/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #44917966

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33KiB, 1280x720, galarian-corsola-img01.jpg

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:23:11 No.44917966 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>44917969 >>44917973 >>44917975 >>44917976 >>44917986 >>44917989 >>44918015 >>44918048 >>44918763 >>44919347 >>44920378 >>44921488 >>44925843 >>44925848 >>44927589 >>44927889 >>44929773 >>44930353 >>44930666

why did smogoncucks suddenly stop using this cancer?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:23:32 No.44917969 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
New toy syndrome

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:23:59 No.44917973 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
They stopped using it because it's shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:24:07 No.44917975 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Dynamax was banned

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:24:08 No.44917976 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Knock Off, maxing

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:25:29 No.44917986 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Dynamax was banned and Pokemon Home let knock off back into the meta

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:25:52 No.44917989 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
home released and everything got knock off again
simple as

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:29:54 No.44918015 Report

Quoted By: >>44918178 >>44918298 >>44921098

>>44917966
>ghost type
>Strenght Sap as a recovery move
>has to carry Eviolite on a tier where stallmons rely on Boots
>Knock Off everywhere
>Stallmons out stall him

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:30:08 No.44918016 Report

Quoted By: >>44918192 >>44918198

>dynamax is banned
Really smogfags? Holy fuck you all are boring.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:35:42 No.44918048 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
>can be affected by toxic aka toxapex
>strength sap dont do shit
>dies to pex knock off

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:57:43 No.44918178 Report

Quoted By: >>44918184 >>44918192

>>44918015
I don't Fer it why the first two are bad

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 14:58:39 No.44918184 Report

Quoted By: >>44918222 >>44918269

>>44918178
Ghost is good as an offensive type or as a defensive type for offensive Pokemon.

It's bad as a defensive type for defensive Pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:00:31 No.44918192 Report

Quoted By: >>44920720 >>44927516

>>44918016
I'll tell you what is boring, sweeping with/getting swept by Gyarados/Hawlucha every second game.
>>44918178
Ghost is weak to one of the most common coverage types and offensive Ghost types are extremely strong this gen thanks to Pursuit being cut. Strength Sap gets weaker with every use and is bad against special attackers from the get go.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:01:37 No.44918198 Report

Quoted By: >>44920368

>>44918016
Fuck dynamaxing. Stupid ass mechanic

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:05:32 No.44918222 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918184
I think there's some caveats for that. Defensive ghost is fine looking at things that don't automatically die if hit by knock off like Aegislash and Sableye. Hell, look at Gen 4 Rotom. Pursuit even got killed by SWSH to make defensive ghost better.

Defensive Ghost is fine, knock off is just broken, but we've known that since Gen 6 when it got buffed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:15:49 No.44918269 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918184
Ghost really isn't *too* bad of a defensive type on paper, for the same reason normal isn't too bad of a defensive type. Both are poor defensive typing for pokemon with mediocre defensive stats, but on the flip side both actually become extremely good when a pokemon's bulk is very statistically high due to the lack of weaknesses. This is similar to how chansey can abuse its normal typing in conjunction with its raw bulk to wall a lot of neutral hits.
Ghost also has some pretty good type combos and can lead to some well typed defensive pokemon like sableye or jellicent.
The main problem with most ghosts defensively is that many lack reliable recovery and for some reason they tend to have pretty low hp stats overal.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:18:45 No.44918298 Report

Quoted By: >>44918322 >>44918351 >>44918367 >>44926178 >>44930141 >>44930675

>>44918015
>stallmons rely on Boots

Retards
Toxapex, Clefable, Blissey...etc give zero shit about hazards
Hazards are stall and affect HO mons the most

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:21:46 No.44918322 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918298
Blissey is literally one of the biggest users of Boots. The reason Blissey is better than Chansey now is because Blissey can run Boots.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:25:06 No.44918351 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918298
>Toxapex

Regenerator

>Clefable

Magic Guard is built-in boots

>Blissey

Uses boots

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 15:27:48 No.44918367 Report

