/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #43828681

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Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 18:35:51 No.43828681 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>43829067 >>43829094 >>43829123 >>43829135 >>43829225 >>43829445 >>43829487 >>43829518 >>43829818 >>43829819 >>43830005 >>43830027 >>43830058 >>43831409 >>43831583 >>43832088 >>43832175

>Shit that ruined singles:
U-turn/Volt Switch
Stealth rock
Choice Items
Recovery moves
Scald
Toxic

>Shit that ruined doubles
Weakness policy
Protect
Trick room
Geomancy

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:26:44 No.43829067 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
Basically stall ruined singles and Boost and speed control ruined Doubles?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:29:00 No.43829094 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
you forgot regenerator for singles

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:30:05 No.43829104 Report

Quoted By: >>43829202 >>43829898

>thinking Stealth Rock is bad for singles

Bottom elo confirmed

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:30:47 No.43829110 Report

Quoted By:

I like using voltturn

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:32:13 No.43829123 Report

Quoted By: >>43831161

>>43828681
>Shit that ruined doubles
>No Tailwind
>No Max Airstream

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:33:29 No.43829135 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
Idk if I would agree that the moves themselves are the problem, more that they are so widely available.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:39:28 No.43829202 Report

Quoted By: >>43829353 >>43829995 >>43832343

>>43829104
You're a big dumbfuck aren't you?
That piece of shit of a move ruined the whole meta.
It made some many types worthless by merely being weak to rock.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:41:47 No.43829225 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
t. stall retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 19:52:28 No.43829353 Report

Quoted By: >>43829433 >>43829492 >>43830567 >>43831167

>>43829202
You're the low ladder retard for thinking there's any problem with entry hazards anymore when hazard control and removal is easier than ever between all the good defoggers, Rapid Spin buff, Heavy-Duty Boots and even other shit like Magic Bounce.

You are genuinely fucking bad at the game because you're upset your epic bug bro takes damage from le evil rocks. Learn how to play and maybe you realize that entry hazards consistently punishing switches is actually good for the game and rewards players who properly pressure their opponents. Not to mention that it weakens defensive playstyles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:00:50 No.43829433 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829353
honestly, entry hazards are good insofar as they deal typeless damage. pressure via damage if you switch isnt bad, but being punished just for bringing a certain type is. if stealth rocks was removed (and ONLY sr) then i would wage that most of the anger at entry hazards would dissipate

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:01:52 No.43829445 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
Singles player. Fuck SR but I dont mind the rest desu

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:05:42 No.43829487 Report

Quoted By: >>43829909

>>43828681
>Toxic
My only problem with Toxic is the distribution. It's retarded that 99% of the pokemon can use one of the best Poison type move.
Gen 3 should have fixed this, the same way they did with Reflect.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:06:10 No.43829492 Report

Quoted By: >>43829531 >>43830035

>>43829353
where does this idea that rocks exclusively punish defense come from? everyone just runs Pokemon that are outright immune to or don’t give a shit about rocks on defensive styles.

>Magic guard Clefable
>Toxapex absorbing toxic spikes and healing any chip damage on switch
>Corviknight Defog+roost
>Ferrothorn not being bothered by SR at all

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:09:01 No.43829518 Report

Quoted By: >>43829540 >>43830041

>>43828681
How does Protect ruin doubles, it was created before doubles

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:11:22 No.43829531 Report

Quoted By: >>43829554 >>43829583

>>43829492
Defensive playstyles are way more focused on avoiding hazards damage which is why they generally have the most amount of hazard control. Forcing defensive Pokemon to constantly come in and roost or to run an item that negates entry-hazards is still good. Yeah, obviously hazards are good against every playstyle which is why everyone uses them but specifically stall and generally defensive teams are hurt the most by hazards since they will switch the most. Toxapex taking damage from rocks is still going to hurt it it in the long run, Unaware Clefable isn't immune to hazards and either has to run HDB or rely on teammates for hazard control, Ferrothorn gets whittled by all entry hazard since it doesn't actually have real recovery beyond Leftovers plus potentially Leech Seed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:12:22 No.43829540 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829518
only the most unruly of cunts knows that spamming protect wins games, since that's such a deniggerate strat that you might as well quit while you're ahead

