/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #36974934

>>36974969
How do they not? You can add 200 to every stat, so a fully-candied Melmetal is still going to be way stronger than a fully-candied Magikarp.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 09:11:44 No.36975356 Report

Quoted By: >>36975412

>>36975315
is it 200 divided by four like EVs or is it literally 200 points of added stats?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 09:13:08 No.36975364 Report

Quoted By: >>36977865

>>36974934
Into Ubers it goes

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 09:21:54 No.36975412 Report

Quoted By: >>36975445 >>36975698 >>36975723

>>36975356
200 actual points. Kind of ridiculous, EVs add around 63 points iirc and only up to 2 stats maxed.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO concern braixen.png, 101KiB, 500x572

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 09:30:04 No.36975445 Report

Quoted By: >>36976440 >>36977126

>>36975412
What are they thinking? How do they balance this?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 10:47:13 No.36975698 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975412
>Everyone will have a perfect Mewtwo (which can even MEGA EVOLVE)

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 10:49:48 No.36975703 Report

Quoted By: >>36977275

whats the damage and flinch odds on melmetals unique attack?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 10:55:07 No.36975723 Report

Quoted By: >>36975766

>>36975412
But if every mon gets 200+ all stats, doesn't that balance itself out? Every mon would have 200 more HP but also 200 more ATK and 200 more DEF, yaddayadda.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 11:10:42 No.36975766 Report

Quoted By: >>36975777 >>36976116 >>36976479 >>36976603 >>36976678 >>36977208 >>36977851 >>36979346

>>36975723
That would be the case if it was every stat EXCEPT HP. You see the thing is that while offensively you depend on a single stat, either Atk or Def, defensively you depend on two, HP and either Def or SpD.

If HP didn't exist and damage was calculated entirely on the attacker's Atk and the target's Def, you could scale stats as high as you wanted and the overall damage bracket would remain similar. But since HP exists and can be maxed out, and since candy makes it so that every stat can be maxed out without giving up anything, you basically get mons whose defensive capabilities get scaled up TWICE as fast as their offensive ones, while moves remain on similar level of base power (except solar beam and sky attack that got buffed), and thus everything ends insanely bulky. LPGE is a meta where chansey from full HP is not gusranteed to die to a machamp's superpower in a single hit. It is a slow clusterfuck where battles can take from 60 to 100 turns on average. I tried it yesterday on that showdown server they have for it and I got bored after 3 battles that took around 75 turns each.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 11:13:09 No.36975777 Report

Quoted By: >>36976071

>>36975766
Holy fuck that sound horrible. They better not bring this shit over to the main games then.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 12:12:45 No.36976071 Report

Quoted By: >>36976086 >>36976429

>>36975777
>They better not bring this shit over to the main games then.
Same. Everything about it is dumb but I'm specially worried about stall: LPGE's version of it is not at full potential, but as soon as you give this stat system abilities like regenerator/magic bounce, moves like wish/defog and items like leftovers/eviolite, there's just not coming back: teams that aren't made specifically to beat stall just don't beat stall, period.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 12:15:44 No.36976086 Report

Quoted By:

>>36976071
Yeah I was just thinking that. If this horseshit stays and items return, shit like Eviolite Chansey will end up becoming unkillable eldritch horrors. Porygon2 with Eviolite will also be a nightmare.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 12:26:41 No.36976116 Report

Quoted By: >>36976163

>>36975766
What Showdown Server. I want to play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 12:39:08 No.36976163 Report

Quoted By: >>36976429

>>36976116
>http://nexus.psim.us/
It should take you to a showdown page that has an option to play "gen 7.5", AKA lgpe.

In the teambuilder, all 807 mons appear, but choose only out of the genwun ones for obvious reasons. To give the candy values, in the EVs field (that normally goes from 0 to 252) type out 20 for all stats.

