/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #36382348

>>36382348
no one else wanted to/could/was crazy enough to pull off a competitive collective for Pokemon

Honestly though, people clearly care waaaay more about competitive Pokemon than Game Freak ever did/does

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:04:25 No.36382390 Report

Quoted By: >>36382436 >>36382574

>>36382377
honestly competitive pokemon was a mistake. it's much more fun to just play the single player where you can use whatever you want without being swept completely because you didn't have the right nature or ev spread.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 2BA7D77C-C2B8-4013-9799-C306165E (...).gif, 1MiB, 426x335

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:10:17 No.36382436 Report

Quoted By: >>36382556

>>36382390
Totally agree, but without a proper “challenge” every game would feel monotonous. Sure you can have things like Frontier and Battle Tree, but even those have a limited range of options (the teams that the trainers have are set, no random factor onvolved) so it gets repetitive in the long run. The only thing that can get a random factor and a human factor are online battles, where you can have wathever the fuck you want, but that creates another problem: balance and rules. Without them everybody would use the most broken mons and legendaries. If someone wants to try a new team with weaker Pokémon he would get annihilated instantly.

With that said you can still play the normal online battles that have no Smogon rules. They are just balanced to the minimum so nobody can break or win so easily.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:30:15 No.36382556 Report

Quoted By: >>36382587

>>36382436
>everybody would use the most broken mons and legendaries
that's exactly what happens with online though. every time i try to go with my in-game team i get swept by someone with a team of 6 legendaries. or someone with the same 6 pokemon you'd see on pokemon showdown with perfect evs and everything. I much prefer the battle frontier to battling real people because again i can use whatever i want and stand a chance. If i get bored i just start a new save of a different pokemon game and train a team full of pokemon i haven't used before.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:31:53 No.36382565 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382364
>GF balancing for doubles
Nigga wut? Those lazy fucks don't balance shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:33:14 No.36382574 Report

Quoted By: >>36382602

>>36382390
that I can agree on

Unfortunately, the range of competitive viability among all Pokemon is super crazily wide. There's a VERY obvious divide between the "good" Pokemon and the "bad" Pokemon.

One of the worst things a person can go through when they try getting into competitive Pokemon for the first time is realizing that most Pokemon in existence suck. We've gone too far in, at this point, though. There's no going back.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:36:21 No.36382587 Report

Quoted By: >>36382598

>>36382556
Then your problem is with those people that use legendaries in online, not Smogon. Smogon rules are fan-made, and only recommend what pokemon SHOULD have to make them efficient. You can’t get angry at people that train their specific Pokémon with specific evs and ivs, since it’s not a bug or glitch, it is programmed that way.

Smogon is so pouplar because it works, and is more or less balanced. The people that compain about Smogon is because they always tend to play in OU, when there are other 7+ categories you can battle on with diverse combinations.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:37:45 No.36382589 Report

Quoted By: >>36382595

>>36382348
Their UU """"council""""
what a bunch of faggots

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:38:36 No.36382595 Report

Quoted By: >>36382861

>>36382589
Those guys are in insane denial over the power creep this gen.
At this point BL will be the largest "tier" if they keep up.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:38:58 No.36382598 Report

Quoted By: >>36382608 >>36382610

>>36382587
i don't specifically hate somgon. i just don't like playing competitive in general since it's impossibly to balance all 700+ pokemon so it inherently limits what's viable to use.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:40:34 No.36382602 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382574
My problem with competitive Pokemon is that there's so many variables that depend entirely on RNG. In a game that keeps preaching about friendship with your little critters you can't use the ones that got you passed the Pokemon League because their ev's are all messed up and more likely than not their IVs are trash. I really hate the IV system because it forces you to RNG manipulate breeding for hours because the difference between 10 speed it's also the difference between you getting the first hit and you getting bopped before you could do anything.