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:13:36 No.43829554 Report

Quoted By: >>43829583 >>43829802

>>43829531
Why would stall/defensive playstyles be switching more than other styles? If my Toxapex comes in on your Pokemon that it counters do you just not switch?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:16:21 No.43829583 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829531
>>43829554
And since I’m thinking about it nobody but contrarians are running unaware Clefable his gen, in fact wish passing Clefable essentially ompletely nullifies all rock damage for anything it brings in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:25:09 No.43829658 Report

Quoted By: >>43829733

Does stealth rock promotes skillful gameplay in the current meta?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:30:42 No.43829733 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829658
No it just punishes anyone not running cancerous sustain strats

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:37:18 No.43829802 Report

Quoted By: >>43829843

>>43829554
I really wonder why defensive playstyles that are designed around reacting to offensive threats and will frequently switch into the defensive Pokemon that can check whatever threat is out thus naturally dragging out games would switch more than other playstyles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:38:26 No.43829818 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
>Shit that ruined singles:
Heavy Duty Boots
The Dex Cut
Z moves (culled)
Dynamax (banned)
Baton pass chains (banned)
Evasion (banned)

>Shit that ruined doubles
Weakness policy
Protect
Trick room
Geomancy
Tail Wind
Dynamax

fixed

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1579184610068.jpg, 14KiB, 300x317

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:38:28 No.43829819 Report

Quoted By: >>43830613 >>43831634

>>43828681
>Shit that ruined singles:
being competitive, singles is ok only in the adventure

>Shit that ruined doubles:
gen 8 ruined it, doubles from gen 3 to 7 is great

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:40:43 No.43829843 Report

Quoted By: >>43829876 >>43829878

>>43829802
So again what does the offensive Pokemon that can’t do damage in the current matchup do? Just die?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:42:03 No.43829856 Report

Quoted By: >>43829891

Intimidate is cancer for both singles and dubs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:44:34 No.43829876 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829843
Offensive teams by default can't constantly switch around since they're less durable, they have way less recovery options (if the Pokemon even has recovery at all), they probably don't have wish-passing, their hazard remover probably isn't as durable etc.

How the fuck is that so hard to understand? If you're using offensive teams you're not gonna have a team of 6 bulky shits that can heal off whatever damage they take. Have you ever played before? Not to mention that by default you're less inclined to constantly switch since you actually want to actively dish out damage and potentially set up.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:44:44 No.43829878 Report

Quoted By: >>43829977

>>43829843
Depends a lot on the situation and what sort of team it is. But if it's something like HO vs balance or stall, sacking for damage is most likely what would happen, yes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:46:08 No.43829891 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829856
Intimidate is fine in singles because you can just switch.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:47:29 No.43829898 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829104
Moce is ok, distribution is horrible.
It should have been rock/ground only move.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:48:32 No.43829909 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829487
No longer. Same with protect

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:54:49 No.43829977 Report

Quoted By: >>43831421

>>43829878
So you still take damage on the switch in except now you ALSO lose your Pokemon great plan fuck taking hazard damage right xD

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:57:11 No.43829995 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829202
>Complains about Stall
>Complains about Stealth Rock too

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:57:58 No.43830005 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
all of those besides protect are right, but they didn't ruin it. You're just low elo

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 20:59:43 No.43830027 Report

Quoted By: >>43830052

>>43828681
Protect is the stealth rocks of doubles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 21:00:35 No.43830035 Report

Quoted By: >>43830656

>>43829492
Defensive playstyles are hurt the most by Stealth Rock because;
A. The damage is percentage based
B. Defensive teams switch out more often
C. It weakens Regenerator/Leftovers and makes 2HKOing Pokemon much easier

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 21:01:37 No.43830041 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829518
Protect has existed before Doubles

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 21:02:29 No.43830052 Report

Quoted By:

>>43830027
you fucking wish.
protect is worse

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 21:03:04 No.43830058 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
Pursuit but thankfully it's gone and hopefully will never return.

As for stuff we still have...
>Knock Off
>Recovery

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 21:56:02 No.43830567 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829353
It has nothing to do with being low ladder fucking retard.
Stealth rock shits on types like flying and Ice, forcing them waste their item slot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:00:55 No.43830613 Report

Quoted By: >>43832314

>>43829819
>>Shit that ruined doubles:
>gen 8 ruined it, doubles from gen 3 to 7 is great
Are you retarded?
Gen 5-7 had literal same teams for a decade.
Even since dynamax was implemented, there hasn't been a more variate and interesting meta.

There are some many strategies around weather, terrains and stat boosts it's insanely variate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:05:36 No.43830656 Report

Quoted By: >>43830725

>>43830035
>Defensive playstyles are hurt the most by Stealth Rock
How? They always run recover moves, leftovers, protect.