All moves a mon can learn as of gen 7 appear, but you can only use moves the mona can canonically learn in lgpe (no wish for wigglytuff), and the splishy splash bullshit moves must be typed out manually.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:31:04 No.36976417 Report

Quoted By: >>36976429

>>36974934
>no recovery at all
>65 Spdef
>signature move causes flinching with base 34 speed
>doesn't get trick room

This thing's going into the trash once the real games are released.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:34:22 No.36976429 Report

Quoted By: >>36976458

>>36976417
I might use it in a doubles gimmick Trick Room team but it seems pretty baddy bad.

>>36976071
>>36976163
those gimmick moves acan also fuck right off. One of them is a Water absorb move. Imagining that on a bulky water just makes me nervous already.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:35:05 No.36976433 Report

Quoted By:

>>36974956

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:35:11 No.36976436 Report

Quoted By:

>>36974934
Do we know what moves it learns yet? That speed isn’t doing it any favors

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:36:07 No.36976440 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975445
They don't.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:39:41 No.36976458 Report

Quoted By:

>>36976429
>One of them is a Water absorb move. Imagining that on a bulky water just makes me nervous already.
It would be worse than Scald on Vaporeon, and on most bulky waters, really.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:42:59 No.36976473 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975315
Because they go up evenly. If you have 20 attack and 80 special attack that's a huge difference, a x4 increase between stats. But if you have 220 attack and 280 special attack, that's not so big a deal, a x1.27 increase between stats.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:43:49 No.36976479 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975766
A year ago we were asking how Gamefreak could fuck up the balance any worse.
They found a way.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 13:44:58 No.36976488 Report

Quoted By:

looks like Rhyperior stats

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 14:10:50 No.36976603 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975766
>just wanted to mess around with a hyper offense meta on showdown
>manages to still make stall.
Every fucking thing I could possible like goes wrong

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 899441a65013af1eb6f623e7d1213dff (...).jpg, 82KiB, 1024x623

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 14:22:33 No.36976678 Report

Quoted By: >>36978798

>>36975766
I'm sure they'll go back to the usual EVs for the next mainline game but imagine playing against the FUN crew with the LPGE system.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:27:18 No.36977126 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975445
>The game that lets you have any mega without a Mega Stone caring about balance
tbf, being about to have 200 in every stat would help defensive walls and mixed attackers, when everything is going to have Mega Zam or Mege Gengar.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:36:09 No.36977208 Report

Quoted By: >>36977367

>>36975766
I still don’t think LGPE would be that stally since Mega Zam doesn’t require a Mega Stone, and can use that extra bulk from 200 everything to set up Calm Mind+Recover with one STAB and coverage.
Not only that, but aside from Mega Slowbro and Chansey, what would a Kanto only stall team be like? especially without leftovers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:43:57 No.36977275 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975703
damage is 60, but hits twice.
flinch rate is 30% per hit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:46:27 No.36977297 Report

Quoted By:

>>36974934
Here's your bulbapedo-tier stat trivia
>HP
Highest of all Mythicals, 2nd highest among Steel-types, 5th highest in Gen 7 (including Zygarde Complete)
>Attack
5th highest among Mythicals (counting Deoxys twice), 5th highest among Steel-types, 5th highest in Gen 7 (counting Necrozma twice and including Ash-Greninja)
>Defense
3rd highest among Mythicals, 12th among Steel-types (counting Steelix and Aggron twice), 3rd highest in Gen 7
>Speed
Tied with Meltan for slowest Mythical, 4th slowest fully evolved Gen 7 Pokemon

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:52:29 No.36977341 Report

Quoted By:

>>36974934
He's a big boy

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 15:55:39 No.36977367 Report

Quoted By: >>36977447 >>36979186

>>36977208
Luckily, lgpe doesn't have the tools for true stall as we know it to work. The battles are naturally stally because everything is bulky, not because stall is as viable as in smogon's OU. The lack of wish passing, regen cores, trappers, magic bounce, more hazards and a way to remove said hazards are the things that prevent lgpe battles to be endless.

