/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #34261197

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Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:41:34 No.34261197 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>34261203 >>34261204 >>34261208 >>34261218 >>34261231 >>34261658 >>34261733 >>34262998 >>34263026 >>34266016 >>34266024

> This is the highest coverage you can ever get in game
> Name a pokémon that can learn all these types
> also: Ice is the best offensive type but at the same time the worst type - how can we even fix it?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:43:45 No.34261203 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261197
mew

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:43:59 No.34261204 Report

Quoted By: >>34261971

>>34261197
Rhyperior, can learn Ice Punch, Earthquake, Stone Edge and Superpower.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:44:11 No.34261208 Report

Quoted By: >>34261294

>>34261197
Kyurem-B, Mamoswine, Crabominable.

Bonus points to Mamo for learning Freeze-Dry, so it's SE against water as well.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:45:16 No.34261213 Report

Quoted By:

Mamoswine. It's notorious for being the mon with the highest SE coverage on typing alone.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:46:11 No.34261218 Report

Quoted By: >>34261231 >>34261302

>>34261197
>> also: Ice is the best offensive type but at the same time the worst type - how can we even fix it?

You're contradicting yourself. Learn what worst means.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:47:36 No.34261231 Report

Quoted By: >>34261241 >>34261320

>>34261197
Ice just needs more resistances and fewer weaknesses. They could also make new good ice moves that only ice-types can learn, and make new good ice types that aren't slow and bulky.

>>34261218
It's obvious what OP meant: that it's the what type for a mon to have.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:48:53 No.34261241 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261231
>what
worst*

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:58:43 No.34261294 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261208
Which makes 755 SE coverage, around 77,6% of all the 908 Mons/forms that can take hits differently. Fucking incredible.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 12:59:48 No.34261302 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261218
But OP's sentence is completely sense.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 13:02:40 No.34261320 Report

Quoted By: >>34261516 >>34261547 >>34263791 >>34266055

>>34261231
>Ice just needs more resistances and fewer weaknesses.

And what are we taking away in exchange for these resistances and weaknesses?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 13:40:50 No.34261516 Report

Quoted By: >>34261534

>>34261320
it's already the weakest type in the game, toss it a fucking bone

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 13:45:16 No.34261534 Report

Quoted By: >>34261547

>>34261516
It's not the weakest type in the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 13:48:28 No.34261547 Report

Quoted By: >>34261576 >>34261608 >>34261695 >>34261748

>>34261320
>>34261534
Ice is a shitty typing for a mon to have and a great typing for attacks to have, which makes it a terrible typing, because you can have your water mons use ice attacks.

STAB bonus is worthless compared to the defensive utility you can get from your typing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 13:55:51 No.34261576 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261547
Non-STAB Ice moves are too weak, so let's drop the"water types can just use ice moves" already.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:00:45 No.34261608 Report

Quoted By: >>34261649

>>34261547
If STAB were increased to a 2x bonus (with the HP formula adjusted possibly to keep things from constantly being 1HKO'd by that), would that help balance offensive types against defensive types?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:04:44 No.34261649 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261608
It would just make having off-type moves useless except as a gimmick, since a STAB would be just as good as a super effective hit. STAB is fine as it is, it's already strong

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:06:03 No.34261658 Report

Quoted By: >>34261710

>>34261197
The solution to "fixing" Ice is the same as it has always been. Give it a Flying and or Ground resist.
But Ice has never been the worst type. That honour has always belonged to Bug.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:12:13 No.34261695 Report

Quoted By: >>34266654

>>34261547
i feel like they should nerf icebeam so its a 75 bp move and remove and loose it as a TM and then introduce a new ice beam type move with more limited distribution primarily among ice types so that theres a reason to actually use them. Obviously they need to buff its resistance wise too. Nerfing ice beam would help out grass types too

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:14:25 No.34261710 Report

Quoted By: >>34266214

>>34261658
how the fuck did gamefreak see bugs 6 nves and then think it was ok to give it another in the form of fairy

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:20:11 No.34261733 Report

Quoted By: >>34263841

>>34261197
Landorus

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:23:51 No.34261748 Report

Quoted By: >>34261782 >>34261895

>>34261547
>Ice is a shitty typing for a mon to have

Weavile and Mamoswine beg to differ. Go take your victim complex and black and white mentality elsewhere.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:31:28 No.34261782 Report