I swear stall faggots have the biggest persecution problem despite being the easiest and most over powered playstyle.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:13:08 No.43830725 Report

Quoted By: >>43830878 >>43831052 >>43837738

>>43830656
Shut the fuck up, you literal moron. Several people have already explained in detail why defensive teams care more about hazards and you keep going on about stupid bullshit. You have to be mentally challenged if you haven't noticed that stall always runs the most hazard control out of all playstyles for a reason.

And now you're randomly accusing others of being "stall faggots" for explaining basic concepts to you? You don't have to play stall to be able to tell that stall doesn't like entry hazards.

Literally 1000 elo posts. Why do idiots like you who don't play feel the need to comment on shit they have no idea about? Maybe if you stop using Ninjask Charizard Butterfree teams you might even learn some basic gameplay concepts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:30:28 No.43830878 Report

Quoted By:

>>43830725
Based

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:51:02 No.43831052 Report

Quoted By: >>43831137 >>43831176

>>43830725
You guys keep acting like offense switches less than defense and are unironically saying shit like "yeah I'd just stay in on a losing matchup and sac so I can take out a single wall maybe"

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:57:47 No.43831119 Report

Quoted By:

Choice items are fine except for scarf

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 22:59:33 No.43831137 Report

Quoted By:

>>43831052
Have you ever actually played competetive?
Sacking a mon to weaken a wall is absolutely something offense does all the time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:02:45 No.43831161 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829123
Max Airstream ruined both
The entire dynamax mechanic would be fine if you just ban airstream

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:03:14 No.43831167 Report

Quoted By: >>43831183 >>43831318

>>43829353
>remove stealth rocks
>buff spikes to only need 2 layers for full damage
there. solved the bitching. will it ever happen? lol fuck no

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:04:44 No.43831176 Report

Quoted By: >>43831213

>>43831052
>You guys keep acting like offense switches less than defense
Because they do?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:05:13 No.43831183 Report

Quoted By:

>>43831167
>letting flying/levitating walls get off scott free
no

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:08:08 No.43831213 Report

Quoted By:

>>43831176
This retard is hopeless at this point. I've already told him that offensive teams obviously don't want to switch every other turn and actually dish out damage not to mention that they can't even afford to constantly switch in into all sorts of shit in the first place due to the lack of reliable recovery and overall frailness of team partners.

I don't know on what kind of planet this guy lives and what his idea of an offensive team is that switches more than stall.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:23:53 No.43831318 Report

Quoted By:

>>43831167
if SR did typeless damage, i'd be fine with it staying.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:37:22 No.43831409 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
god I would literally allow myself to be crucified if it meant getting raw doggy this russian qt before they hung me up

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:38:55 No.43831421 Report

Quoted By: >>43832009

>>43829977
The thing is that in HO you have either choice locked or setup sweepers/wallbreakers, so you try to set up once and dish out as many damage as you can. Of course there's switching, but why is so hard to understand than a reactive playstyle (playing around the decisions of the opponent) is more prone to switch than an active one? Without hazards, stall teams would have little to no pressure to switch out

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO monky.png, 206KiB, 390x258

Anonymous Wed 10 Jun 2020 23:56:38 No.43831583 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
>complains about u-turn/volt switch
>doesn't complain about teleport/baton pass
>complains about stealth rock in heavy duty boots metagame
>complains about recovery moves
>says nothing about pressure, trapping, or regenerator
>confusingly also complains about toxic

Cognitive dissonat retard that has not played more than 10 battles in his life. Just browses this page and has recollected all the things other retards have ever complained in here to get attention

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:03:31 No.43831634 Report

Quoted By: >>43832314

>>43829819
Ok VGCnigger

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:41:05 No.43832009 Report

Quoted By: >>43832038

>>43831421
The point is that to the HO player the chip damage actually means something because they can't heal it off; it's a hard limit on the number of times they can switch in or out a new Pokemon. Getting hard walled by a counter? You're gonna eat a bunch of damage now. It means nothing that a stall player switches more, the Pokemon involved are barely effected.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:43:18 No.43832038 Report

Quoted By: >>43832059

>>43832009
>It means nothing that a stall player switches more
That’s why every stall team carries multiple forms of hazard control right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:45:44 No.43832059 Report

