/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #32661218

>>32661282
in a serious competitive setting, fire has two good starters, grass also has two, but water has only one that anyone would ever consider for their team, and that's greninja.
water starters are all shit competitively, and that's coming from someone that loves water types

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:13:00 No.32661304 Report

Quoted By: >>32661315

>>32661267
>>32661299
Almost every water starter is high UU at least.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:14:21 No.32661315 Report

Quoted By: >>32661325 >>32661332

>>32661304
>feraligatr
RU
>samurott
NU
>blastoise
RU, low UU with mega
>empoleon
low UU

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:15:04 No.32661318 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661300
That's fair, but Water is costantly good. It's by far the most consistent typing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:15:21 No.32661319 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661300
>in a serious competitive setting
Are you referring to VGC or smogon OU

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:16:23 No.32661325 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661315
To be fair, Feraligatr got the boot from RU until recently thank god

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:16:40 No.32661330 Report

Quoted By: >>32661337

You forgot the competitive tier chart

UBER:
Blaziken

OU
Greninja

BL
Serperior

UU
Swampert
Empoleon
Infernape
Primarina
Decidueye

RU
Blastoise
Feraligatr
Swampert
Chesnaught

NU
Sceptile
Charizard
Typhlosion
Torterra
Emboar
Samurott
Delphox
Incineroar

PU
Meganium

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:16:44 No.32661332 Report

Quoted By: >>32661351

>>32661315
B and B+ are not what I consider "low"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:16:53 No.32661335 Report

Quoted By: >>32661353

>>32661218
>Serperior, Venusaur,Sceptile, and Chesnaught are at least UU
>Decidueye would be UU if not for baton pass ban
Yeah no, water are the most cucked starters. Grenigger doesn't make up for it all

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:17:10 No.32661337 Report

Quoted By: >>32661376

>>32661330
don't bother with a list unless you're including megas

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:18:18 No.32661345 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661267
>Swampert
>Primarina
>Unusable
Blastoise and Feraligatr are not THAT bad either

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:18:37 No.32661351 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661332
well i'll give you B+, that's about in the middle
but B rank is low tier, because anything below B- is unusable shitty gimmicks that only are there because someone wanted their favorite shitmon to have a rank in UU

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:18:48 No.32661353 Report

Quoted By: >>32661500

>>32661335
Chesnaught is RU though

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:19:12 No.32661356 Report

Quoted By: >>32661362

>>32661300
Mega Swampert is good in doubles, and base Swampert has its own niche.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:20:24 No.32661362 Report

Quoted By: >>32661384 >>32661426

>>32661356
a niche of being shit maybe
also, venu can be used with or without mega, meaning grass has 3 options
checkmate waterfags

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:22:03 No.32661376 Report

Quoted By: >>32661430

>>32661337
OK.

UBER:
Blaziken-Mega

OU:
Greninja-Ash
Charizard-Mega X
Charizard-Mega Y
Venusaur-Mega

UU
Blastoise-Mega
Sceptile-Mega
Swampert-Mega

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:22:24 No.32661384 Report

Quoted By: >>32661411

>>32661362
Swampert is A- in UU.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:26:41 No.32661411 Report

Quoted By: >>32661441

>>32661384
we're trying to talk about actually viable pokemon here, not "i-it's good in UU"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:26:47 No.32661413 Report

Quoted By: >>32662124

>>32661218
>Grass
Good: Venusaur, Serperior
Usable: Sceptile, Chesnaught*, Decidueye*
Bad: Meganium, Torterra

>Fire
Good: Charizard, Blaziken
Usable: Infernape
Bad: Typhlosion, Emboar, Delphox, Incineroar

>Water:
Good: Greninja
Usable: Empoleon, Primarina, Blastoise, Swampert
Bad: Feraligatr*, Samurott,

*: Debatable, I personally thing Decidueye is a shitmon but it is UU for now so I bumped it up. Feraligatr is pretty much a discount Gyarados/Sharpedo, Chesnaught seems to have peaked last gen but at least has a decently large support movepool, etc.

Overall, just going by this list, Grass is the best type, but Greninja is more "good" than say, Serperior is, so it's not really a worthwhile comparison to just compare types

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:28:27 No.32661426 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661362
It has a niche in doubles I mean, VGC specifically. Or had now that the season rules have changed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:28:45 No.32661430 Report

Quoted By: >>32661440 >>32661442

>>32661376
And Doubles?
Doubles is the official format, after all

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:30:34 No.32661440 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661430
No, VGC is the sanctioned meta. Smogon doubles only has 3 tiers: Uber, OU and UU. I don't think a Doubles RU/NU/etc has been proposed because I don't think it's as popular a ladder as Singles

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:30:35 No.32661441 Report

Quoted By: >>32661469

>>32661411
Then no Grass starters is good because all of them are low tier shitmons in OU. The only viable starters are Greninja, Ash-greninja, Mega Zards and Mega/regular Blaziken.

