/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #44756974

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Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:23:32 No.44756974 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>44757041 >>44757044 >>44757067 >>44757071 >>44757099 >>44757219 >>44757410 >>44757972 >>44760153

How well do you think Pokemon would benefit from going “Open World”? Or do you feel like “Open World” is a worthless endeavor?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:25:15 No.44756983 Report

Quoted By: >>44757058

like fornite

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:34:38 No.44757040 Report

Quoted By:

Open world is a meme

It could definitely benefit from being MORE open, make the routes more expansive, add more side areas to explore, maybe start adding real side quests (that aren't just 'catch x' or 'bring me item').
But the obsession /vp/ has with doing the Gyms in any order is retarded.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:34:42 No.44757041 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756974
Yes, but GF couldn't pull it off well

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:35:06 No.44757044 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756974
The time is right, the current formula is stale as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:38:18 No.44757058 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756983
YAMEROOOOOOOO

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:39:49 No.44757067 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756974
The originals had open world elements in them. While open world is a meme for most games it unironically fits Pokemon so much that

I was about to say it was baffling it hasn't been done but this is game freak we're talking about

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:40:21 No.44757071 Report

Quoted By: >>44757429

>>44756974
Pixelmon is perfect MMO open world pokemon experience

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:47:16 No.44757099 Report

Quoted By: >>44757152 >>44757334

>>44756974
Realistically speaking, how would a pokemon open world game even work? How do you keep both the linear level progression and the open world structure?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 12:58:47 No.44757152 Report

Quoted By: >>44757160 >>44757211 >>44757241 >>44757269 >>44757372 >>44757514

>>44757099
The only options are
>The Kanto approach: just level everything as normal, and if the player wants to skip something they can. However there's literally no reason to skip anything since it will just make everything else easier when you come back overlevelled
>The Johto approach: make everything on the entire map the same level so you don't punish kids who accidentally skip something. Has the downside of completely ruining your entire region and jesus christ why the fuck do people still defend this garbage
>The Morrowind approach: similar to Kanto except everything is harder, and some things do level to not trivialise them later. Falls apart when you realise Pokemon is a turn-based dice-rolling simulator and cheese is as simple as waiting for the RNG to let you catch an overlevelled Tyranitar before the first Gym.
>The SWSH approach: lets you find overlevelled stuff but restricts you from catching them. Ultimately makes the open world thing pointless since it's just linear but with the illusion of freedom that doesn't let you actually do anything with it.
>The Utopia approach: the people who somehow expect gamefreak to scale the levels of every single NPC and wild Pokemon to your badge count so you can do literally anything in any order without feeling any change in gameplay whatsoever because your relative strength never increases.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:00:18 No.44757160 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757152
The kanto and morrowind approaches are the best. Level scaling is a meme.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:13:17 No.44757211 Report

Quoted By: >>44757218

>>44757152
>Falls apart when you realise Pokemon is a turn-based dice-rolling simulator and cheese is as simple as waiting for the RNG to let you catch an overlevelled Tyranitar before the first Gym.
Just make overleveled Pokemon not obey you. Or make actually catching a pokemon above your party's average level rarer than getting a shiny (you can easily remove outliners to keep the players from gaming the system. Or instead of just average level just keep track of how kuch exp the player already got). If the player wasted several hours to finally catch the overleveled Tyranitar they fucking deserve it, even if they probably ruined the game for themselves.
Of course actually giving players agency seems to go against GF's design philosophy

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:15:33 No.44757218 Report

Quoted By: >>44757231

>>44757211
But if you're gonna restrict what you can do in areas higher level than yourself, what's even the point of letting the player into them?
You've just made the game functionally linear again, since there's literally no reason to go off the intended path

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:15:49 No.44757219 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756974
Generic answer but it depends on how its used.
I don't think its the way the series HAS to go or else it'll suck but I also don't think it'd be worthless to explore the idea.
The thing is(and this is also a generic answer on /vp/) GF can't be trusted with implementing an actually ambitous idea when they can barely handle the current state of the main series.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:17:11 No.44757231 Report

Quoted By: >>44757365

>>44757218
It's almost as if the games would need more than just catching and battling to actually work as open world or something

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:19:24 No.44757241 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757152
To be fair in-lore the gyms are adjusted to your current level of expertise as a trainer(except in Galar) and scaling the gyms wouldn't be that problematic(you'd only need 8 possible sets of levels for each gym and that's if you make all the gyms open at the same time).
Don't scale the mons and NPCs so there's still a "natural" order(have Ash do that in the anime for instance).