Quoted By: >>44925832

>>44918298
>Blissey...etc give zero shit about hazards
Literally why people use Blissey over Chansey now is because it can use boots retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 16:19:22 No.44918763 Report

Quoted By: >>44918835

>>44917966
Simple.
The opponent switches in their Clefable/Toxapex/Blissey/Corviknight/etc in on your Corsola.
What do you do?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 16:28:32 No.44918835 Report

Quoted By: >>44926779

>>44918763
i don't know, i don't use stall pokemon because i'm not a faggot

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 16:35:10 No.44918883 Report

Quoted By:

Pre-home didn't have knock off. This is the only reason it was half relevant.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Corsola-Galar.png, 179KiB, 606x607

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 16:58:02 No.44919055 Report

Quoted By:

>That feel when le 65bp move of item lossage is back

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 17:43:16 No.44919347 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Corsola has no pressure if the opponent doesn't care about getting burned.
>Corsola used stealth rock
>Mandibuzz/Corviknight used defog
>"Hey, stop that!"
>"No."
>"ok"

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 19:48:17 No.44920368 Report

Quoted By: >>44921616 >>44926005

>>44918198
t.Megaevo Z-move fag.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 19:49:18 No.44920378 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
>Literally everything used Knock Off!

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 20:30:22 No.44920720 Report

Quoted By: >>44920739

>>44918192
>I'll tell you what is boring, sweeping with/getting swept by Gyarados/Hawlucha every second game.

Much less boring than 300 turns battles involving Toxapex and Clefable on both sides
Btw any sweaper is easily defeatable with Sash+Metal Burst

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 20:32:59 No.44920739 Report

Quoted By: >>44924567

>>44920720
>bro just run this extremely specific set and hope your opponent was nice enough not to set up hazards

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 21:20:44 No.44921098 Report

Quoted By: >>44921556

>>44918015
>has to carry Eviolite on a tier where stallmons rely on Boots
>Knock Off everywhere
Boot haters continue to be brainlets of brainlets.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 21:59:14 No.44921488 Report

Quoted By: >>44923552

>>44917966
It was only good in the Dynamax meta, and everything getting Knock Off again meant it was extremely easy to get gimped by having its Eviolite knocked off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 22:06:26 No.44921556 Report

Quoted By: >>44922661

>>44921098
"Knock Off everywhere" has always been a meme because anything that gives a shit about it's item won't let itself get knocked

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 24 Sep 2020 22:12:47 No.44921616 Report

Quoted By: >>44922757

>>44920368
I hate all three, why did gamefreak decide that all future games have to have shitty gimmicks now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 00:20:52 No.44922661 Report

Quoted By:

>>44921556
Anything that gives a shit about its item needs to be extra careful.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 00:36:39 No.44922757 Report

Quoted By: >>44923789

>>44921616
Because they can't think of any other changes to Pokemon's battle system

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 02:22:45 No.44923552 Report

Quoted By:

>>44921488
>It was only good in the Dynamax meta
It wasn’t

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 02:57:46 No.44923789 Report

Quoted By: >>44925402

>>44922757
What are they gonna do when they run out of ideas for shitty gimmicks?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 05:27:29 No.44924567 Report

Quoted By: >>44925290 >>44926917

>>44920739
>and hope your opponent was nice enough not to set up hazards

What is Hatterene

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 08:13:22 No.44925290 Report

Quoted By:

>>44924567
What is Excadrill?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 08:35:54 No.44925402 Report

Quoted By:

>>44923789
fuse them
this is what they did for giga-necrozma

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 10:22:06 No.44925832 Report

Quoted By: >>44927486

>>44918367
Blissey is an exception due to the vast majority of its EHP being tied to its raw HP while SR is % damage, it’s not anywhere near representative of stall as a whole

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 10:24:20 No.44925843 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Dynamax was banned and general audiences started realizing SwSh sucked.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO I ALWAYS HATED IT.png, 2MiB, 1440x1080

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 10:25:24 No.44925848 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
I ALWAYS HATED IT!

