

>>20261856
I don't actually care, I'm drinking the tears of breeder fags whining about cheating. Honestly, I expect an American to win but not Ray. Maybe Alex Ogloza, maybe Omari Travi

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:36:40 No.20261885 Report

Quoted By: >>20261918

>>20261866
252+ SpA Life Orb Togekiss Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 159-190 (86.8 - 103.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

you'd need specs to KO in dubs with dazzling gleam, you'd be better off running HP ice if you were that worried about chomp. I can't wait to run togekiss for other reasons though, that fairy typing is so cool and gives so many options

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:41:28 No.20261918 Report

Quoted By: >>20261930

>>20261885
in that case investing in bulk is good, Dazzling Gleam will 2KO Chomp no problem.

I'm just looking forward to using a fairy that ISN'T Gardevoir or Azumarill

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:42:36 No.20261927 Report

Quoted By: >>20261940

>>20261856
CyberGadget is here, anything is now possible

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:43:18 No.20261930 Report

Quoted By:

>>20261918
yeah you could run sitrus or charti berry toge and shit all over chomp, with that special defense you wall every special dragon except like tbolt latios. or a scarf air slash set to flinch kang to death

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:44:40 No.20261940 Report

Quoted By:

>>20261927
I saw. I got the Diancie and Xerneas that came of it. Though I'd be paranoid bringing anything edited from it because I don't understand this gen's PID system at all or how it connects to being legal or not legal

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:44:56 No.20261943 Report

Quoted By: >>20261954 >>20261959 >>20261999

So here's a question for you guys...

Do you think the Kalos-born rule will ever be lifted for the VGC?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:46:07 No.20261954 Report

Quoted By: >>20262169

>>20261943
of course, ORAS mons and later generations will be allowed. but its pretty much confirmed that no pokemon before gen 6 will be allowed ever again

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:46:56 No.20261959 Report

Quoted By: >>20262169

>>20261943
I'm thinking that from gen 6 and onward, there will be a "native" symbol dependant on the region the Poke is gotten from, and THAT I don't see being lifted

like "Each Pokemon must have a Native Symbol" or some shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:50:52 No.20261999 Report

Quoted By: >>20262025 >>20262028 >>20262066 >>20262169

>>20261943
Never.

>Prunes out generated shit from previous Gens
>"Resets" the metagame, specially move tutors from previous generations which also makes the game easier to play now that you don't need to break your ass getting a move tutor from 3 games ago just to be able to build a team

It also helps with the image of the game a lot. More people are way willing to play on the events now that they have the certainty that the Pokemon are "legit" instead of generating and RNG'ing festivals like it was during 5th.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:55:00 No.20262025 Report

Quoted By: >>20262066

>>20261999
Yeah, that and they made a big effort to power down the metagame, no gems, nerfed hp, no powerful tutor moves, banned genies. I just hope we get another low kick tutor ffs

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:55:21 No.20262028 Report

Quoted By: >>20262051 >>20262066 >>20262141

>>20261999
also it gets rid of the genies
fuuuuuuck those faggots

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 11:58:18 No.20262051 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262028
it was really the typings that made genies so powerful. Thundurus in particular only had two weaknesses, ice and rock, both of which had no STAB users that could OHKO thundy except like stone edge ttar or mamoswine. Landorus also had GOAT typing

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1398886821859.jpg, 42KiB, 300x297

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:00:38 No.20262066 Report

Quoted By: >>20262086 >>20262120

>>20261999
And Rizzo did a wonderful job at breaking that with his Aegislash. You can bet your ass the attendance will drop like mad if Rizzo wins Worlds this year, it will be a huge blow for the VGC community, and trust it's been slowly building up since 6th started.

>>20262025
>>20262028
Genies aren't banned, they just aren't available yet. Pray god that they aren't the roaming Pokes on ORAS because goddamn.

Get ready for Latios to make a comeback next year too.

