/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #20944340

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Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 00:37:25 No.20944340 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>20944389 >>20944503 >>20944610 >>20946973 >>20950525 >>20950606 >>20950644

What happens with Mold Breaker vs Primal abilities?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 00:40:41 No.20944389 Report

Quoted By:

>>20944340
We don't know yet.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 00:45:31 No.20944446 Report

Quoted By:

>mold breaker
>shuckle is a mold
>shuckle has sturdy
>mold breaker let's you break sturdy/shuckle

It finally makes sense.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 00:49:33 No.20944503 Report

Quoted By: >>20952584

>>20944340
What happens when Mega Gyarados uses Mold Breaker Waterfall on Drought Groudon?
The immunities are a function of the Weather conditions initiated by the abilities, not the abilities themselves.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 01:00:14 No.20944610 Report

Quoted By:

>>20944340
Your OP pic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:44:06 No.20946973 Report

Quoted By: >>20946986 >>20946987

>>20944340
>filename should be
>Groudon has entered in Ubers ban list
Really, if this fucker get anything remote to thousand arrows there's no hope for ubers

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:45:09 No.20946986 Report

Quoted By:

>>20946973
>has entered in
Or it could be in English.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:45:09 No.20946987 Report

Quoted By: >>20947001 >>20947009

>>20946973
>something getting banned from ubers for stronk
Not how it works. It's a playable banlist not a real tier

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:46:51 No.20947001 Report

Quoted By: >>20947157 >>20949596 >>20949939 >>20950641

>>20946987
>It's a playable banlist not a real tier
Used to be. But now things do indeed get banned for being too good in Ubers. It wasn't a real tier until this gen. Gengarite is banned from Ubers. Think about it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:47:45 No.20947009 Report

Quoted By: >>20947013 >>20947157 >>20949566 >>20949596

>>20946987
M-gengar getting banned from ubers says otherwise

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 04:48:07 No.20947013 Report

Quoted By:

>>20947009
also moody

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 05:03:19 No.20947157 Report

Quoted By: >>20947182

>>20947001
>>20947009

That is retarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 05:07:09 No.20947182 Report

Quoted By: >>20949645

>>20947157
Smogon has kind of become what the karenfags always said it was. That's why I'm just on VGC now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 12:33:41 No.20949566 Report

Quoted By:

>>20947009
Proof that it happened already? I thought they were still collecting votes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 12:36:57 No.20949596 Report

Quoted By:

>>20947001
>>20947009
>Getting banned

So far there haven't been results on the suspect test

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 12:43:02 No.20949645 Report

Quoted By:

>>20947182
But VGC is shit anon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 13:14:57 No.20949847 Report

Quoted By:

The weather is the thing that keeps fire/water attacks from landing, mold breaker cant break drought or drizzle.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 13:27:28 No.20949939 Report

Quoted By: >>20950440

>>20947001
The only things that get banned from Ubers are some things which are considered uncompetitive (Moody, Swagger, OHKO moves, and sets which can cause endless battles).
Gengarite has yet to be banned, and may not ever be; the voters' votes and paragraphs are still being read through. M-Gengar (more precisely, Shadow Tag) also happens to be uncompetitive as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:23:01 No.20950440 Report

Quoted By: >>20950527

>>20949939
How is shadow tag uncompetitive?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:33:56 No.20950525 Report

Quoted By:

>>20944340

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:34:11 No.20950527 Report

Quoted By: >>20950556

>>20950440
We've been over this a thousand times...
Gengar mega evolves you either try to make the kill or make the mistake of switching your counter. Gengar uses Perish Song, can't escape now. Turn two the fucker protects, turn three it might disable the move your counter depended on to kill. It switches and you die because of Perish Song.
Rinse and repeat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:39:22 No.20950556 Report

Quoted By: >>20950583 >>20950587 >>20950597

>>20950527
I still don't see how that's uncompetitive. It isn't a luck based strategy that wins games by depriving the opponent of agency. It's just a centralizing set. Pack a counter for it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:43:41 No.20950583 Report

Quoted By: >>20950596 >>20950615

>>20950556
>implying you can counter or even check something that comes in, traps you, puts you on a death timer. disables the only move you have which does appreciable damage and then stalls until you die

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:44:10 No.20950587 Report

Quoted By: >>20950596 >>20950615

>>20950556
>pack a counter to something which you can't switch out of because of its ability
Right, let me know how that goes for you

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:45:19 No.20950596 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950583
>>20950587
use a team of 6 Mega Gengar counters, duh

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:45:28 No.20950597 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950556
That said I agree that Smogon should drop the stupid double standard and make Ubers usage-based. Kyurem-B proves that the boundary between Ubers and OU is so thin as to be nonexistent, and UUbers would be a heck of a lot more interesting than OU or UU.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:47:12 No.20950606 Report

Quoted By: >>20950621

>>20944340
Mfw TurboBlaze and TerraVolt

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:48:19 No.20950615 Report

Quoted By: >>20950676

>>20950583
>>20950587
So smogon is bending what uncompetitive means in order to ban something that isn't and is just really damn good, rather than swallowing their pride and admitting ubers is a tier rather than a playable banlist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:49:21 No.20950621 Report

Quoted By: >>20950658

>>20950606
Would do nothing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:51:59 No.20950641 Report

Quoted By: >>20950655

>>20947001
>Gengarite is banned from Ubers
How fucking dense can you people be? M-gengar isn't banned from ubers. Is it really that hard to spend 10 seconds on google before spreading bullshit?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:52:13 No.20950644 Report

Quoted By:

>>20944340
Mold Breaker probably wouldn't do anything. The abilities only activate the weather condition and as far as I know Mold Breaker doesn't get rid of weather effects.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:53:40 No.20950654 Report

Quoted By: >>20950668

I doubt they'd ban it. It's not on the level of Mega Gengar since Gengar prevented your mons from switching. Groudon isn't on that level imo.

