/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #43935222

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Scyther, Porygon 2, and Magneton are banned from PU

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 15:45:17 No.43935222 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>43935940 >>43937044 >>43938907 >>43946373 >>43950781

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pu-general-rules-tiering-and-announcements-thread.3660650/#post-8507851

Yeah, there was no way they were going to last. btw they’re banned from NFE too along with Chansey. The only reason they didn’t mention it in PU was because it was already banned from NU. Btw Chansey is banned from NU

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 15:49:11 No.43935268 Report

Quoted By:

Speaking of NFE, Machoke was suspect tested recently but it wasn’t banned.
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ss-nfe-machoke-voting.3666050/page-2#post-8506724
So there’s that

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:33:54 No.43935743 Report

Quoted By: >>43935982 >>43937285 >>43941203

Any chance Scyther can stick around the mid tiers like RU?
Technician Dual Wingbeat is no joke, it's Brave Bird without the recoil.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:36:21 No.43935784 Report

Quoted By: >>43937285 >>43949059

>Love Scyther
>Hate Scizor
The dino mantis god needs to continue getting buffed

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:48:28 No.43935940 Report

Quoted By: >>43941203

>>43935222
This one is reasonable. Scyther got really good with heavy duty boots and technician boosted the dual wing new move.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:50:38 No.43935961 Report

Quoted By:

DO YOU GUYS NOT REMEMBER HOW FUCKING STRONG MAGNETON WAS???

I USED IT TO FUCK UP NIGGAS BACK IN 5/6 GEN UU

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:52:32 No.43935981 Report

Quoted By: >>43937336 >>43940044

What did Magneton get?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 16:52:34 No.43935982 Report

Quoted By:

>>43935743
itll probably be UU or RUBL
there isnt much in RU to deal with scyther
most flying resist wont take brick break too well
Rhydon is really the only reliable counter and Rhydon doesnt want its eviolite knocked off .

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:18:09 No.43937044 Report

Quoted By: >>43937270 >>43938984 >>43939106 >>43941160 >>43942296

>>43935222
>council
Why are these autists so fucking smug? Do they think they're some sort of higher authority on Pokemon?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:42:10 No.43937270 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937044
Why do you care so much?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:43:41 No.43937285 Report

Quoted By: >>43937297

>>43935743
>it's Brave Bird without the recoil
Stronger actually. Scizor's Dual Wing Beat has 120 BP, Scyther is slinging around fucking 180 BP.
>>43935784
Enough with this shit, Scizor's existence only benefits Scyther since now it has access to Eviolite.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:45:23 No.43937297 Report

Quoted By: >>43937335

>>43937285
Brave Bird is 120. Scyther's Wingbeat just trades recoil for imperfect accuracy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:50:20 No.43937335 Report

Quoted By: >>43937346 >>43937350

>>43937297
>Standard wing beat is 40 power each hit
>40+40=80
>Technician wing beat is 60 power each hit (Scizor)
>60+60=120 (same as brave bird)
>Technician STAB wing beat is 90 power each hit (Scyther)
>90+90=180

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:50:40 No.43937336 Report

Quoted By:

>>43935981
Nothing, and it lose HP Fire. I guess you could still use Eviolite Magneton with Analytic though. 60/95/70 defenses with 120 special attack is actually very good.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:51:39 No.43937346 Report

Quoted By: >>43937357

>>43937335
And STAB Brave Bird is effectively 180 BP
Half of 120 is 60. 60+120=180

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:52:12 No.43937350 Report

Quoted By: >>43937361

>>43937335
He's talking about before stab because people only ever run brave bird on flying types you absolute autist

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:52:38 No.43937357 Report

Quoted By: >>43937624

>>43937346
Scyther doesn't learn brave bird. Why are you counting it's STAB?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 18:53:40 No.43937361 Report

Quoted By: >>43938411

>>43937350
>people only ever run brave bird on flying types you absolute autist
That's actually bull shit. Blaziken runs it for example.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 19:17:02 No.43937624 Report

Quoted By: >>43937655

>>43937357
You’re saying Dual Wing Beat is stronger than Brave Bird when it’s not

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 19:19:09 No.43937655 Report