Honestly, they should just ban every legend from VGC. Or at least limit them per team ala VGC10. The good legends are way too centralizing on VGC.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:02:38 No.20262080 Report

Quoted By: >>20262146 >>20262169

funny thing about that Aegislash is that if you or me tried to pull that shit at Nats and someone said something, we would be DQed
The judges let the shit slide because Rizzo was Rizzo

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:02:47 No.20262086 Report

Quoted By: >>20262095 >>20262126

>>20262066
they're banned just like everyone pokemon that wasn't in the Kalos dex. They're not coming back anon, there is no reason gamefreak would allow them back into the meta after three years of them dominating vgc, they want something different

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:04:42 No.20262095 Report

Quoted By: >>20262109

>>20262086
VGC15 will most likely open up for everything and if the genies are catchable in ORAS then you can bet your ass they will be allowed in VGC15. You are delusional if you really think Kalosdex-only will stay forever.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:05:21 No.20262097 Report

Quoted By: >>20262152

>>20255845
Garchomp is countered by a lot of things, but I guess the problem is the amount of variation in its sets (mostly its item) means there isn't one guaranteed counter to all Garchomp.
Basically anything fast with Ice (my favourite is Weavile) counters most, but loses out against Yache and sometimes Sash.
Fast or prankster WoW users beat a lot, but Lum berry is also one of the most popular items.
Intimidate is a safe bet to nerf it, at least.

Ferrothorn is arguably the biggest counter to Mega Kangaskhan, if you go rocky helmet+iron barbs. I've seen Gourgeist do terrible things to ones that don't run crunch (i.e, most of them) too. Again, prankster WoW makes it struggle, although Kangaskhan is so terrifying it often ends up still dealing massive damage even when burned.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:05:58 No.20262104 Report

Quoted By:

>>20261848
can't beat the scarf dude

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:06:33 No.20262109 Report

Quoted By: >>20262128 >>20262146 >>20262169

>>20262095
I'm not saying kalos-only, I'm saying only pokemon gen 6 and later. And a mod on nugget bridge who has spoken to Chris Brown, the event planner for VGC, heard it from him its basically confirmed, no pre-gen 6 mons anymore.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:06:56 No.20262115 Report

Quoted By:

>>20255845
Rocky Helmet Hippowdon is a pretty good stopgap to everything physical in VGC format as long you have a hard counter to Rotom-W to partner it with.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:07:21 No.20262120 Report

Quoted By: >>20262124 >>20262146

>>20262066
I was under the impression that VGC10 had a 'restricted list' rather than all legendaries? So you could still have lesser legendaries like the birds, regis and so on, but only one of the ridiculously uber ones?

As long as Cresselia isn't available in ORAS, it'll be okay.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:08:18 No.20262124 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262120
you could use two restricted pokemon on your team, restricted meaning box legends like palkia, dialga, mewtwo, etc. The regis I believe were unrestricted but are competitively unviable

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:08:38 No.20262126 Report

Quoted By: >>20262144

>>20262086
To be honest I doubt that the people who choose which legendaries are available in the new games pick them based on the metagame connotations.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:08:53 No.20262128 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262109
I kind of enjoy Kalos only. It puts everyone on even footing and its almost like a format breakdown like with MtG

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:10:40 No.20262141 Report

Quoted By:

>>20258421
>Countering Kang is a matter of building your team with Kang in mind, like having 3 normal resistances or something
Problem with this line of thought is it makes your team too specialized. Sometimes countering Khan can be as simple as running something bulky with a Rocky Helmet or killing it first.

It's the whole reason why some stuff Hydreigon has become popular because it can outright kill Khan.

>>20262028
Fucking this. The genies were as close to the most broken thing in the VGC format. I would still fear Thundurus pulling it's shit more than I'd ever a Khan sweep.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:11:14 No.20262144 Report

Quoted By: >>20262155 >>20262185

>>20262126
you'd be surprised how responsive gamefreak is getting to VGC and metagame changes. they buffed WoW after the cybertron incident in '13, created safety goggles after Arash spored Kosuge's whole team, and made sure the genies weren't present in 2014 after they were on every goddamn team in '13

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:11:51 No.20262146 Report

Quoted By: >>20262158

>>20262080
I was disgusted at how NB locked out and deleted every thread trying to discuss that matter. I lost all the respect I had for that place since then, specially Scott who I always thought wrote kinda nice posts.