And it keeps a lot of broken shit like Kyogre and Xerneas in check.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:53:41 No.20950655 Report

Quoted By: >>20950672

>>20950641
It's suspect test though, and suspect tests have a 100% record of enacting the change they're proposing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:53:55 No.20950658 Report

Quoted By: >>20950671

>>20950621
It would stop them, only weather changing moves and abilities fail. Did you really think they would fuck up so the trio master wouldn't be able to stop them?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:55:08 No.20950668 Report

Quoted By: >>20950677 >>20950824

>>20950654
Name me a good counter for Primal Groudon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:55:11 No.20950671 Report

Quoted By: >>20950805

>>20950658
They hit through abilities, Groudon's water immunity is a result of a field condition.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:55:21 No.20950672 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950655
Doesn't change the fact that gengarite isn't banned

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:56:29 No.20950676 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950615
>ubers is a tier rather than a playable banlist.
But they fucking admitted this back in GenV

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:56:32 No.20950677 Report

Quoted By: >>20950686

>>20950668
Landorus

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 14:57:34 No.20950686 Report

Quoted By: >>20950718

>>20950677
He said a counter, not a check

I really doubt Landorus can switch into a Sun boosted Fire move coming off what could potentially be 200 Atk

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:01:48 No.20950718 Report

Quoted By: >>20950743 >>20950748

>>20950686
Groudon doesn't have any good fire moves though. And Max Def Lando is a thing, with Intimidate. It'll be a good switch in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:04:52 No.20950743 Report

Quoted By: >>20950758

>>20950718
>Groudon doesn't have any good fire moves though
They're probably going to change its level up moveset
It really should have gotten Flare Blitz back in Gen 4 despite being Ground type

>-1 252+ Atk Groudon Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-T in Sun: 232-274 (60.7 - 71.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
That's assuming it won't be shitting up the tier with its Double Dance set and if it gets Flare Blitz

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:05:04 No.20950748 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950718
2HKOed by Fare Blast in the sun.
And if Groudon gets a good fire move like Flare Blitz or even Heat Crash, Lando get's 2HKOed even at -1

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:06:43 No.20950758 Report

Quoted By: >>20950773 >>20952640

>>20950743
But Groudon doesn't even look like it could Flare Blitz. It's too chunky.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:08:14 No.20950773 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950758
Fine

Still loses to DubDance with Fire Punch though
>+1 252+ Atk Groudon Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-T in Sun: 325-384 (85 - 100.5%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:11:25 No.20950805 Report

Quoted By: >>20950843

>>20950671
So TurboBlaze/TerraVolt and Air Lock/Cloud Nine could counter then.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:14:03 No.20950824 Report

Quoted By: >>20950830 >>20950841

>>20950668
252+ Atk Groudon Earthquake vs. 240 HP / 252+ Def Arceus-Ground in Sun: 280-330 (63.4 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This calc is a Fire Type Groudon with EQ changed to a Fire Type move, with 195 Attack.

0 SpA Earth Plate Arceus-Ground Judgment vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Groudon: 278-330 (81.2 - 96.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

This is with 110 SpDef Groudon. And I EV'd Arceus enough to outspeed Adamant Groudon. Pretty solid imo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:15:07 No.20950830 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950824
Oh, and I also changed the EQ to 120 BP.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:15:57 No.20950841 Report

Quoted By: >>20950846

>>20950824
>(63.4 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
That's not a counter works

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:16:08 No.20950843 Report

Quoted By: >>20950860 >>20952605

>>20950805
Only air lock/cloud nine, turboblaze and terravolt do nothingto prevent desolate land

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:17:03 No.20950846 Report

Quoted By: >>20950853

>>20950841
Arceus has recover and outspeeds. And this is assuming Groudon gets a very powerful fire type move.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:17:51 No.20950853 Report

Quoted By: >>20950864

>>20950846
Groudon hits harder than 50%, meaning recover is worthless it'll just be worn down.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:18:29 No.20950860 Report

Quoted By: >>20950886 >>20952605

>>20950843
Air Lock/Cloud Nine negates weather effects so water attacks will hit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:19:09 No.20950864 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950853
Why are you ignoring the fact that Arceus can outspeed and KO after very little chip damage and then recover later?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 15:20:57 No.20950886 Report

Quoted By: >>20952605

>>20950860
Right, but turboblaze and terravolt would do nothing. Only airlock/cloudnine counters desolate land.

and we don't even know THAT. for all we know their suped up rain and sun will only be nullified by Primal Rayquaza's hypothetical super air lock.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 17:57:17 No.20952584 Report

Quoted By:

>>20944503
This.
Groudon is not immune to water and it's not the trait that makes water attacks not usable.

The trait just activates the weather (so Mold Breaker can't do a shit), then the weather negates water moves.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 17:59:34 No.20952605 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950860
>>20950843
Implying those weak traits can do anything against Primal abilities.
Only Primal/Mega Rayquaza will be able to do something.

>>20950886
This.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 13 Sep 2014 18:02:40 No.20952640 Report

Quoted By:

>>20950758
It will get Heat Crash

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