/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #43783867

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Most retarded buffs and nerfs

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:36:32 No.43783867 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>43783888 >>43783938 >>43783949 >>43783951 >>43786887 >>43787576 >>43788205 >>43788218 >>43788918 >>43790044 >>43790530 >>43790540 >>43790591 >>43790859

Buffs: Knock Off and Leech Life
Nerfs: Thunder Wave and the omission of moves from SwSh

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:38:55 No.43783888 Report

Quoted By: >>43783944 >>43784709 >>43790851

>>43783867
Fine, I will start.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:43:30 No.43783938 Report

Quoted By: >>43783945 >>43784716 >>43788258

>>43783867
Buffs: Stuff like Chansey thanks to Eviolite.
Nerf: Weather only lasting a few turns and lowering terrain power.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:44:15 No.43783944 Report

Quoted By: >>43788470

>>43783888
fuck talonflame

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:44:38 No.43783945 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783938
>wanting cancerous perma weather back

Nerfs: dark void

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:45:08 No.43783949 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
The addition of fairy types.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 20:45:33 No.43783951 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
The thunder wave and toxic nerfs were good.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:00:38 No.43784638 Report

Quoted By: >>43784698 >>43784737

Giving status immunities to entire types was dumb. I can get why electric types can't get paralyzed by thunder wave, but why would this also affect moves like body slam and lick?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:06:50 No.43784698 Report

Quoted By:

>>43784638
Gameplay mechanics

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:08:31 No.43784709 Report

Quoted By: >>43787519 >>43788470

>>43783888
very deserved and justified nerf

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:09:11 No.43784716 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783938
>Weather only lasting a few turns
The weather nerf was fine, especially with how common weather setting is now anyways. I didn't even know about the terrain power nerf, but that's also fine, considering how common terrain is now also.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:10:21 No.43784737 Report

Quoted By:

>>43784638
Because some types needed buffs without messing with the entire type chart. Grass being immune to powder moves is great. Same with Dark being immune to Prankser. I just wish they'd give Psychic immunity to Confusion and Attract.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:10:41 No.43784742 Report

Quoted By: >>43784793

Paralysis is fucking broken, Thunder Wave was rightfully nerfed.

The actual most retarded nerf ever is Dragon Pulse going from 90 BP to 85 BP in gen 6. The same gen that introduced fairies and also nerfed moves like Ice Beam down to 90 BP. If Ice Beam, Thunderbolt and Flamethrower get nerfed to 90 BP while having secondary effects why the fuck did Dragon Pulse have to get nerfed to have even lower BP than the now nerfed moves while also having no additional effect?

I'm not even a dragonfag but this is literally inexcusable. Just Game Freak being retarded.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:16:22 No.43784793 Report

Quoted By: >>43784845

>>43784742
It was probably just part of the general nerf to dragons that gen. They wanted to check dragons.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:21:43 No.43784845 Report

Quoted By: >>43784856 >>43788396

>>43784793
First off, they obviously did that by introducing fairies in the first place. Secondly, if they wanted to address moves they should have chosen to address the two moves that people generally worried the most about: Outrage and Draco Meteor. Not that these are broken with fairies around anyway but still.

There is no defense to nerf a 90 BP move to 85 BP when other moves went down from 95 to 90 and also have a secondary effect (aside from Hydro Pump but Surf is also still stronger Dragon Pulse and more spammable).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:23:26 No.43784856 Report

Quoted By: >>43784892

>>43784845
Outrage is shit in doubles

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:25:37 No.43784880 Report

Quoted By:

>knock off went from 20bp to nearly 100bp if it knocks off an item which it will almost always do
>this makes it pretty much the strongest dark type move in the game

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 05 Jun 2020 22:26:59 No.43784892 Report

Quoted By:

>>43784856
Still doesn't really excuse Dragon Pulse.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 03:31:47 No.43786887 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
>the omission of moves from SwSh
Get over yourself kid.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 03:46:57 No.43786983 Report