Quoted By: >>43832106

>>43832038
Yes you fucking idiot that's what I'm saying. Stall isn't being neutered by hazards, it doesn't matter they have all the time in the world to switch around, remove them, heal off the damage, and continue what they're doing. What is HO going to do resurrect Shuckle from the dead to get sticky webs and SR back up?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:48:23 No.43832088 Report

Quoted By: >>43832136

>>43828681
Make protect another option for Pokemon instead of making it a move. Doubles becomes much more interesting that way

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:50:05 No.43832106 Report

Quoted By: >>43832583

>>43832059
If stall wasn’t neutered by hazards then they wouldn’t be running multiple forms of hazard control

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:53:10 No.43832136 Report

Quoted By:

>>43832088
Doubles becomes unplayable that way lmao

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 00:56:55 No.43832175 Report

Quoted By:

>>43828681
>Shit that ruined doubles
Ally switch
Any move redirection

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 01:12:15 No.43832314 Report

Quoted By:

>>43831634
>>43830613
ok, we understand, you love bugs in anus

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 01:16:18 No.43832343 Report

Quoted By:

>>43829202
Rocks are needed to fuck with stall.
Stop being a retard, I'd take a dead Charizard over Chansey walling everything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 01:54:18 No.43832583 Report

Quoted By: >>43832762

>>43832106
>Stall can afford to run multiple Pokemon with hazard control and can regenerate the damage
>Hurts stall more

I bet you can’t even name one 3hko on a meta wall Pokemon that becomes 2hko without googling it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 02:17:31 No.43832762 Report

Quoted By: >>43836216

>>43832583
>>Stall can afford to run multiple Pokemon with hazard control and can regenerate the damage
Yeah, you don’t play the game. They NEED multiple forms of hazard control

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 06:24:14 No.43834454 Report

Quoted By:

aight, why dont y'all try fixing the broke shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 12:46:03 No.43836216 Report

Quoted By: >>43836512

>>43832762
Because any game where stall is involved is going to naturally be longer and thus entry hazards are going to be more of a factor, not because they are particularly weak to hazards; the game is longer for the other player too. HO doesn't run as much hazard control because if the game goes that long you lost anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 13:33:56 No.43836512 Report

Quoted By:

>>43836216
Watch him reply that HO is weak to rocks because it doesn't have Regenerator or something. At this point it has to be trolling but I guess these are the idiots browsing /vp/. Clearly HO needs to run Defog Corviknight and Magic Guard Clefable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 16:16:27 No.43837738 Report

Quoted By: >>43837845

>>43830725
Why do stallfaggots always act like victims?
Hazards work both ways.
A frail Pokemon with no recovery has a harder time with hazards than a staller one.
And offensive teams need hazard removals because you have to switch too every time your Pokemon gets walled.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 16:31:00 No.43837845 Report

Quoted By: >>43837925 >>43838595

>>43837738
>A frail Pokemon with no recovery has a harder time with hazards than a staller one.
No it doesn’t
>And offensive teams need hazard removals because you have to switch too every time your Pokemon gets walled.
Offensive teams need no more than one hazard control Pokémon. Some teams don’t even need to run hazard control

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 16:41:27 No.43837925 Report

Quoted By:

>>43837845
Stop replying to this illiterate mouthbreather. You can say whatever you want, he's clearly not capable of processing what you're saying and will respond with a non-sequitur about you being a stallfag and how his frail bugbros suffer more from rocks.

It's pointless. I'm saging so this doesn't get even more unnecessary bumps.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 18:05:25 No.43838595 Report

Quoted By: >>43838652

>>43837845
Dunno why you are strugglnig with this so much.

>Defensive teams run more hazard control than offensive teams
This is true.

>...Because defensive teams are punished harder by rocks
This is not, it's because defensive teams want games to go longer and in longer games hazards do more total damage. But turn count between teams is always going to be symmetrical, you're not carrying hazard removal because of the stall vs. HO matchup.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 18:12:27 No.43838652 Report

Quoted By: >>43840051

>>43838595
>This is not, it's because defensive teams want games to go longer and in longer games hazards do more total damage.
To stall teams, yes

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 18:52:13 No.43838937 Report

Quoted By:

/vp/ is bad at competitive

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 21:16:14 No.43840051 Report

Quoted By: >>43840647

>>43838652
>Corviknight, Toxapex, and Clefable take more damage from hazards than Galarian Darmanitan, Dracovish, and Pelipper

Damn...really makes you think.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 11 Jun 2020 22:32:28 No.43840647 Report

Quoted By:

>>43840051
Yes.

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