>>20262109
I still don't get what you are trying to say here.

I'm just saying that in future rulings, which will most likely be National Dex, if the genies are catchable in, say, ORAS, they would be allowed in that hypothetical future VGC because it would be National Dex. The genies are gonna come back sooner or later unless a hard-ban is placed on them.

I think we are mixing up kalos-born with kalos-dex here and each of us is going with a different one in our argument.

>>20262120
More or less, yeah. My suggestion would be to apply that restriction not only to the big legends but to every legend.

Making it like Battle of Legends would work too. Just too legends for team, every legend is limited like that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:12:24 No.20262152 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262097
>Ferrothorn is arguably the biggest counter to Mega Kangaskhan, if you go rocky helmet+iron barbs. I've seen Gourgeist do terrible things to ones that don't run crunch (i.e, most of them) too.
No Khan worth its shit would run Crunch because it'd then give up it's priority. There are so many things which can check Khan so much easier once it's lost it's priority

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:12:54 No.20262155 Report

Quoted By: >>20262165 >>20262170

>>20262144
>cybertron incident

What's that?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:13:16 No.20262158 Report

Quoted By: >>20262267

>>20262146
they're not going to put the genies in ORAS, they're not gonna bring them back into the game any more than they're gonna bring back palkia or dialga

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:13:59 No.20262165 Report

Quoted By: >>20262653

>>20262155
He pretty much had a guaranteed win if WoW hit and the thing just kept missing multiple times.

Same old, same old.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO [Shagging Intensifies].gif, 515KiB, 342x270

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:14:27 No.20262169 Report

Quoted By: >>20262183

>>20261999
>>20261959
>>20261954

Thanks, guys, I needed that info.

That was actually a trick question, I just wanted to make sure folks were paying attention to the confirmation from Chris Brown that >>20262109 mentioned.

>>20262080

To be fair, most of the judges consisted of NuggetBridge flunkies.

The same thing occurs in the TCG (which I compete in, please don't kill me over this. I take part in VGC competitions too), only it consists of flunkies from the PokeGym and SixPrizes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:14:29 No.20262170 Report

Quoted By: >>20262185 >>20262195

>>20262155
Aaron Zheng missed five WoWs in a row against Ryosuke Kosuge, then got haxed to death next round by thunder wave/swagger spam from thundy. Probably the reason they made electric types immune to PAR this gen too. Gamefreak is getting good about responding to OP shit in the meta. Kang is definitely getting a nerf, Masuda himself said it was OP

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:15:52 No.20262183 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262169
>To be fair, most of the judges consisted of NuggetBridge flunkies.
I fucking hate NB. Scott Glaza is just a flat out bully and asshole, its a huge circle jerk and they're incredibly rude to new players. No, I never even posted there I just lurked and watched how they responded to people. I would never use that shithole site

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:16:19 No.20262185 Report

Quoted By: >>20262196 >>20262203 >>20262213 >>20262215

>>20262144
>created safety goggles after Arash spored Kosuge's whole team
Which is funny because that was because Ryosuke played like shit.

>Shit, his Amoongus fucked me over match 1. What should I do?
>I know! I'll bring my Cresselia in and set up TR! Surely that will work!
>Wait, shouldn't I just use my Taunt Thundurus instead?
>Nah, I'll go with Cresselia.

Nigga was dumb. And I still cringe whenever I remember how he let Heatran on that Earthquake.

>>20262170
>Masuda himself said it was OP

And then he said this.