Quoted By: >>43790563 >>43790565

RIP Hidden Power. The Petilil line got beaned in the back of the head.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 05:17:50 No.43787519 Report

Quoted By:

>>43784709
A nerf was necessary, but surely there was a middle ground between overpowered and fucking useless.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 05:31:15 No.43787576 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
>Implying leech life nerf was bad.
Turning a fucking nothing move in a weak type into a Chad physical power move was one of the only good thing about gen vii
The dumb genies getting their formes was a pretty gay buff. I hated those fuckers before, but afterward I loathed them.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:25:14 No.43788205 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
Teleport was the most retarded buff and it's not even a contest.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:29:23 No.43788218 Report

Quoted By: >>43788251 >>43788290

>>43783867
>and the omission of moves from SwSh
Explain how any of the removals were bad.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:38:20 No.43788251 Report

Quoted By: >>43788263

>>43788218
Dropping Pursuit lets ghosts run rampant.
Dropping Hidden Power makes it harder to check mons like Ferrothorn by exploiting their 4x weaknesses. Also losing it fucks over mons with bad coverage.
Return wasn't vital, but it was a nice thing to have for physical normal types and even just mons with such bad coverage that a normal move is a big help.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:40:00 No.43788258 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783938
Eviolite is a very fun item in concept, but in execution it makes some Pokémon horrifically annoying.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:40:31 No.43788263 Report

Quoted By: >>43788478 >>43788501 >>43790586

>>43788251
>Dropping Pursuit lets ghosts run rampant.
And it nerfs Psychics even harder despite it already being a garbage type. Also Dark in general is already an extremely strong type.

>Dropping Hidden Power makes it harder to check mons like Ferrothorn
No, it just means that you have to run Pokemon that actually learn Fire-type moves instead of just slapping Hidden Power on any Pokemon.

>Also losing it fucks over mons with bad coverage
It also helps Pokemon that have 4x weaknesses.

>but it was a nice thing to have for physical normal types
Body Slam and Double Edge do the same thing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 08:48:23 No.43788290 Report

Quoted By: >>43788415

>>43788218
Can you find an example of anyone saying those removals would be good before we knew SwSh would be cutting them?
Seems like the only reason to defend it is shilling.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:16:02 No.43788396 Report

Quoted By:

>>43784845
I feel like dragon claw only being base 80 in this case is the bigger issue, if it were 90then it’d be more reliable but at 80 and zero secondary effects, it’s just kinda meh

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:21:11 No.43788415 Report

Quoted By: >>43788451

>>43788290
>Can you find an example of anyone saying those removals would be good before we knew SwSh would be cutting them?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:29:48 No.43788451 Report

Quoted By:

>>43788415
Well I'll be damned.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:36:24 No.43788470 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783944
>>43784709
All that it needed for a nerf was to make it only effect attacks. No priority Roost or Defog.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:37:57 No.43788478 Report

Quoted By: >>43788557

>>43788263
An 85 BP move and a 120 BP move with 1/3 recoil is the same thing as a consequence-less 102 BP move?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:42:45 No.43788501 Report

Quoted By: >>43788557 >>43790348

>>43788263
>No, it just means that you have to run Pokemon that actually learn Fire-type moves instead of just slapping Hidden Power on any Pokemon.
>less team and choice diversity is a good thing!
You look at Klingkland tell me removing Return was a good thing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:54:31 No.43788557 Report

Quoted By: >>43788574 >>43788611 >>43790088

>>43788478
>An 85 BP move and a 120 BP move with 1/3 recoil is the same thing as a consequence-less 102 BP move?
Yes.

>>43788501
>>less team and choice diversity is a good thing!
Hidden Power reduces team and choice diversity, you mongoloid. Why run Pokemon that can actually learn Fire-type moves when you can just slap HP Fire on the same cookie cutter nonsense?