That's not even getting into how terrible the single-player is. Not necessarily because of easy it is although that is a factor, but mostly because it doesn't teach you how to play. 95% of NPCs use monotype teams that can be invalidated by having the right lead. The simple act of putting Ivysaur in front of my team lineup is enough to instantly win against every fisherman, swimmer, and tuber without having to necessarily do anything. Moves like Pursuit and abilities like water absorb hold no purpose in single player because NPCs never switch. And switching is a third of what Pokemon is all about. I could go on for hours about the amount of bloat that is in Pokemon right now but all in all it be pointless because game freak will never fix it

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:41:59 No.36382608 Report

Quoted By: >>36382622

>>36382598
Alright, i get your point. Every competitive or pvp game is like that tho. That’s what a meta is. There will alway be things that are more powerful than others. No matter of you choose whatever combination you want, if the other player combination is more effective you’ll lose.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:42:16 No.36382610 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382598
Isn't that why the tiers exist though? Flareon will never ever be good. In the face of someone like Primal Kyogre there is no hope for him. But if you put him in the kiddie pool of other people with similar strength as him then maybe you can finally have fun with him because you can use him without him instantly dying.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:45:05 No.36382622 Report

Quoted By: >>36382642 >>36382649 >>36382676 >>36383073

>>36382608
maybe i don't get it since i don't play a lot of competitive games, but at least with smash it never felt like any of the characters were inherently worthless. I played brawl a lot and i never felt like any of the roster was unusable. there were of course characters i favored but i could pick anyone and feel like i could play it if i put enough effort into learning. but with pokemon it's not skill based necessarily and you can't just pick any pokemon and say "if i just use it enough i'll get good enough with it to start winning"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:50:39 No.36382642 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382622
It's very bad in fighting games. Even smash. Unless you're a seasoned vet you will never get anywhere with Pichu in melee. Jigglypuff is a sad sad story in Smash 4. And there is a reason why Bayonetta so oppressive. The only reason why it doesn't seem as bad in fighting games it's because you have the ability to control your movement. It might be unlikely that you'll land a punch but technically speaking you still have a chance to throw one. In Pokemon the speed stat is so critical that it can dictate whether a pokemon will have any chance of defending itself at all.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO A3AEFCC9-3CFB-4A1E-8AAC-7769D460 (...).png, 1016KiB, 1280x720

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:52:58 No.36382649 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382622
You just give yourself the awnser. Both of them have diifferent uses of skill
First of all of both of those games have because are completely dofferent genres. Pokemon relies on thinking and prediction, while Smash in reaction time and control skill.

The effort in “learning the characters and becoming better as i use them” can be applied to Pokemon, except instead of becoming better with the characters you become better at the mechanics and mind games, just like Pokémon gameplay is.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 00:59:47 No.36382676 Report

Quoted By: >>36382741

>>36382622
>and you can't just pick any pokemon and say "if i just use it enough i'll get good enough with it to start winning"
but you can, you just have to pick the appropriate tier.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:13:49 No.36382741 Report

Quoted By: >>36382751 >>36382754 >>36382764 >>36382822

>>36382676
okay. in what tier is unown even remotely viable then?
what little cup tournament is going to be won by a chingling?
where can i use a warturtle without being dominated?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:15:32 No.36382751 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382741
Not to mention all the mons in the multiple BL limbos.
Staraptor doesn't even have an analysis page, it's that unplayable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:16:05 No.36382754 Report

Quoted By: >>36382771

>>36382741
Smogon gives you options, if don’t like them just don’t play it.

Your argument is so invalid, is like saying you don’t like competitive melee because you can win a Fox player with Pichu, a character that is designed to be bad.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:17:44 No.36382764 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382741
>Wartortle
PU

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:18:56 No.36382770 Report

Quoted By: >>36382960

>>36382348
They can't understand that randomness and luck are part of life.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:19:05 No.36382771 Report

Quoted By: >>36382812

>>36382754
and i don't play it. but these people are trying to argue that i can use whatever pokemon i want if i just choose the right teir but that's simply not the case. It's one thing but just say "don't like it don't play" and another to say "you can play it with whatever you want and win you're just using the wrong tier"

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO FB42854A-3F67-4CEF-806F-6D7FE9B6 (...).png, 126KiB, 500x533

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:24:52 No.36382812 Report

Quoted By: >>36382828

>>36382771
You can use whatever pokemon you want if you choose the right toer because that’s the case. There are simply pokemon that are made to be bad. Like unown and magikarp.