>Mr. Masuda: At a recent Pokémon tournament in Japan, Kangaskhan and Garchomp were used quite a lot, so I wouldn’t deny that those seem a bit too prominent. But for now, it appears to me that the players seem to have a good grip on strategies to counter one another, so I think we’ve achieved an adequate sense of balance.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:17:25 No.20262195 Report

Quoted By: >>20262203 >>20262220 >>20262224

>>20262170
I'm curious what they can do to nerf Kangaskhan without changing its base stats though. Maybe make the first hit only 75% its regular power, or the second one only 25% of its regular power, instead of the current 100%+50%?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:17:26 No.20262196 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262185
I know, Arash played an amazing game. I'm not one of those casuals who cries LOL SPORE 2 WIN. but particularly rage powder more than spore was OP and needed a nerf

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:18:41 No.20262203 Report

Quoted By: >>20262257

>>20262195
make parental bond 1.3 power.
>>20262185
After the kanga mirror at nationals, and potentially at worlds, I think they'll nerf it. Just because a metagame adapts to an OP pokemon doesn't make it not OP, I'm sure masuda understands this

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:20:18 No.20262213 Report

Quoted By: >>20262227

>>20262185
Him letting Heatran take the EQ was one of my biggest learning experiences in VGC, and it really expanded on the linear way I viewed the game.

>Why would you EQ when it was obvious
>If he takes the quake then its GG
>If he doesn't then he doesn't even lose any ground because the idiot brought Cress and it's sitting their doing nothing

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:20:35 No.20262215 Report

Quoted By: >>20262227 >>20262254

>>20262185
>And I still cringe whenever I remember how he let Heatran on that Earthquake.
I thought that was a misplay at first too, until I thought about it. He was certainly expecting the amoonguss switch in, expecting Arash to anticipate a protect from tran and a TR from cress, so he erupted to catch shroom on the switch. it was a bold play to make being down a set, it just didn't pay off

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:20:58 No.20262220 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262195
Just simply reducing the damage boost of Parental Bond would be enough. 50% is fucking ridiculous when it applies to something as general as contact moves.

Though it doesn't really fix the real problem is that the dual hitting nature of the ability allows it to use PuP as a psuedo Swords Dance whilst doing damage and that STAB Return/Double Edge would hurt like hell even without a damage boost.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:21:21 No.20262224 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262195
Just retcon secondary effects of moves. A kanga without PuP is a powerful force, but it is not some broken meta dominating bullshit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:21:41 No.20262227 Report

Quoted By: >>20262250 >>20262254

>>20262213
its not as simple as that though, see>>20262215
if he EQ'd into a protect and let TR go up, he'd eat shit from an eruption the next turn and probably lose the game. it was a coinflip of, either EQ mamo or switch in mushroom, he made the right call

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:22:44 No.20262233 Report

Quoted By: >>20262255

Is NG really that bad? You guys make it sound like the devil.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:26:38 No.20262250 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262227
>it was a coinflip
You mean it was 50/50?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:26:49 No.20262254 Report

Quoted By: >>20262293

>>20262215
>>20262227
It obviously was a high risk/high reward play but risks heavily out-weight the benefits at that point because 1. Ryosuke had already lost one game. 2. The game had barely just begun, even if he had made a safer play, even if a bit more disadvantageous play, he would still have had a chance to recover afterwards.

He lost his cool and got desperate. You shouldn't make win/lose plays like that so early and so hastily.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:27:06 No.20262255 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262233
Unfortunately its probably the best for VGC that we have. I don't post on the forums, but I've been browsing for a while and it seems to me like too much of a 'cool kids club' than an actual site.

I've run a few digital publications and it's hard to keep it from happening, but it is doable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:27:54 No.20262257 Report

Quoted By: >>20262272

>>20262203
>make parental bond 1.3 power.
Problem is even at 1.3 power Parental Bond still has enough power to do the same things it does now. It's still more than what even Iron Fist gives or LO.