>You look at Klingkland tell me removing Return was a good thing
Klingklang isn't in the game.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 09:57:32 No.43788574 Report

Quoted By:

>>43788557
>Klingklang isn't in the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 10:03:50 No.43788611 Report

Quoted By: >>43790633

>>43788557
Oh. You're baiting. Why didn't you just say so earlier?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 11:18:16 No.43788918 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
Eviolite was a neat idea, but it was very poorly executed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 15:24:01 No.43790032 Report

Quoted By:

>when they buffed brightpowder by introducing lax incense which is the exact same item with another name so that you can run it twice

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 15:26:05 No.43790044 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
wtf Leech Life is barely used

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 15:32:03 No.43790088 Report

Quoted By: >>43790633

>>43788557
>Why run Pokemon that can actually learn Fire-type moves when you can just slap HP Fire on the same cookie cutter nonsense?
Because the actual Fire moves are stronger

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 16:22:40 No.43790348 Report

Quoted By: >>43790457

>>43788501
>You look at Klingkland tell me removing Return was a good thing
Still gets Facade.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 16:42:46 No.43790457 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790348
that's like going from Scald to Water Gun.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 16:57:35 No.43790530 Report

Quoted By: >>43790548

>>43783867
>Buff Knock Off because of Megas
>Buff it enough to not be in Technician Range
>Remove Megas and Z-moves
>Don’t return Knock Off to its original form before Megas existed

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 16:58:35 No.43790540 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
They should make Leech Seed count as a powder move so it's consistent with Grass being immune to it and so pokemon with Overcoat can ignore it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 16:59:35 No.43790548 Report

Quoted By: >>43790604

>>43790530
Barely anything gets Knock Off. Ot’s fine now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:00:53 No.43790563 Report

Quoted By:

>>43786983
Gliscor would be soooooo damn cheesy if it were out now since there's no Hidden Power Ice to fuck it up. I hope Gligar and Gliscor are in the updates.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:01:00 No.43790565 Report

Quoted By: >>43790596 >>43791236

>>43786983
So did every special electric type including GF's beloved rat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:04:01 No.43790586 Report

Quoted By: >>43790628

>>43788263
>And it nerfs Psychics even harder despite it already being a garbage type
Is that why USUM has more Psychics in OU than SWSH?
And that’s counting Mew, which become a suicide lead in Gen 8.
And discounting the ones that are neutral to Dark, it’s 2 vs 4.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:04:27 No.43790591 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783867
>Buff
Leech life for randomly becoming strong
>Nerf
Hidden power as most things that ran it already have a bad movepool

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:04:57 No.43790596 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790565
Except Rotom. Rotoms almost never used Hidden Power.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:06:32 No.43790603 Report

Quoted By:

Why the FUCK did they decide to make it worse in gen 6

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:06:39 No.43790604 Report

Quoted By: >>43790639

>>43790548
>Barely anything gets Knock Off
About a 3rd of OU pokemon get Knock Off

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:10:22 No.43790628 Report

Quoted By: >>43790654

>>43790586
>is that why this game that has a bunch broken psychic pokemon in it has more pokemon in my fanfic tier?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:11:28 No.43790633 Report

Quoted By: >>43790650

>>43788611
Oh. You have no argument. Why didn't you just say so earlier?

>>43790088
Why would you need a stronger fire move when just using HP takes a shit on whatever you need it to?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:12:28 No.43790639 Report

Quoted By: >>43790654

>>43790604
>play fanfic shit
>complain about GF not balancing the game properly for fanfic shit
are you retarded? In the actual game barely anything is legally allowed to use Knock Off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:14:35 No.43790650 Report

Quoted By: >>43790655

>>43790633
>Why would you need a stronger fire move when just using HP takes a shit on whatever you need it to?
Because HP is too weak to do anything to anyone besides Ferrothorn