Like you said in a previous post, you don’t play competotive games, and that’s the whole issue here. These games and the people who play them just get used to them, even if at first they didn’t and dont like the meta that they have.

Play a tennis game for example, you can do whatever the fuck you want, but a person that knows what is more effective and efficient, ehat specific movement can be used and what mindset is the best one will beat you anytime.
Don’t be so butthurt because of this, please.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:26:23 No.36382822 Report

Quoted By: >>36382954

>>36382741
Unown is a gimmickmon that was simply created to show off the detail they could do with the new sprites. It was never meant to do battle

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:27:45 No.36382828 Report

Quoted By: >>36382845

>>36382812
and pokemon being made to be bad is the problem. If i really wanted to, i could get good at tennis. Crazy to think but yes if i got in shape and trained myself to play tennis every day i could get good at it. But you can't just take a flareon and be good at playing with it. You can know all the flareon strategies and all it's counters and how to counter it's counters. But at the end of the day, even in pu ,it's going to be bad and nothing you do with a flaroen is going to make it not bad.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 7B5CCE41-882F-44C8-AFB3-B5F19D9D (...).jpg, 11KiB, 383x384

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:31:38 No.36382845 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382828
God dammt how can you be so blockhead?

Its not a bad game, it’s just unbalanced. Look at lol or at smash, they have a shit ton of characters, and making them all equally balanced is impossible.

That’s why TIERS exist, and that’s why they are commonly accepted, because they give the opportunity of bad characters and pokemon to be played at a somewhat balanced competition with other chracters of similar strenght.

And again. Pokemon is a different gameplay than smash, they use different kinds of skill and different metagames.

Seriously, how can someone be so reckless about this...

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:35:20 No.36382861 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382595
At least it’s not adv uubl, featuring Kadabra and Slaking

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:55:11 No.36382954 Report

Quoted By: >>36383073

>>36382822
What detail?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 01:56:18 No.36382960 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382770
Showdown and its rules took out a lot of RNG and there's still plenty enough to go around.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 02:04:35 No.36382996 Report

Quoted By:

They refused my OM idea

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 02:18:07 No.36383073 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382622
This is more of a problem with the genre, Pokemon is a raw numbers game. It's very difficult to outskill raw numbers unless you're playing against the absolute worst of the worse. Even though, say, Ganondorf in Brawl is so terrible that his best matchup is himself, he's still not so extremely inferior that he's as bad as something like Caterpie. The number difference between Mega Rayquaza and Caterpie is magnitudes larger than Meta Knight and Ganondorf.

It's not to say there's no exceptions to this rule whatsoever. I can't find it now, but there was a notable player that got extremely high on the Ubers ladder playing a (level 100) little cup team.

>>36382954
Being able to generate 26 different sprites in 1 Pokemon slot based on hidden values.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 02:52:28 No.36383247 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382364
>when Gamefreak balances
lmao

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 25 Aug 2018 04:15:54 No.36383632 Report

Quoted By:

>>36382348
honestly i'd love to see vp make their own set of tiers
just to a. shut up people who whine about smogon, you'd have your own alternative
b. see what vp thinks of balance etc
c. why the fuck not

Capcode	All Only User Posts Only Verified Posts Only Moderator Posts Only Manager Posts Only Admin Posts Only Developer Posts Only Founder Posts
Show Posts	All Only With Images Only Without Images Only Spoiler Images Only Non-Spoiler Images
Deleted Posts	All Only Deleted Posts Only Non-Deleted Posts
Ghost Posts	All Only Ghost Posts Only Non-Ghost Posts
Post Type	All Only Sticky Threads Only Opening Posts Only Reply Posts
Results	All Grouped By Threads
Order	Latest Posts First Oldest Posts First

On these archives

Your latest searches