125 base attack is enough to cause huge problems even if it didn't get a damage boost.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:29:08 No.20262267 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262158
> they're not gonna bring them back into the game any more than they're gonna bring back palkia or dialga
Why do you say that?
Having the Kami trio actually makes sense in Hoenn because of weather and shit, it's pretty likely that we will see them in Hoenn

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:29:30 No.20262272 Report

Quoted By: >>20262299 >>20262336

>>20262257
Actually 1.3 is the same as Life Orb, and less than Tough Claws. The sash-breaking power makes a difference, although that is somewhat balanced by also allowing berry activations between hits.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:30:52 No.20262292 Report

Quoted By:

How about 20%? It would be like an Expert Belt, sorta.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:30:53 No.20262293 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262254
idk I think Arash could just as easily have switched in amoonguss, at any rate it was the wrong read to make against Arash, theory aside you have to play to the opponent you're facing and it was the wrong call ultimately

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:32:03 No.20262299 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262272
If I recall it's actually slightly less than LO due to the way it's calculated in that LO is a direct boost to your stats whilst Parental Bond is a boost to the moves BP.

Traditionally speaking in most situations move BP tends to add slightly more damage even more so at the lv50 VGC is played at.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:35:23 No.20262329 Report

Quoted By: >>20262362 >>20262363 >>20262364 >>20262601

>Want to get into VGC
>Everything is at 50
>EVs, speed tiers and everything stat related is confusing as hell now
What's the reasoning for lvl 50? Why is it so hard to make the damn thing auto lvl to 100? Does lvl 50 make the HP bar go down faster or what?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:35:57 No.20262336 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262272
Technically a 1.3x Parental Bond would still be stronger than LO due to the way it's calculated in that LO is a direct boost to your stats whilst Parental Bond is a boost to the moves BP.

Traditionally speaking in most situations move BP tends to add slightly more damage than a boost to stats even more so at the lv50 VGC is played at.

I recall due to that same reason a Sheer Force LO attack actually is boosted by a factor of closer to 1.7x than 1.6x like you'd think because the boosts end up multiplying each other.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:38:42 No.20262362 Report

Quoted By: >>20262384

>>20262329
As it is, Pokémon above level 50 are levelled down, and Pokémon below level 50 keep their original levels. This means that you can use lower levels for things like FEAR, Aron, or even underspeeding by going level 49.
If it's held at level 100, then you either need to autolevel EVERYTHING, removing those (admittedly rare) strategies, or have everybody level everything up to level 100, which is a pain in the ass.
From what I understand, damage rolls are wider at level 50, which is probably a bad thing, though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:38:47 No.20262363 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262329
cause it won't level up to 50 and people having to level their squads to 100 in game would be too frustrating. they want you to keep playing the game

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:38:51 No.20262364 Report

Quoted By: >>20262410

>>20262329
Less grinding, more time spent actually playing since the game will auto de-level you but won't auto level you up.

It does actually effect damage, EV's and speed tiers though and some rules which apply at lv100 don't quite stay the same. So yeah it is pretty confusing if you come from Singles format.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:40:46 No.20262384 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262362
>From what I understand, damage rolls are wider at level 50, which is probably a bad thing, though.
This is actually true lower levels does cause wider damage rolls but move BP also tends to add more damage at a lower level as well.

It's why Little Cup formats are pretty much nothing but spamming power moves.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:44:00 No.20262410 Report

Quoted By: >>20262455 >>20262460

>>20262364
Technically I think one base stat point doesn't make a difference at level 50 (100 base speed will have the same speed as a 101 base speed, although 102 base speed will give one point higher) but I can't think of anything that's only one base stat point difference, besides Aromatisse which is 29 base speed compared to Mega Abomasnow, Slowbro etc.'s 30 base speed, which is the wrong way round so they still end up with one point more.

(Not sure if this makes sense)

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:50:05 No.20262455 Report

Quoted By: >>20262483 >>20262493 >>20262510

This thread really got fun once it picked up steam. Wish we could have nicer threads like this one more commonly, VGC discussion is practically non-existent here on /vp/

>>20262410
I hope Mega Abomasnow becomes viable next year with more trick roomers, specially Jellicent, become usable. TR is in an all time low at the moment.