Quoted By: >>43937842 >>43937908 >>43938267 >>43938344

>>43937624
Wing Beatdown has two separate crit chances sweaty

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 19:34:55 No.43937842 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937655
It also has 90% accuracy if I'm not mistaken.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 19:40:41 No.43937908 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937655
And?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 20:18:02 No.43938267 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937655
that only makes it better against mons that have defense boosts, otherwise on average BB will do more damage than DWB

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 20:24:56 No.43938344 Report

Quoted By: >>43938941 >>43942949

>>43937655
That means it does less damage overall.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 20:30:31 No.43938411 Report

Quoted By: >>43938863

>>43937361
why run bravebird when flare blitz already hits bugs and grass.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:07:09 No.43938863 Report

Quoted By:

>>43938411

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:11:32 No.43938907 Report

Quoted By: >>43950940

>>43935222
>fanfic metas
ewww
but finally bro got his deserved powerful flying stab, not acrobatics but even better
too bad it's stuck in a shit game and gen

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:14:15 No.43938941 Report

Quoted By: >>43953932

>>43938344
Ok retard

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:17:27 No.43938984 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937044

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:28:12 No.43939106 Report

Quoted By: >>43939153 >>43940059

>>43937044
Yes anon, they know they're better than you, than 90% of other players, that's why they call themselves the council.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:31:29 No.43939147 Report

Quoted By: >>43947818

>90% accuracy
what the fuck gamefreak
is it that much to ask for an 80 BP 100% accurate move
between this and the rock move it feels like different autists are in charge of balancing

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:31:50 No.43939153 Report

Quoted By: >>43939322

>>43939106
kys tranny

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 21:50:23 No.43939322 Report

Quoted By:

>>43939153
he said better than 90% of other players, not 40%

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 22:56:16 No.43940044 Report

Quoted By:

>>43935981
Nothing. It was just automatically placed in NFE despite being one of the few NFE mons that's always been usable in actual tiers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Jun 2020 22:58:09 No.43940059 Report

Quoted By:

>>43939106
They don't even play the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 00:56:48 No.43941160 Report

Quoted By: >>43941228

>>43937044
They've been autistically dedicating themselves to competitive Pokemon for over a decade.
They are a higher authority on Pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 01:00:24 No.43941203 Report

Quoted By:

>>43935743
>>43935940
This thing is a nightmare to face in Tier Shift. So much so that it got quickbanned. Even now that it’s PUBL, I doubt much will change aside from important speed tiers

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 01:01:59 No.43941228 Report

Quoted By: >>43941440 >>43942380

>>43941160
No, sweetheart. They've been dedicating themselves to their own made-up rules.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO vgc 15.png, 782KiB, 1024x738

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 01:22:26 No.43941440 Report

Quoted By: >>43943465

>>43941228
Someone has to make up the rules.
And that someone sure as hell shouldn't be Gamefreak.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 03:03:40 No.43942296 Report

Quoted By:

>>43937044
They literally are.
And even then, they don't even do quickbans for the most part. They usually just decide what the vote should be and let the players who prove their skill make the final decision.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 03:12:52 No.43942380 Report

Quoted By: >>43942384

>>43941228
rent free

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 03:13:40 No.43942384 Report

Quoted By: >>43942890

>>43942380
You're the faggots who keep posting this shit on my board.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 04:22:07 No.43942890 Report

Quoted By: >>43943470

>>43942384
This is a Pokemon board and Smogon is the way that tens of thousands of people choose to play Pokemon.
Seeing you seethe at every mention of Smogon doesn't make VGC look more appealing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 04:29:50 No.43942949 Report

Quoted By: >>43953932

>>43938344
Not really, means it's more likely to get at least 1 crit while less likely to do 2 in a row than the original move is to just getting one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 05:41:38 No.43943465 Report

Quoted By:

>>43941440
>implying Lando T doesn't also get spammed in shitgon

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 05:42:34 No.43943470 Report

Quoted By: >>43944595

>>43942890
He doesn’t even play VGC.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 09:02:20 No.43944595 Report

Quoted By: >>43945153 >>43946355

>>43943470
That doesn't make any sense. Why would he defend VGC so vehemently if he doesn't even play it?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 11:03:26 No.43945153 Report

Quoted By:

>>43944595
Because Smogon lives in his head rent free. Even if VGC is more appealing, you’d never hear how from this board because they don’t play it, let alone is good at the game. You barely see any threads about VGC here