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:15:36 No.43790654 Report

Quoted By: >>43790657 >>43790666

>>43790628
>>43790639
>NOOOOOOOO! THIS ANON HAS A POINT I CAN’T REFUTE
>What’s this? He plays in a format not endorsed by the lord Musada.
>Better derail the thread or make any real counter arguments.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:15:48 No.43790655 Report

Quoted By: >>43790683

>>43790650
Why would you need a Fire move for anything besides Ferrothorn if you're bitching about needing HP to deal with Ferrothorn?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:16:49 No.43790657 Report

Quoted By: >>43790667

>>43790654
>NOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST SAY I'M RETARDED IT'S FINE FOR ME TO EXPECT THAT GAME FREAK BALANCES THE GAME AROUND MY ARBITRARY HOUSE RULES

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:18:36 No.43790666 Report

Quoted By: >>43790679

>>43790654
>play fighting game
>make up rules so that only one character is allowed to use their full moveset and the rest can only use one move
>"WTF BROS? WHY DID THE DEVS MAKE THE CHARACTER THAT CAN USE THEIR FULL MOVESET SO BROKEN?"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:18:39 No.43790667 Report

Quoted By: >>43790686 >>43790706 >>43790715 >>43790718 >>43790724

>>43790657
>GameFreak balancing at all
Get a load of this retard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:19:56 No.43790679 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790666
Satan, stop being a retard and go back to hell.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:20:42 No.43790683 Report

Quoted By: >>43790690

>>43790655
To beat other Steel types

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:21:15 No.43790686 Report

Quoted By: >>43790700

>>43790667

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:22:17 No.43790690 Report

Quoted By: >>43790708 >>43791204

>>43790683
Then what's the problem with HP being removed, again?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:24:33 No.43790700 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790686
Official Metas:
https://www.smogon.com/stats/2020-05/gen8battlestadiumsingles-1760.txt
https://www.smogon.com/stats/2020-05/gen8vgc2020-1760.txt
The actual Fan Fic Meta, National Dex:
https://www.smogon.com/stats/2020-05/gen8nationaldex-1760.txt

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:25:31 No.43790706 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790667
>

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:26:05 No.43790708 Report

Quoted By: >>43790719

>>43790690
What’s right with it?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:26:34 No.43790715 Report

Quoted By: >>43790793

>>43790667
>>

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:27:09 No.43790718 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790667
>no argument
Shame

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:27:36 No.43790719 Report

Quoted By: >>43790757

>>43790708
makes the game less reliant on having to guess if the opponent happens to be carrying any of 16 fucking types as coverage in the game.
makes it so that you have to actually build around different pokemon to counter threats instead of just slapping on HP.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:28:37 No.43790724 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790667
>>>

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:32:14 No.43790757 Report

Quoted By: >>43790765

>>43790719
>makes the game less reliant on having to guess if the opponent happens to be carrying any of 16 fucking types as coverage in the game.
It’s easy to tell if the Pokémon even has HP or not, let alone what type they’re using
>makes it so that you have to actually build around different pokemon to counter threats instead of just slapping on HP.
You already do that even with HP

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:32:56 No.43790765 Report

Quoted By: >>43790776

>>43790757
>It’s easy to tell if the Pokémon even has HP or not,
No it isn't.

>You already do that even with HP
And now you have to do that more because HP isn't in the game. So the game is still better for it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:34:58 No.43790776 Report

Quoted By: >>43790779

>>43790765
>No it isn't.
Yes it is
>And now you have to do that more because HP isn't in the game.
You really don’t do it more

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:35:42 No.43790779 Report

Quoted By: >>43790820

>>43790776
>Yes it is
No, it isn't. Unless you can magically see all four moves your opponent is running it's impossible to know for certain.

