/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #22961136

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Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:44:24 No.22961136 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>22961199 >>22961212 >>22961266 >>22966424 >>22968422 >>22968487 >>22968595

Why does OU suck so much? Why are there so many stupid clauses? Evasion Clause, Swagger Clause, Sleep Clause? Every OU Smogon Team use the same damn Pokemon too.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:48:58 No.22961163 Report

Quoted By:

>they r-ranked my b-bro as NU, b-b-better go and shitpost about t-them on /vp/!

Here's your reply.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:51:20 No.22961175 Report

Quoted By: >>22972572

>2015
>not karenfagging

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:54:48 No.22961199 Report

Quoted By: >>22961215

>>22961136
>Complaining about Evasion clause and Sleep clause
Because spamming Double Team/Minimize and/or putting every last Pokemon of the opponent's team to sleep is fun and fair, right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:55:03 No.22961200 Report

Quoted By: >>22961266

OU isn't bad it's just they can't balance for shit this gen, mega's broke the meta.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:56:47 No.22961212 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961136
>why do people use the best options in a competitive setting?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 15:57:05 No.22961215 Report

Quoted By: >>22961246 >>22961266 >>22961324 >>22968390

>>22961199
Double Team/Minimize and Spore are part of the game. Don't like it? Don't play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:01:39 No.22961246 Report

Quoted By: >>22961399

>>22961215
>they're apart of the game! Dont like it, dont play!
Post your youtube subscriptions, two guesses on who we find

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:06:53 No.22961266 Report

Quoted By: >>22961501 >>22968456

Smogonfag here, I'll bite.

>>22961136
>Evasion, Sleep
Those clauses were the standard since the very beginning of Pokemon (Sleep clause being actually implemented in Pokemon Stadium) because the moves covered in them are just plain broken.
>Swagger
Relies solely on RNG instead of player's skill, not fun to play against.

>>22961200
XY before ORAS is commonly agreed to be the best meta in the history of Smogon. They didn't even need that many bans to get there (four megas plus Blaziken compared to GF's banlist). It's the ORAS batch of megas that completely threw the balance off. I won't be surprised if half of them will be banned in the next few months.

>>22961215
Smogon isn't Pokemon. It's a fan made simulator that recreates large chunks of that franchise's gameplay, focusing on original 6v6 singles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:09:19 No.22961285 Report

Quoted By: >>22961326

Entry hazards are worse than double team/evasion and greatly limit gameplay.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:14:37 No.22961324 Report

Quoted By: >>22961357 >>22961399

>>22961215
That logic applies doubly for you verlisifags, no one is forcing you to play smogon

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:15:08 No.22961326 Report

Quoted By: >>22961717

>>22961285

>What is Rapid Spin
>What is Defog

Evasion turns the game into a diceroll and takes control away from the player, hazards do not

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:22:15 No.22961357 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961324
>doubly for you verlisifags

I see that cleverly worded pun, you shrewd bastard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:29:39 No.22961399 Report

Quoted By: >>22961419

>>22961246
>>22961324
can smogonfags stop generalizing every remotely anti-smogon post as a verlisifurry fan, it's the most retarded thing ever

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:31:56 No.22961419 Report

Quoted By: >>22961444

>>22961399
can verlisifags stop generalizing every remotely anti-hax post as a smogon fan, it's the most retarded thing ever

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:37:35 No.22961444 Report

Quoted By: >>22961462

>>22961419
>thread about OU
>thread about Smogon
>defending Smogon
>not a Smogon player
there's no generalizing here

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:42:03 No.22961462 Report

Quoted By: >>22961509

>>22961444
I'm not a member of smogon forums
I don't contribute in anyway to the community
I don't participate in tiering discussion, meta game analysis, or any faucet of smogon
I only ladder on showdown

How the fuck am I a smogonfag?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:51:39 No.22961501 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961266
The only suspect-worthy megas I can think of are M-Metagross, M-Sableye and M-Diancie, and Metagross doesn't look like it will be banned. Diancie might go if Metagross goes. Sableye is just overrated and easy to break at this point.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:53:03 No.22961509 Report