Can't wait to be able to run the Grass/Fire/Water/Double Ghost/Trick Room core once more.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:50:42 No.20262460 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262410
That is incorrect, what you're thinking of is how when EV'ing you need to double the investment (8 points instead of 4 points) to scale the stat gains properly. Base stats if 1 point more would still give 1 point more. If anything a lot of people seem to forget base stats are actually based off lv50 stats so in most cases it translates pretty directly.

It only really affects some things a bit more around the base 70-85 regions. I forgot what the calc was for but I remember dealing with something which needed a very small amount of EV's to beat base 75's at lv100 but at lv50 needed a ton more EV's due to the weird way stats scaled.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:54:02 No.20262483 Report

Quoted By: >>20262501 >>20262529

>>20262455
At the same time Chandelure is a great Trick Roomer in this format simply because it can nuke all those major anti-TR's and set up it's own.

But yeah I miss Jellicent.

Funny thing is vanilla Abomasnow is pretty much more viable than M-snow at the moment. I heard Randy Kwa/R_Inanimate is actually running a pretty succesful team based on Sash'd Abomasnow this year which I haven't seen in a long time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:55:44 No.20262493 Report

Quoted By: >>20262501 >>20262523 >>20263126

>>20262455
I love Jellicent, I don't think its a coincidence that four were in the top ten of 2013 masters vgc.

http://nuggetbridge.com/articles/masters-vgc-worlds-2013-teams/

As far as TR this year, many people are saying its gonna go deep at worlds, the main problem is the shitty setters but there's ways around that, intimidate, sitrus, sash, etc. I got my ass kicked not recently by a great TR team with rain and mega mawile

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:56:46 No.20262501 Report

Quoted By: >>20262529

>>20262493
>not recently
*recently
>>20262483
I've been running sash aboma, its fantastic. Easily the linchpin of my teams right now

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:57:37 No.20262510 Report

Quoted By: >>20262529 >>20263817

>>20262455
Not a VGC player but I love lurking these threads for little bits of good information. I wish people would be this amicable in other competitive threads on vp. - a smogon player

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 12:59:05 No.20262523 Report

Quoted By: >>20262538

>>20262493
I feel like priority is too prevalent at the moment for it to be feasibly pulled off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:00:27 No.20262529 Report

Quoted By: >>20262541 >>20262544

>>20262483
http://nuggetbridge.com/articles/teams-vgc-14-united-states-national-championship/

The 3rd place juniors here is easily one of my favorite teams so far on 14.

It gets even crazier when you see the actual movesets.

http://www.pokemon.com/us/play-pokemon/nationals/2014/teams/junior/

This kid was on some heavy shit when making this team, and whatever it was it worked damn nicely.

>>20262501
Has Sash Abomasnow really gotten popular? Besides this kid, the only successful Abomasnow I've seen was of this guy who won a Regional with a scarfed one.

>>20262510
Thread is nice so far because of the hour too, probably. All the shitposters are asleep.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:02:15 No.20262538 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262523
There's also the matter of Aegislash. That most setters right now get raped by it, and SP, and are also unable to do anything back is way too high.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:02:24 No.20262541 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262529
Take a look at the Heatran thread. The shitposters exist at all hours.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:02:53 No.20262544 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262529
>Has Sash Abomasnow really gotten popular?
No I wouldn't say it's popular, only one was used at U.S nats. But I think its great, the sash catches many people off guard, the meta is really ice weak (mence/chomp/hydreigon) and weather control is often key. Also, the best aboma set imo is quiet 0 spd IV to be able to run ice shard and also function in trick room better, while winning the weather war with low speed

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:05:45 No.20262562 Report

Quoted By: >>20262607 >>20263788 >>20266331

Abomasnow is gonna go big at worlds. Mark my words.