>You really don’t do it more
Yes you do.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:37:47 No.43790793 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790715
I can't for the life of me remember what the hell they did before that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:41:58 No.43790820 Report

Quoted By: >>43790841

>>43790779
>No, it isn't. Unless you can magically see all four moves your opponent is running it's impossible to know for certain.
Yes it is. You can tell by looking at the Pokémon itself. A Pokémon like say, Tapu Lele is going to waist its slot on any other type than Fire
>Yes you do.
No you don’t

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:43:41 No.43790841 Report

Quoted By: >>43790897

>>43790820
>You can tell by looking at the Pokémon itself
How the fuck are you going to guess what moves the Pokemon is running just by looking at it? You know Pokemon can run more than one set, right?

>No you don’t
Yes you do. Otherwise you wouldn't be complaining about Ferrothorn being harder to deal with.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:44:35 No.43790851 Report

Quoted By:

>>43783888
It should've been made like Defeatist: it's only active when the Pokemon is above half-HP.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:45:39 No.43790859 Report

Quoted By: >>43790909

>>43783867
buffs:
>defog clearing hazards

nerfs:
>neutering weather to only last 5-8 turns
>invalidating gale wings when they just could have had it double recoil or only work for attacking moves
>getting rid of HP/coverage moves (Jolteon in particular's useless now)
>getting rid of return and frustration, screwing normal types out of their only good STAB
>nerfing dark void into objective uselessness when preventing Smeargle from using it was all they had to do
>nerfing confusion rates (swagplay purrloin was fun as hell)
>getting rid of pursuit

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:46:28 No.43790866 Report

Quoted By:

>nerfing Terrains to only give a 30% increase in certain attacks
>Rain and Sun still give the 50% increase to Water and Fire, despite there being many more usages offensively for both of them to begin with, like Abilities and conditional moves
Weather was a mistake

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:50:59 No.43790897 Report

Quoted By: >>43790989

>>43790841
>How the fuck are you going to guess what moves the Pokemon is running just by looking at it? You know Pokemon can run more than one set, right?
Most Lele sets use a choice item, more than half of the time having HP Fire. It’s not hard to gauge a Pokémon’s sets based on their team or what’s relevant
>Yes you do. Otherwise you wouldn't be complaining about Ferrothorn being harder to deal with.
No you don’t. I don’t know why you keep bringing up Ferrothorn

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:52:14 No.43790909 Report

Quoted By: >>43790962

>>43790859
>>defog clearing hazards
You don’t see Defog anywhere in VGC or BSS

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:52:31 No.43790912 Report

Quoted By: >>43790973

>minimize's change from +1 evade to +2
Evasion/accuracy moves just flat out shouldn't exist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 17:59:05 No.43790962 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790909
hazard setting is pointless in VGC, and not all that popular in the current meta, but was all over the place in the past.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:00:30 No.43790973 Report

Quoted By: >>43790993 >>43791001 >>43791120

>>43790912
>what is stomp, flying press, body slam and more
>what are never-miss moves
>what is no guard
>what is unaware
>what are haze and roar
>what is taunt
>what are toxic and toxic spikes
>what are z-moves and max moves
>what is double-targeting
Etc.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:02:49 No.43790989 Report

Quoted By: >>43791100

>>43790897
>Most Lele sets use a choice item
Great, now what about every other Pokemon in the fucking game, retard?

>more than half of the time
So you admit it's not even guaranteed to run HP Fire?

>No you don’t.
Yes you do.

>I don’t know why you keep bringing up Ferrothorn
Because that's why you retards are trying to justify HP being in the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:04:03 No.43790993 Report

Quoted By: >>43791041

>>43790973
anon, do you enjoy missing attacks? Stomp's a complete piece of shit attack and aura sphere/shock wave are like 10hkos. Or are you just pretending to be retarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:04:48 No.43791001 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790973
oh yeah, lemme run useless moves or lose momentum because a stupid move deals with such a stupid mechanic i absolutely need to or else i will lose

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:09:35 No.43791041 Report

Quoted By: >>43791049 >>43791076

>>43790993
>lists a bunch of eays to counter evasion
>NO IT'S INVALID BECAUSE STOMP SUCKS
Okay? Also, plenty of never-miss moves are >65 BP.