The rest are just filler.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:30:35 No.32661442 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661430
All starters are irrelevant in vgc except the Gen VII ones. Alola dex only

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Cy7DkZJXcAA4bMG.jpg, 55KiB, 918x870

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:35:29 No.32661469 Report

Quoted By: >>32661478

>>32661441
Except for one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:37:46 No.32661478 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661469
tell em owlbro!

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:39:58 No.32661490 Report

Quoted By: >>32661531 >>32661748 >>32662229

Ubers:
>C Rank
Blaziken

OU:
>A+ Rank
Greninja, Ash Greninja

>A- Rank
Charizard Y

>B+ Rank
Serperior

>B Rank
Charizard X

>B- Rank
Mega Venusaur

UU:
>A Rank
Primarina

>A- Rank
M-Blastoise, Swampert

>B+ Rank
Infernape

>C+ Rank
Chesnaught

I didn't bother going further because I'm sure we can alla gree that the rest are shitmons. Rankings will change once the Hoenn megastones are out, that I'll concede. M-Sceptile may be a very potent threat in UU since there are plenty of Dragons and Water-types to outspeed there, and it really only fears a handful of revenge killers and walls. Maybe A rank?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:41:30 No.32661500 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661353
My bad haven't used chesnaught since gen 6 I guess

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:46:52 No.32661531 Report

Quoted By: >>32661564

>>32661490
>Maybe A rank?
Not when everything in A+/S can beat it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:48:59 No.32661544 Report

Quoted By:

all starters should have 550 bst t b h

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 18:51:23 No.32661564 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661531
It loses 1v1 to everything in UU S-rank but Scizor, so it can't be S rank

It has an okay matchup with Bisharp and beats Krookodile outright, but loses to Keldeo and probably can't do much to Cobalion, so not A+ rank

However, it pretty much beats everything in A- rank so it doesn't make sense for it to fall below there.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 19:20:10 No.32661748 Report

Quoted By: >>32661790

>>32661490
Decidueye is also UU

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 19:26:09 No.32661790 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661748
He's talking about the viability ranks, not tiering itself. For instance, Serperior is viable in OU but was UU in usage and later banned to BL. Chesnaught is RU but it has a tiny niche in UU hence the C+ rank. and so on.

Decidueye is UU by usage, but completely unviable there.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 19:36:15 No.32661866 Report

Quoted By: >>32661970

>>32661267
>Water starters
>Cucked

Made me laugh. Especially with Primarina around, who's handling shit moderately better than the other two.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 19:55:51 No.32661962 Report

Quoted By: >>32662140

>>32661218
bst does not make a pokemon great. it is the distribution that matters.
aslo, most starters are designed with the main game in mind, not competitive. obviously there are exceptions, but grass types usually hold well in the story modes.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1490145014132.png, 13KiB, 487x545

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 19:57:36 No.32661970 Report

Quoted By: >>32662231

>>32661866
>tfw Primarina will be the first and only starter to ever get nerfed

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:25:27 No.32662124 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661413
Honestly this is a pretty good list, the only arguable one is feraligatr, but that's probably just the nostalgia talking. Great job.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:27:02 No.32662140 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661962
Except all the fucking starters have samey distributions dumbass, none of them are exceptional or terrible in one stat. 10 BST can make a difference

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:32:14 No.32662171 Report

Quoted By: >>32662209

>>32661218
The only bad grass starter is Meganium.
Fire has Typhlosion, Emboar and Delphox.
Water has Samurott.

Fire is the type with the most underperforming starters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:39:47 No.32662209 Report

Quoted By: >>32662254

>>32662171
Magician should work like knockoff and deal double damage for any attack if the other pokemon is holding an item...or would that be too broken?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:42:11 No.32662229 Report

Quoted By: >>32662264

>>32661490
Is Feraligatr not good in UU or something? I thought it got booted there. Or is Gyarados still UU?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:42:36 No.32662231 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661970
>This is what owlcucks actually believe

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:45:43 No.32662254 Report

Quoted By: >>32662292

>>32662209
Perhaps, but it doesn't make sense with the intention of the ability. It's meant to be a "Hocus pocus and now i've got your item!" trick. Knock Off effect seems more like a stealthy move and it does not fit magician nor delhpox at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:47:32 No.32662264 Report

Quoted By:

>>32662229
Feraligatr's RU now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:49:58 No.32662278 Report

Quoted By:

>>32661300
>it's not OU so it's terrible
Play some more before forming an opinion

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 03 Jun 2017 20:54:15 No.32662292 Report

Quoted By:

>>32662254
Magic tricks tend to knock people off their feet. :3c

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