Quoted By: >>22961536

>>22961462
if you ladder on smogon and support their rules enough to talk about it in a thread, and project that people are smogon's #1 enemy (not really) out of the blue, that's pretty much being a smogonfag? maybe you are taking the term a little too literally

the point is I see verlisify brought up a lot when defending smogon and it's pretty dumb

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 16:58:23 No.22961536 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961509
if you rant about smogon and hate their rules enough to talk about in a thread, and project that people that don't want to play against hax or broken mons are smogonfags, that's pretty much being a verlisifag? maybe you are taking the term a little too literally

the point is that this is a highly hypocritical interaction and that nearly everything you say applies right back at you

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 17:19:15 No.22961717 Report

Quoted By: >>22962195

>>22961326
One the most limited avaliable move pools for ultility use. It gets even worse when Defog is not a HM anymore.

>Rapid Spin
18 FE Pokemons can learn it
>Defog
15 FE Pokemons can learn it without the HM.

>what is phzaing
>Haze
36 FE Pokemons can learn it
>Roar
TM since gen II, Almost every pokemon that has a mouth gets it.
>Whirlwind
30 FE Pokemons get it

And you can always use one acurracy move it one slot or use Dragon Rush and Stop for minimize.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 18:18:18 No.22962195 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961717
>Roar and Whirlwind can miss
Only 30 FE Pokemon
>Moves which are literary able to give free turns and turn the game into a hax shitfest
>Moves which merely put a tax on switch ins
>The latter is cancer

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Mar 2015 18:21:48 No.22962226 Report

Quoted By:

ORAS megas are cancer and killed pre-ORAS OU when OU was actually fun as fuck to play

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 01:41:33 No.22966424 Report

Quoted By: >>22972760 >>22972767

>>22961136
>Let's ban Landorus when there's plenty of things better than it
>Let's move Greninja to ubers because we are clueless about how to counter it and have it get demolished by everything in ubers

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 02:04:06 No.22966600 Report

Quoted By: >>22966630 >>22966648

So like, where are smogon rules enforced?
I always see people crying about it but it doesn't seem to actually change anything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 02:08:32 No.22966630 Report

Quoted By:

>>22966600
Showdown, which normally doesn't matter but /vp/ is so Smogon-infested it's nearly unavoidable.

Might as well change the title to /vp/ - Smogon

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 02:11:21 No.22966648 Report

Quoted By: >>22966956

>>22966600
Showdown, that's it. Maybe friendly neighborhood competitions. too.

I guess people don't like "smogon" because of the small minority of fags that think they're better than everyone try to push OU rules. Its stupid, but some how it is the cause of most of the shitposting on this board.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 02:49:48 No.22966956 Report

Quoted By: >>22966975

>>22966648
>friendly neighborhood competitions
>using Smogon's shit rules

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 02:51:04 No.22966975 Report

Quoted By:

>>22966956
>fags that think they're better than everyone try to push OU rules.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 06:33:36 No.22968373 Report

Quoted By: >>22968407 >>22972726

So hax and evasion are banned because it relies on RNG rather than skill? Then why aren't critical hit boosting moves banned?

RNG is part of the game, hell moves have an accuracy stat for a reason. Using evasion and hax is simply putting the numbers in your favor. Is it frustrating when you're at the receiving end? Absolutely ! But so is losing to a crit, or having hydropump miss at a very crucial momment.

Pokemon has luck involved, wether you like it or not. But just because luck is involved, doesn't mean skill isn't.

In one match, you might get very unlucky and lose, but play multiple matches against the same person, and your luck will balance out. In an instant, luck can fuck you over, but in the long run, skill will determine if you'll be succesful or not.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 06:37:54 No.22968390 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961215
Don't like Smogon? Don't play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 06:43:46 No.22968407 Report

Quoted By: >>22968474 >>22968488

>>22968373

It's not about luck, it's about overcentralization. If one Pokemon or one move or one tactic causes a particular tier to entirely revolve around that thing and how to counter it, then it's considered too powerful and is "banned" to the next-highest tier. Ideally, no one tactic should be so good in a single tier that every single team HAS to make use of it to be remotely viable. Really, Smogon tiers aren't about getting rid of Pokemon and tactics they don't like, it's about making sure every Pokemon and every tactic is viable at some level.