>oh yeah, lemme run useless moves or lose momentum because a stupid move deals with such a stupid mechanic i absolutely need to or else i will lose
Glad to see you want Stealth Rock to be banned then.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:11:02 No.43791049 Report

Quoted By: >>43791067

>>43791041
>Also, plenty of never-miss moves are >65 BP.
yes, Aura Sphere will kill chansey, fantastic idea anon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:14:19 No.43791067 Report

Quoted By: >>43791130

>>43791049
>Aura Sphere won't deal with Minimize Chansey, this means that evasion should not exist even though there are many more ways to deal with evasion!
Okay.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:15:27 No.43791076 Report

Quoted By: >>43791108

>>43791041
>Glad to see you want Stealth Rock to be banned then.
not that i like Stealth Rock, but it at least has some way to manage through it, you can facetank the rock damage if it can keep your momentum going or deal with it at a later point
with evasion you need to deal with it ASAP

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:19:08 No.43791100 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790989
>Great, now what about every other Pokemon in the fucking game, retard?
It’s easy to tell what type they would use as well. Some don’t even run HP
>So you admit it's not even guaranteed to run HP Fire?
Missing the point
>Yes you do.
No you don’t
>Because that's why you retards are trying to justify HP being in the game.
We bring up Pokémon with shit movepools like Lilligant and most mono Electric types. Ferrothorn is mentioned the same way as when someone says fanfic meta

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:19:59 No.43791108 Report

Quoted By: >>43791140

>>43791076
You can also attack-spam through evasion, though. Point taken about urgency, but Pokemon has many elements which need to be dealt with ASAP that are completely unrelated to evasion/accuracy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:21:53 No.43791120 Report

Quoted By: >>43791131

>>43790973
>>what are never-miss moves
You have to admire the retardation someone has when they mention this.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:23:28 No.43791130 Report

Quoted By: >>43791157

>>43791067
Evasion should not exist. Just a single double team/holding brightpowder sets your accuracy to 75% at the best. Then after you miss it snowballs until you have a 1/3 chance of even hitting. Pair this with recovery and you just lose.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:24:11 No.43791131 Report

Quoted By: >>43791152

>>43791120
Does that somehow invalidate everything else?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:25:17 No.43791140 Report

Quoted By: >>43791182

>>43791108
>You can also attack-spam through evasion, though
this is if you get lucky and your attacks hit through, that's another point Stealth Rock has over evasion
you already know what the Stealth Rock is going to do with your team and know if it should be dealt with right away or not, you know for certain how Stealth Rock will affect the battle
with evasion its uncertain if it will wreck your team or not, you don't know if your hits will go through even at +6 evasion or not, they may, they may not, its impossible to strategize unless you completely stop your momentum and bring out something to deal with it specifically

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:28:10 No.43791152 Report

Quoted By: >>43791195

>>43791131
No, but you need to stop mentioning never miss moves. It’s obvious why they don’t work

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:28:37 No.43791157 Report

Quoted By: >>43791170

>>43791130
Bright Powder increases evasion by 1,1x, anon. Double Teaming to 33% accuracy requires 6 turns of doing the same move, surely it's enough time to use an anti-evasion move/D-Max/counter-boost (which can be done twice as fast with SD, for example)/Taunt/anything at all?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:31:20 No.43791170 Report

Quoted By: >>43791195

>>43791157
>hit 4x attack
>do 0 damage because you cant hit
>use dmax when you didn't predict the enemy would be a total faggot and used it to counter one earlier in the match
>use taunt after the enemy already set up a few evasion buffs

Serious question anon, do you enjoy playing against evasion? Because there is nothing less fun. It's like if someone just walked into your room and took away your controller.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:32:43 No.43791182 Report