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 11:13:54 No.44926005 Report

Quoted By:

>>44920368
Yeah, mechanics that are actually balanced and have place in a competitive setting. How crazy that he would prefer them.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 12:04:12 No.44926178 Report

Quoted By: >>44929788

>>44918298
Have you asked yourself why Blissey gives zero shit about hazards?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 13:42:36 No.44926766 Report

Quoted By: >>44926782 >>44926912

Not removing Knock Off was the biggest mistake of Gen 8. It was manageable in Gens 6 and 7 because Megas and Z-Crystals couldn't be knocked off, but now there's zero counterplay to Knock Off; you're losing an item no matter what.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 13:44:49 No.44926779 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918835
>i don't use good pokemon because my elo is low
FTFY

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 13:45:40 No.44926782 Report

Quoted By: >>44926912

>>44926766
>Knock Off stayed
>Pursuit removed
Biggest fucking mistake right here

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 14:07:38 No.44926912 Report

Quoted By: >>44926923 >>44926952

>>44926766
>>44926782
>you're losing an item no matter what
exactly as in gens 3, 4 and 5, yet the meta managed to deal with it anyway

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 14:08:57 No.44926917 Report

Quoted By:

>>44924567
>druddigon breaks the mold!

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 14:10:36 No.44926923 Report

Quoted By:

>>44926912
Knock Off was only 20 BP back then and didn't get a 50% boost when it removed an item.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 14:16:30 No.44926952 Report

Quoted By:

>>44926912
Knock Off had an opportunity cost back then because it was very weak and therefore only fit on utility oriented movesets. Now it's an amazing STAB or coverage move that can be almost as strong as Earthquake.
I don't think it should necessarily be removed because otherwise Boots (and not just them) would be unbearable, but it could have used a nerf (for example, no power boost when removing an item, or 40 BP doubling to 80), and/or Megas could be reintroduced to help absorb it (Z moves still belong in the bin).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 15:28:57 No.44927486 Report

Quoted By:

>>44925832
You're fucking retarded.
The raw HP number lost is completely irrelevant, 12.5% is 12.5%

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 15:31:31 No.44927516 Report

Quoted By: >>44927551

>>44918192
>wah I don't have priority and can't outspeed unboosted Gyarados

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 15:34:36 No.44927538 Report

Quoted By:

Basically what everyone else said about Dynamax and Knock Off, but also Poltegeist exists.

Corsola solely relies on Eviolite, yet Poltergeist exploits that with super effective damage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 15:35:48 No.44927551 Report

Quoted By:

>>44927516
yeah that good old quick attack/shadowsneak/whatever that does like 25% to gyarados or half that when it's maxed

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 15:40:45 No.44927589 Report

Quoted By: >>44929819

>>44917966
I don't play showdown but I fucking love this mon perfect for monotype ghost team on cart. Even when it gets taken down rather quickly it always manages to do something before death.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 16:19:27 No.44927889 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
>use substitute
>Use set up move
>sweep team with +2 spa and spd
Great work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 20:37:46 No.44929773 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Galarian trevenant

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 20:40:09 No.44929788 Report

Quoted By: >>44929814 >>44929829 >>44930182

>>44926178
Because it has a gazillion HP and can use Soft-Boiled 16 fucking times

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 20:43:46 No.44929814 Report

Quoted By:

>>44929788
Yet it still runs boots

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 20:44:39 No.44929819 Report

Quoted By:

>>44927589
shut up mike

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 20:45:42 No.44929829 Report

Quoted By: >>44930276 >>44930305

>>44929788
>Because it has a gazillion HP
Which means hazards matter relatively more because they end up doing more damage than direct attacks.
>can use Soft-Boiled 16 fucking times
It means wasting turns healing passive damage that you have the optional to avoid

You don't play the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:30:29 No.44930141 Report

Quoted By:

>>44918298
>Blissey gives zero shits about hazards
93% of Blisseys run HDB.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:36:24 No.44930182 Report

Quoted By: >>44930276

>>44929788
Hazards do percentage based damage, so the damage is the same regardless of how much HP the Pokemon has.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:48:40 No.44930276 Report