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 14:07:40 No.43946355 Report

Quoted By:

>>43944595
/vp/ is the most contrarian board on the website.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 14:08:42 No.43946373 Report

Quoted By: >>43947795 >>43949977

>>43935222
>smogon

Into the trash it goes
I prefer to battle via official rulesets instead of smth the internet tells me

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 16:30:25 No.43947795 Report

Quoted By:

>>43946373
Post pokeball rank

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 16:33:19 No.43947818 Report

Quoted By:

>>43939147
Stop trying to powercreep the game zoomer

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 18:33:00 No.43949059 Report

Quoted By: >>43949482

>>43935784
Your shitty dino mantis needs to stop getting buffs

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 19:06:43 No.43949482 Report

Quoted By: >>43952499

>>43949059
It's gotten approximately 3 buffs in the span of its existence.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 19:47:30 No.43949977 Report

Quoted By:

>>43946373
Yeah. Just get your rulesets from a council of out-of-touch boomers instead of a council of obsessively dedicated autists.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:00:16 No.43950781 Report

Quoted By: >>43950862

>>43935222
I mean, yeah.
These mons should've never been allowed in PU to begin with.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:07:32 No.43950862 Report

Quoted By: >>43950906

>>43950781
It's just a technicality. The past 2 gens sucked post-bank when a good chunk of the returning Pokemon were held hostage by high tiers for multiple months until they could settle down where they belong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:12:04 No.43950906 Report

Quoted By: >>43950928

>>43950862
Oh, I know.
Just this gen, Farfetch'd took about 4 months to drop to PU.
But wouldn't it make more sense to put these mons in the tiers they were in last gen instead of the lowest one possible?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:14:12 No.43950928 Report

Quoted By: >>43950947

>>43950906
I think that would be the best idea. Having a Pokemon drop multiple tiers at once is the next best thing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:15:00 No.43950940 Report

Quoted By: >>43950969 >>43958020

>>43938907

Why did fanfic meta become such a popular insult after the dexcut? Are you actually angry that people are still playing with the national dex?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:15:28 No.43950947 Report

Quoted By: >>43950989

>>43950928
That's what they're doing this month, I think.
The NFE's are an exception.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:17:37 No.43950969 Report

Quoted By:

>>43950940
It's more like the shilling got cranked up to 11 after the dexcut, and spamming "fanfic meta" was a natural extension of the need to defend everything official.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 21:18:46 No.43950989 Report

Quoted By: >>43957046

>>43950947
That's exactly what they are doing. I like that. Hopefully it works out well enough to continue into the future.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 23:33:58 No.43952499 Report

Quoted By:

>>43949482
And that’s 3 buffs too many

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Jun 2020 23:40:20 No.43952584 Report

Quoted By: >>43953007

Doesn't Scyther have the same BST as Scizor?
Why did omgon think it was a good idea to have it start out in PU?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 00:23:19 No.43953007 Report

Quoted By: >>43953758

>>43952584
Because it's NFE.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 01:34:57 No.43953758 Report

Quoted By: >>43953771

>>43953007
But it's in the top percentage of NFE's. It's one of the few NFE's to actually be decent in real tiers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 01:35:42 No.43953771 Report

Quoted By: >>43953785

>>43953758
It’s still a NFE

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 01:36:37 No.43953785 Report

Quoted By: >>43954010

>>43953771
A bug/flying NFE at that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 01:47:34 No.43953932 Report

Quoted By: >>43954707

>>43938941
>>43942949
Crits have a 1/24 chance if happening
For BB, this means:
120*(23/24) + 120*1.5*(1/24)
115 + 7.5 = 122.5

For DW, it’s harder since you factor in 2 hits and missing, but to simplify, lets pretend DW is going to hit.
For neither critting, this is a (23/24)^2 chance
0.918402777777778
For 1 hit critting and the other not critting, this is a (1/24)*(23/24)
0.039930555555556
And both hits critting is (1/24)^2
0.001736111111111

120*0.918402777777778 + 150*0.039930555555556 + 180*0.001736111111111

110.2083333333333 + 5.989583333333333 + 0.3125 = 116.5104163~

So Brave Bird’s expected value is 122.5, where as Dual Wingbeat’s expected value is about 116.5, and this does not consider accuracy either.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 01:55:21 No.43954010 Report