Basically an improved Kanto that's closer to the lore.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:24:21 No.44757269 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757152
The Johto approach is bad but not for what you say. The reason Johto fails is because the "default" is super low and they don't balance more carefully around the freeform areas.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:36:38 No.44757334 Report

Quoted By: >>44757365

>>44757099
Start by reducing the effects of levels on stats. Being able to one-shot anything that's 10 levels below you with any move is not good gameplay.
Add more elements to battles like dodging, protecting,a basic movement system (the close you are the more damage you deal),etc.to emphasize strategizing over just being higher level.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:41:58 No.44757365 Report

Quoted By: >>44757373 >>44757401

>>44757231
>>44757334
>it would work if you just reinvent the entire game
Improving what we have is much better than half-assing an entirely new formula

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:42:28 No.44757372 Report

Quoted By: >>44757862

>>44757152
>>The Utopia approach: the people who somehow expect gamefreak to scale the levels of every single NPC and wild Pokemon to your badge count
Are you implying that's impossible? It can be as easy as doing level *= (nb_badges/total_badges) + some arbitrary constant

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:42:58 No.44757373 Report

Quoted By: >>44757385

>>44757365
They've been "improving what we have" for nearly 25 years now

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:44:15 No.44757385 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757373
stacking more gimmicks on top of each other like a house of cards isn't improvement
there are still basic fundamental mechanics that haven't been changed since Gen 1

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:46:17 No.44757401 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757365
Do you think 3d zelda games would've worked if they kept the same formula as the 2d games? No, when you change a game's genre you have to adapt the mechanics. It's not hard to understand.
I miss the times back in gen 2-4 when the battle mechanics were something you'd expect them to improve upon each new iteration of the games and not some holy thing that must not be touched for fear of enraging the nostalgiafags.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:46:25 No.44757403 Report

Quoted By:

I'm convinced openworldfags just see that one fanart of Red riding a Lapras and immediately run to every forum on the internet to start spouting their retarded shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:46:42 No.44757407 Report

Quoted By:

I dont think pokemon needs to go open world but they definitely need to expand upon routes and cities like the wild area / isle of armour

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:47:41 No.44757410 Report

Quoted By: >>44762695

>>44756974
It would be cool for a spinoff.
There's a reason mario works despite it being run right and jump for 35 years.

They make spinoff games and keep classic mario style to.
If you decide the next canon pokemon game is a botw game, it will become expected from you to produce that level of quality again and again.

Digimon died because of this.
Yokai watch died because of this.
And as far as I'm concerned assassins creed died because of this.

If you want to do an open world pokemon game, you would not have all the pokemon or things you want to do. Closest you can hope is something like a Diablo esque combat with a much smaller move pool and lots of copy paste particle effects.

Picture a giant version of pokemon rumble.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 13:50:28 No.44757429 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757071
This guy is right.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 14:05:35 No.44757514 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757152
>The Johto approach: make everything on the entire map the same level so you don't punish kids who accidentally skip something. Has the downside of completely ruining your entire region and jesus christ why the fuck do people still defend this garbage

Johto fucked up a lot of things but the Ecruteak fork is the worst of all

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 15:00:55 No.44757862 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757372
If you want to get fancy you can let trainer's Pokemon evolve if the formula would put it's level would be above some predefined X or even let trainer's pick randomly from a list of rentals if the player has Y bagdes

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 15:20:56 No.44757972 Report

Quoted By: >>44757977

>>44756974
GF doesn't have time to develop a BotW Pokemon. Said game would take years to make. They're on schedule with games releasing every 1 or 2 years.

TPC isn't just going to grind everything to a halt to wait for GF 4 or 5 years to develop such a game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 15:21:39 No.44757977 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757972
The sad truth

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 19:43:04 No.44760153 Report

Quoted By:

>>44756974
There's nothing wrong with open world.
Breath of the Wild was great because Nintendo actually gives a fuck about making good games.
A good open world game takes lots of time, effort, and skill to make. And it's way easier to fuck them up than a linear game.
Gamefreak can barely even make a linear game. If they try to make a full open-world game, it'll be shit.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 07 Sep 2020 19:55:39 No.44760256 Report

Quoted By:

>How well do you think Pokemon would benefit from going “Open World”?

Not very. Everyone who uses Breath of the Wild comparatively for the series should realize that Zelda games are exploratory. Pokémon games don't benefit the player with exploration aside from rare monster spawns and TMs.

A lot of Pokémon games are shaped by battling and raising monsters, which is a different flow from Zelda -- especially BoTW which has a material and quest system, so the player is directly rewarded for more than just fighting.

>Or do you feel like “Open World” is a worthless endeavor?

I feel a lot of players who want Open World in a Pokémon game almost always mean for a specific part of the series.

They don't want it for the series or a new region. They want it for Kanto because they want people to see the region and original games the way they did when they were between 4-12 or so.

You can't replicate someone else's feelings or romanticized memories in a game, everyone experiences a series differently but most importantly putting all that work in a Pokémon game that doesn't enhance the series in terms of new monsters to capture feels like a decadent effort to please a part of the fanbase that only wants to necromance their childhood sensation as if it were the definitive Pokémon experience. I'd rather the world of Pokémon expand than give Kanto a makeover.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 08 Sep 2020 00:53:49 No.44762695 Report

Quoted By:

>>44757410
Retard.

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