>Hydreigon, Zapdos and Rain everywhere
Everyone and their mom will want to fuck those 3 things over there and Abomasnow does all 3 of them perfectly.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:08:43 No.20262601 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262329
It's not too confusing. You can set shit to level 50 on showdown to help you out. A stat goes up one digit every 8 EVs and you can see that on showdown to create spreads. Not really too difficult.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:09:37 No.20262607 Report

Quoted By: >>20262620 >>20262622 >>20262627

>>20262562
Zapdos will be big next year if it gets Heat Wave again from ORAS. Right now I don't even think it's much better than Moltres or Articuno.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:11:00 No.20262620 Report

Quoted By: >>20262654

>>20262607
I think it's fairly overrated too, its coverage its just too poor w/out heat wave. I would even use fan rotom before zapdos since at least it gets air slash

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1406306989075.jpg, 42KiB, 250x250

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:11:10 No.20262622 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262607
>I don't even think it's much better than Moltres or Articuno

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:11:46 No.20262627 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262607
He's still the best bird by a long-shot. Moltres doesn't compare to it, not that Moltres is bad, and Articuno is lol Articuno.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:14:08 No.20262653 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262165

>tfw will-o-miss missed for three times in a row in recent online event

That 85% can be so fake.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 13:14:14 No.20262654 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262620
>its coverage its just too poor w/out heat wave.
Which is why people have started to use bulky defensive or support sets instead. For example, Rocky Helmet Zapdos is a thing in Japanland right now. Those relatively quick Roosts are great at keeping the thing alive for long periods.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 14:07:19 No.20263126 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262493
Problem with comparing with 2013 though is that the game has undeniably changed a lot. Back in '13 Scrafty + Jellicent was a fantastic core but Scrafty in this Gen is a heavy liability.

But yeah there are a lot of ways round TR's shortcomings. Most people don't even know you can EV a bulky Chandelure and it survives just about everything in the format whilst still hitting hard as any sweeper.

>Has Sash Abomasnow really gotten popular? Besides this kid, the only successful Abomasnow I've seen was of this guy who won a Regional with a scarfed one.
It really isn't. It's more like a Hydreigon case where it's rare but the few that shown up always rank so well. Then people slowly tweak that it can't simply be a coincidence and that too many people are actually vulnerable to it making it viable.

That is exactly what we're seeing with Abomasnow.

I think something similar can be said for M-Blastoise who I've seen on the uprise.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 15:13:54 No.20263788 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262562

I still don't like Abomasnow's chances in a meta that still has so many Fire coverage moves, priority, and Kangaskhan. I'm not saying that it's impossible to use, and the meta for Worlds might even be as friendly to it as it has been all year, but it's still going to need a lot more support than something else that deals with the same threats, such as Ludicolo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 15:17:28 No.20263817 Report

Quoted By:

>>20262510

I'm glad you enjoy these threads, friend. I suppose we have the advantage of not having to deal with anti-Smogon shitposters.

Not to say we don't have our own shitposters, though. Just look at the idiots who think Rizzo should be banned for life for using an aesthetic hack that he himself had no idea about.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 16:42:37 No.20264817 Report

Quoted By:

le necrobump

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 17:02:21 No.20265018 Report

Quoted By:

Sorry if this is annoying but does anyone here have a KB Zapdos they could clone?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 17:42:55 No.20265468 Report

Quoted By: >>20265694

I want to smack Trista's butt

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 18:06:13 No.20265694 Report

Quoted By:

>>20265468
she's homely tho

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 31 Jul 2014 19:03:29 No.20266331 Report

Quoted By: >>20270845

>>20262562
Lapras handles Rain without fearing Talonflame, which IS popular on rain teams.
Nice Ice STAB that smacks both of rain's heavy hitters and Gyarados for x4 damage

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1406068025262.jpg, 156KiB, 1300x900

Anonymous Fri 01 Aug 2014 00:25:54 No.20270845 Report

Quoted By:

>>20266331
I've been wanting to make team with Mega Gyarados for a while and I can't get out of my head to use Pachirisu as a partner. Someone please talk me out of this.

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