Quoted By: >>43954194

>>43953785
Too bad there isn't some kind of item that eliminates the main problem with Bug/Flying mons.
Oh well.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 02:02:41 No.43954117 Report

Quoted By: >>43956142

I used to use scarf magneton even in higher tiers, what does it even use do now with no HP fire?
Three electric attacks?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 02:09:05 No.43954194 Report

Quoted By: >>43954334 >>43955034

>>43954010
What eliminates their lack of coverage?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 02:20:59 No.43954334 Report

Quoted By:

>>43954194
Better coverage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 02:54:29 No.43954707 Report

Quoted By:

>>43953932
Please never use more than 4 decimals in a probability calculation.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 03:23:56 No.43955034 Report

Quoted By: >>43956662

>>43954194
Their main problem is a 4x stealth rock weakness. Lacking coverage is a case-by-base basis.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 05:16:03 No.43956142 Report

Quoted By: >>43956189

>>43954117
You can use Thunderbolt, Volt Switch, Flash Cannon, and... uh... Tri Attack?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 05:22:50 No.43956189 Report

Quoted By: >>43956480 >>43956843

>>43956142
Flash Cannon and Steel Beam?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 06:01:17 No.43956480 Report

Quoted By: >>43956843 >>43958008

>>43956189
I guess Steel Beam is alright. If you like losing half of your HP.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 06:35:57 No.43956662 Report

Quoted By: >>43956825

>>43955034
>Their main problem is a 4x stealth rock weakness.
No it’s not

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 07:01:01 No.43956825 Report

Quoted By: >>43958878

>>43956662
Yeah it is.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 07:04:14 No.43956843 Report

Quoted By: >>43957046

>>43956480
>>43956189
I do not believe the Magneton line gets Steel Beam, anons.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 07:43:46 No.43957046 Report

Quoted By: >>43957083

>>43956843
Steel Beam is the Steel equivalent of Draco Meteor, every Steel type that you can transfer to SS can use it.
>>43950989
I think it's going to work well, so they are probably doing it again for Crown Tundra and future DLC releases. It's honestly unneeded to do it for normal months. Maybe they could do it for future generation releases in order to speed up tier formation? The downside is that it would be too chaotic in that situation.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 07:48:04 No.43957083 Report

Quoted By:

>>43957046
Yeah. The issue with quickrises and quickdrops is that a meta can get completely fucked over in a single month.
Imagine if an OU mon got such low usage one month that it dropped all the way to PU. It'd be a disaster for PU, NU, and RU. UU already has enough trouble with mons the meta isn't equipped to handle dropping from OU.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 08:13:43 No.43957211 Report

Quoted By: >>43957388 >>43957616

What's a good Scyther set? Do people even bother to run Eviolite on it?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 08:43:21 No.43957388 Report

Quoted By:

>>43957211
eviolite roost, knock off/swords dance, dual wingbeat, brick break

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 09:16:20 No.43957616 Report

Quoted By:

>>43957211
heavy duty boots swords dance u turn dual wing beat knock off

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 10:02:36 No.43958008 Report

Quoted By:

>>43956480
>remove and make a hole in a team
>b-but half hp or suicide hurrr

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 10:04:53 No.43958020 Report

Quoted By: >>43958086

>>43950940
>after the dexcut
oh no, a smogon drone and roleplauer and also a newfag revisionist

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 10:14:42 No.43958086 Report

Quoted By: >>43958102 >>43958428

>>43958020
The archive clearly shows that fanfic meta only started getting spammed around November 2019.
https://archive.nyafuu.org/vp/search/text/Fanfic%20meta/page/48/

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 10:17:07 No.43958102 Report

Quoted By:

>>43958086
the truth isn't even that, it is that Smogon banned Dynamax because it is clearly broken and they are still seething because anything in the shill's eyes that shits on gen 8 is wrong and gen 8 can do no wrong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 11:04:07 No.43958428 Report

Quoted By:

>>43958086
It is an evolution of https://archive.nyafuu.org/vp/search/text/Fanmade%20meta/page/3/

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 21 Jun 2020 12:16:40 No.43958878 Report

Quoted By:

>>43956825
I never see stealth rock in actual ranked

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