Quoted By: >>43791196

>>43791140
If it's the luck factor that makes you against evasion, what are you doing in Pokemon competitive? Here majority of moves have secondary effects, non-100% accuracy, the game itself sometimes gives you crits, damage rolls can ruin a OHKO/2HKO etc. Reducing luck-factor isn't inherently a bad thing, but singling out evasion results in the remainder of the game still having a ton of randomness.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:36:18 No.43791195 Report

Quoted By: >>43791208 >>43791599

>>43791152
>It’s obvious why they don’t work
Because you keep looking at Swift clones instead of actually good moves of this type.
>>43791170
>>do 0 damage because you cant hit
1/3 of the time is a bit more than Scald burn-rate or Focus Miss miss rate. And that's only achievable after multiple turns of set-up.
>Serious question anon, do you enjoy playing against evasion?
I don't mind it, there is already a ton of randomness in the games.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:36:20 No.43791196 Report

Quoted By: >>43791201

>>43791182
because evasion FORCES the game to revolve around luck factors instead of just being a rare side occurrence like with crits, secondary effects, etc

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:38:16 No.43791201 Report

Quoted By: >>43791277

>>43791196
The opponent running Scald, Dynamic Punch clones, Acupressure, a Pokemon with a speed stat equal to yours, Focus Blast etc. still forces the game to revolve around luck. You may opt to only use moves with 100% accuracy and no secondary effects, but even with evasion banned your opponent can still decide to pick something luck-reliant.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 677.png, 67KiB, 679x854

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:38:54 No.43791204 Report

Quoted By:

>>43790690

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:39:26 No.43791208 Report

Quoted By: >>43791233

>>43791195
>Because you keep looking at Swift clones instead of actually good moves of this type.
Most of them have shit distribution

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:44:04 No.43791233 Report

Quoted By: >>43791264

>>43791208
It's not that bad, especially in Gen 8.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:44:10 No.43791236 Report

Quoted By: >>43791579

>>43790565
fucks sake give the special electric types access to the heat-based fire moves already

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:48:16 No.43791264 Report

Quoted By: >>43791372

>>43791233
Still pretty bad desu

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 18:49:30 No.43791277 Report

Quoted By: >>43791360

>>43791201
and none of them would disrupt your momentum like evasion does
>opponent connects a Dynamic Punch
>send out someone who can tank it and regain your momentum
>scald
>if you predict scald you can turn the burn to a special mon into momentum
and before you go "but you can send out your evasion disrupter", yeah you can, and you still need to waste a turn wiping the evasion boosts, to which the opponent can just keep using it to keep you out of 100% accuracy
the stuff you mentioned still has a degree of certainty and are unique instances of luck, unlike evasion that forces your opponent to rely on luck or stop to counter your evasion

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 19:00:55 No.43791360 Report

Quoted By: >>43791402

>>43791277
>and you still need to waste a turn wiping the evasion boosts, to which the opponent can just keep using it to keep you out of 100% accuracy
That's if you use Haze/Defog to deal with it. You have other choices for anti-evasion.
Even then, other luck-based elements also work this way. If your opponent keeps spamming a confusion or a flinch move, you constantly have to rely on RNG to do anything, for example.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 19:02:00 No.43791372 Report

Quoted By:

>>43791264
Fair enough, but I think it's something at least worth mentioning among other methods.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 19:06:05 No.43791402 Report

Quoted By:

>>43791360
bro just use own tempo/inner focus!

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 19:32:11 No.43791579 Report

Quoted By:

>>43791236
Or just give them Aurora Beam, since auroras are electromagnetic phenomena.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 06 Jun 2020 19:34:57 No.43791599 Report

Quoted By:

>>43791195
>good moves of this type
aura sphere: shit distribution
hyperspace hole/fury: signature move
vital throw: shit distribution
smart strike: the only one that has somewhat decent distribution
false surrender: signature move
everything else is as weak as swift or even worse

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