Of course, there's debate about this. Some say Stealth Rock counts as overcentralizing in the current metagame.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 06:47:00 No.22968422 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961136
Evasion and Sleep were Nintendo's ideas you mongloid.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 06:57:57 No.22968456 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961266
>complaining about RNG in a game that has critical hits

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:04:03 No.22968474 Report

Quoted By: >>22968590

>>22968407
I see.

Though this reasonning makes sense, I feel that dividing pokemon into tiers is part of the problem.

There's a little under 50 pokemon in OU (Counting pokemon with megas as 1), so it makes sense that an entire tier will revolve around dealing with a certain threat, because there are simply not that many.

Also, by banning certain moves, you force people to use different moves. Would stealth rock be such an issue if people were allowed to be creative and be given more freedom with moves?

Not being allowed to use Legendaries? I can get behind that, but outright banning evasion and swagger? Idk man

Maybe have a rule where, you can't use evasion boosting moves twice in a row, or have a clause for swagger similar to the sleep clause.

Pokemon, isn't perfect, some things aren't balanced out. But I feel that though some of the smogon rules make sense, others simply bogg down the experience, and turn pokemon into something simply not enjoyable, for me atleast.

I guess at the end of the day, it all depends on what you, as a person prefers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:07:48 No.22968487 Report

Quoted By: >>22968488 >>22972768

>>22961136

OU itself is fine, there's a lot of awkward stigma surrounding Smogon's ruleset. Yes, VGC is way more balanced but it's doubles format. You ain't getting more balance in singles than Smogon and that's pretty obvious to see. These rules are made for a reason, not because Smogon are nazis.

The rules are forced on nobody, and any of my friends who question them will just have to deal with my Blaziken etc.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:08:45 No.22968488 Report

Quoted By:

>>22968407
There's overcentralization which I agree, but there are some which feels like "this doesn't go well with our current popular metagame". I still personally feel Swagger is fine for instance.

>>22968487
Yeah the rules aren't forced, problem is that many others use them.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:34:43 No.22968590 Report

Quoted By:

>>22968474
The only thing I disagree with here is the "no legendaries rule." I still can't believe that there is a debate on "legend = OP." Yes, there are legends that are OP. But legend is not a synonym for power. The term "legend" is strictly a term used for a pokemon's lore; it's back-story. But in real practical use, it's the pokemon's stats, type combination, and move pool that determine whether or not it's viable.

If you're having trouble with legends such as the latitwins, heatran, or your pick of the event exclusives with base 100 in every stat, It doesn't mean it's OP. It means you really fucking suck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:36:12 No.22968595 Report

Quoted By: >>22968601

>>22961136
Still better than VGC

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 07:38:20 No.22968601 Report

Quoted By:

>>22968595
At least in VGC, most of the Single tier threats are MUCH more manageable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 21:39:02 No.22972572 Report

Quoted By:

>>22961175
Everytime I use my favorite Pokemon, I lose.

Karen was wrong.

W R O N G
R
O
N
G

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:07:05 No.22972726 Report

Quoted By:

>>22968373
None of those are as big of an influence as Swagplay or Minimize teams. Both of those turn the entire match into a coinflip, whereas random crits or hax only occasionally ever interrupt the flow of a game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:10:58 No.22972746 Report

Quoted By:

so has zardx lost its luster? i've tried running one lately,but all the slowbros, venusaurs, and quagsires just completely shut it down now. Along with needing a lot of rock support too.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:15:18 No.22972760 Report

Quoted By:

>>22966424
Fucking sick of this, shit doesn't get put in Ubers because they are good there, they get put in Ubers because they are to good for standard play. And please, tell me what counters Greninja other than obscure shit like Porygon2 and AssVest Stunktank.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:17:51 No.22972767 Report

Quoted By:

>>22966424

Nothing on offense or balance can switch in on Greninja

The only way you can beat Greninja is to revenge kill it, or play stall

You can't counter it

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:18:04 No.22972768 Report

Quoted By:

>>22968487
>VGC is way more balanced

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:33:49 No.22972831 Report

Quoted By: >>22972856

How the fuck does anyone stop mega slowbro? That things is a monster once it gets up a calm mind.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Mar 2015 22:38:40 No.22972856 Report

Quoted By:

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