Quoted By: >>34261875 >>34261909 >>34261964

>>34261748
Both of which would prefer virtually any other type than ice. They are used in spite of their ice typing, not because of it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:46:30 No.34261875 Report

Quoted By: >>34261984

>>34261782
>offensive stats
>STAB on the best offensive type
>in spite

t. 1.1k elo

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:49:36 No.34261895 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261748
the only benefit their ice type gives them is stab on iceshard . Also mamos uu now and Weaviles in BL hell. even with all the treats in ou with ice weaknesses theyre barely used. are you sure you're not stuck in black and white?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:51:58 No.34261909 Report

Quoted By: >>34261930 >>34261944 >>34263854

>>34261782
If this was true then Donphan would be a better Ice Shard user than Mamo with its mono-ground typing. Yet Mamo sits between UU and OU while Donphan is firmly RU. STAB is absolutely necessary to achieve key KOs unless you have something crazy like base 250 Atk, which isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:54:24 No.34261930 Report

Quoted By: >>34261985

>>34261909
>less attack
>less HP
>less speed

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:56:01 No.34261944 Report

Quoted By: >>34261993

>>34261909
pretty sure mamoswine is firmly uu

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:58:46 No.34261964 Report

Quoted By: >>34261994

>>34261782
If Weavile wasn't Ice type it would need base 182 Atk to KO standard Lando-T with a Banded Icicle Crash.
And I'd say that if you have base 182 Atk and 125 speed, you can literally have the absolute worst defensive type and no bulk and still be banned to ubers.

Point is, Ice STAB matters, a lot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 14:59:48 No.34261971 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261204
Too bad its Special stats and Speed leave too much to desire.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:03:13 No.34261984 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261875
>great offensive stats
>STAB on the best offensive typing
with STAB on dark and ground which are just as good
all of which is what makes them good in spite of their typing you literal retard
These are the only two non legendary ice types of any relevance. Even those legendarys are garbage. kyuurem black is a fucking box legendary with 700 BST, one of the highest attack stats in the game and yet it had a brief stint in UU. Regular kyuurem spent most of its time in RU

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:03:44 No.34261985 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261930
Speed doesn't matter if you're using Ice Shard. Less HP but Don is still physicaly bulkier. And sure let's give it extra 10 attack and see how well its Ice Shard fares shall we?

>252+ Atk Choice Band Donphan Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir-Mega: 116-138 (42.8 - 50.9%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Kek. Into the trash you and your STAB-less Ice moves.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:05:09 No.34261993 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261944
Mamo and Weavile tend to go up and down in usage between UU and OU. It really depends on metagame trends.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:05:09 No.34261994 Report

Quoted By: >>34262014 >>34262020

>>34261964
except nobdies even using it or mamo in OU and even lando T is on over 50% of teams.
Ice STAB is great
Ice type for literally anything else is garbage

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:06:59 No.34262008 Report

Quoted By: >>34266141

Literally just a stealth topic for Icefags to whine again.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:08:34 No.34262014 Report

Quoted By: >>34262056

>>34261994
They're being used a lot now with Naganadel in the tier.

Too bad it's getting banned. And so did Lando-I. And Megamence. No wonder ice types aren't used if they're meant to be offensive but ther targets keep getting banned.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:09:59 No.34262020 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261994
Viability matters more than usage. Both Mamo and Weavile are quite high in viability list (I don't think they've ever gone lower than B and they're often in the A's).

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:18:24 No.34262056 Report

Quoted By:

>>34262014
>They're being used a lot now with Naganadel in the tier.
you would think, are you actually playing ou?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 15:36:56 No.34262162 Report

Quoted By: >>34266178

Okay let's take Weavile's Ice typing away and what do we have as result? A FRAIL mono-Dark type that can't KO anything with its moves because of no STAB, while still getting KO'd by everything because of no bulk.

There are literally no downsides in Weavile's ice typing since it's already frail to begin with, only advantages.