So yeah lgpe is definitely not centered around the stall PLAYSTYLE, but if you're used to quick battles, 60-100 turns on average will seem like an eternity. And the meta is still in diapers as we speak, who knows what kinds of true stall can be developed down the line. The problems as I see them are:
>stealth rock is the only hazard, and there's no hazard removal. Once you set them up they're there to stay, so it is in your best interest to set them up. Chansey can do this, but if taunted, you can wait it out with seismic tosses or just run another rocker; there's literally ZERO risk for a whole load of reward. Butterfree, charizard, articuno and moltres are automatically limited to 3-4 switchins max (assuming you get to successfully roost in-between), so it is in your best interest to run as few mons weak to rocks as possible
>Status conditions are HELL; there's literally one cleric in the game, eevee running sparkly swirl (fairy attack with heal bell's effect), if it gets worn down (and it will, sooner or later, due to damage and rocks) and you lose it, chansey is free to poison everything in your party that isn't alolan muk or the nidos; thunder wave is free as well, and a toxic/thunder wave set has a single answer in the nidos, so god forbid you find the one fucker with a glare arbok
>as a direct consequence of the two points above, the lack of wish or other widespread recovery/healing moves causes rest to become quite a valuable, but since there's no sleep talk, every time a mon rests, it fully heals itself and can either wait out the sleep (nothing is gonna ohko it anyways). Rest stall is a thing

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 16:03:43 No.36977447 Report

Quoted By: >>36977808

>>36977367
Welp, fuck messing around with Showdown LGPE then. I thought at least that would be fun, but NOPE. If this shit bleeds over into the mainline games then I can't begin to imagine the horror that will be unleashed in OU

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 16:44:55 No.36977808 Report

Quoted By:

>>36977447
Don't take my opinion for it tho, play it yourself and see. I didn't enjoy it at all but you might find a way to make battle shorter (calm mind zam or nasty plot mew might do it unless you play against whirlwind/roar/dragon tail).

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 16:51:58 No.36977851 Report

Quoted By: >>36977968 >>36978965

>>36975766
>battles can take from 60 to 100 turns on average
This still happens sometimes in high level play for metas like BW/ORAS/SM, which are pretty offensive. LGPE meta will go beyond RBY and GSC and we'll see 200-300 battles regularly if Stall isn't given some sort of ban to nerf it. If moves like Roost and Recover were in this game, almost all battles would be PP stalling/endless. GameFreak actually knew the problem they were going to cause with this shit mechanic, and instead of scrapping it, they just decides to remove reliable recovery, as if that was the problem all along. Can't believe they're this incompetent. Absolute disgrace.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 16:55:17 No.36977865 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975364
Too slow

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 17:08:20 No.36977968 Report

Quoted By:

>>36977851
>If moves like Roost and Recover were in this game, almost all battles would be PP stalling/endless
Should we tell him?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 19:00:43 No.36978798 Report

Quoted By:

>>36976678
How is Doublade on the same level as Chansey and MegaSableye?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 19:17:07 No.36978965 Report

Quoted By:

>>36977851
Both roost and recover are in the game. Roost is a tm, in fact.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 19:42:06 No.36979186 Report

Quoted By: >>36979437 >>36979696

>>36977367
>chansey is free to poison everything in your party that isn't alolan muk or the nidos
Wait, what?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 19:59:07 No.36979346 Report

Quoted By:

>>36975766
>LPGE is a meta
If you play online by LGPE rules you're more retarded than the normalfags buying that shit game. It's not a fucking mainline game so it doesn't fucking matter

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 20:09:18 No.36979437 Report

Quoted By: >>36980914

>>36979186
The only antistatus moves in the game are Rest and Sparkly Swirl.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 20:36:13 No.36979696 Report

Quoted By: >>36980914

>>36979186
Chansey still gets toxic in lgpe. The only things immune to poison are poison types (alolan muk and nidos being the most common), taunt users and mons behind a sub. Besides running rest (which adds to the stally nature of this game), there's a single heal bell user in the game, the starter eevee. So if you let your eevee die or you don't run one to begin with, everything is eventually going to get poisoned. Thunder wave, will-o-wisp and spore are equally dangerous.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Nov 2018 22:48:59 No.36980914 Report

Quoted By:

>>36979437
>>36979696
Okay, but you can still use other Poison Types, right? Tentacruel and Muk are fairly competent and immune to poisoning.

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