Now let's take Mamo. Without Ice we have a moderately bulky mono-Ground type with access to Ice moves. However now it gets walled by Skarmory, Celesteela (who would normally think twice before switching on a STAB Icicle Crash), Tangrowth and Zapdos, can no longer revenge kill Zygarde, M-Pinsir, Latios and Bulu and is overall a very underwhelming pure ground type.

If you need a bulky ground type why not use something like Excadrill with its steel typing or Hippowdon with its recovery? If you need an offensive Ground type why not use Garchomp with its better Speed and fire+dragon coverage? Or, you know, Lando-T.

Ice typing is what makes Mamo and Weavile good. They're meant to be offensive mons and STAB on a top 3 offensive type far outweighs the disadvantages provided by said type.

If you care about resistances so much go play stall instead.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 20171123_112810.png, 170KiB, 1080x1567

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 17:30:27 No.34262998 Report

Quoted By: >>34263006

>>34261197
and this is the worst four types, OP.
replacing Grass with Fairy allows a little under 20 more Pokémon to resist all your moves, but grants you 100 more super-effective matchups

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 17:31:41 No.34263006 Report

Quoted By:

>>34262998
er, sorry
it only goes up to 368 matchups

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 17:34:01 No.34263026 Report

Quoted By: >>34263166 >>34263248

>>34261197
Ghost/Steel with Levitate

BTFO

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 17:44:18 No.34263166 Report

Quoted By:

>>34263026
There is no Pokemon with that type and ability combination.

BTFO

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 17:54:36 No.34263248 Report

Quoted By:

>>34263026
So Aegislash with Air Balloon

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 19:02:01 No.34263791 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261320

Yea, they pluralized it. Id drop 1 weakness and add 1 resistance that would be enough help for ice. Dropping more than one weakness and adding more resistances is stupid.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 19:08:53 No.34263841 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261733
This.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 19:10:45 No.34263854 Report

Quoted By: >>34263879

>>34261909
>donphan is firmly RU
but that's wrong, it's C- in the VR but gets a shitload of usage because the RU pervade is retarded.
It should be NU.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 19:13:50 No.34263879 Report

Quoted By:

>>34263854
>pervade
playerbase*

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Screenshot_20171123-174218.jpg, 221KiB, 978x1518

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 23:43:47 No.34266016 Report

Quoted By: >>34266133

>>34261197
so close :^(

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Screenshot_20171123-174241.jpg, 220KiB, 978x1524

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 23:44:59 No.34266024 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261197
F A K E. N E W S.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 23:48:15 No.34266055 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261320
Ice should be immune to Ice.
Done. Given and taken.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 23:56:03 No.34266133 Report

Quoted By: >>34266230

>>34266016
>One less supereffective for one more normal effectiveness

Are you retarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 23 Nov 2017 23:57:07 No.34266141 Report

Quoted By:

>>34262008
Pretty much.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 24 Nov 2017 00:02:07 No.34266178 Report

Quoted By:

>>34262162
Give them Ghost, Water, Fighting, Steel or Dragon typings and STAB moves and they are fantastic OU mons instead of BL/UU. Same with Dark/Ground combos. Give them Fairy (not among the above because Fairy has shitty physical coverage), Poison, Flying, Normal or Electric typing and they'd still be drastically improved. Mamoswine would probably suck with Fire, Grass and Rock-types because double weaknesses and Weavile would be meh with Bug because it is shitty offensively, but Ground/Bug Mamoswine and Fire/Dark and Rock7Dark Weavile would be alright.

What you are saying is that mono-types are crap. And that is true. PU is literally the mono-type tier.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 24 Nov 2017 00:07:52 No.34266214 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261710
because people kept bitching about U-Turn, but Game Freak being Game Freak dind't realize that people use U-Turn because momentum, and not because its bug typing.

U-Turn could be 10 BP and people would still use it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 24 Nov 2017 00:09:45 No.34266230 Report

Quoted By: >>34266256

>>34266133
that's the point

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 24 Nov 2017 00:13:03 No.34266256 Report

Quoted By:

>>34266230
Oh I just automatically assumed he thought that it was better, arguing with retards just made me assume the worst, sorry

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 24 Nov 2017 01:08:39 No.34266654 Report

Quoted By:

>>34261695
>this shitty opinion again

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