Quoted By: >>44930303 >>44930543

>>44930182
>>44929829
Hazards are jack shit on their own, genius (unless you're charizard)
Blissey's massive HP allows him not to worry about the move he will be hit by just before using Soft-Boiled, and then even when said move is combined to hazards damages

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:52:22 No.44930303 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930276
The damage adds up over time retard, using Soft-Boiled is a committment (allows the opponent free set-up or a free switch). There is a reason why Chansey has basically disappeared despite being much bulkier than Blissey.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:52:29 No.44930305 Report

Quoted By: >>44930313

>>44929829
>You don't play the game.

I indeed don't play 1800 ELO 500 turns-long Stall vs Stall battles, which are the only occurence of Blissey acring about hazards

But when it's Stall vs HO, hazards are much more of a hinderence to the offensive team since it cannot heal for dozens of turn like the stall one do.
Healing moves should be reduced to 5PP max so stall can stop being boring cancer

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:54:00 No.44930313 Report

Quoted By: >>44930331

>>44930305
>hazards are much more of a hinderence to the offensive team since it cannot heal for dozens of turn like the stall one do

Except no because offensive teams don't switch out as much

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 21:57:21 No.44930331 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930313
They also don't heal
Losing 1/4th of your HP once when you cannot heal is worse than losing 1/4 of your HP several times when you can heal 16 times
And since HO teams can't last for 100+ turns, they never reach the moment when Stallmons can start caring as much as HO mons do about that 1/4th HP lost (aka after they wasted their 16PP of recovery).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:02:27 No.44930353 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
It doesnt learn toxic

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:31:20 No.44930543 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930276
>Hazards are jack shit on their own
Not if you're a stallmon who switches every turn.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:34:27 No.44930568 Report

Quoted By: >>44930577 >>44930593 >>44930698

Only on /vp/ would you find absolute braindead morons who insist Blissey doesn't care about hazards when literally the reason Blissey even gets used over the bulkier Chansey in gen 8 is the fact that it can hold an item that negates hazards.

This board never ceases to amaze. What other place is as bad at its dedicated topic as /vp/?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:36:00 No.44930577 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930568
Point is Blissey only care about hazards when pitted against stall teams

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:38:06 No.44930593 Report

Quoted By: >>44930627 >>44930637

>>44930568
Blissey DOESN'T care about hazards BECAUSE it can hold an item that negates hazards.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:43:19 No.44930627 Report

Quoted By: >>44930657

>>44930593
No, that is non-sensical reasoning. Blissey CARES about hazards which is why it gives up its itemslot to negate them. And why people even run Blissey in the first place because Chansey was an objectively superior choice in the previous gens.

Not to mention that retard above insisted it doesn't care about hazards because it has "gazillion HP" and not even because of boots.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:44:33 No.44930637 Report

Quoted By: >>44930649

>>44930593
And also because it can recover most of its HP 16 times, and any non-stall team would have already lost most of its pokemon by the time a Blissey runs out of Soft-Boiled PP

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:46:34 No.44930649 Report

Quoted By: >>44930677

>>44930637
No, you clinical retard. Soft-Boiled does not mean Blissey doesn't care about hazards. Have you ever fucking opened showdown before? I specifically say showdown and not "have you played before" because you seem to believe beating the CPUs in singleplayer cartridge gives you insight into how Smogon singles work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:47:51 No.44930657 Report

Quoted By: >>44930667 >>44930684

>>44930627
>Blissey CARES about hazards which is why it gives up its itemslot to negate them.
Your logic isn't making sense.
As you already said, Blissey uses an item to negate hazards, so it doesn't care about hazards at all.
Only in some fantasy fairy-tale land that exists only in your mind where 90% of Blissey don't run boots do they care about hazards.
If you're playing a game and you want to set up hazards to deal with a Blissey, it's not gonna work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:50:04 No.44930666 Report

Quoted By:

>>44917966
Because it's not good?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:50:12 No.44930667 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930657
Yes, because otherwise hazards would destroy it

Boots are the sole reason to use Blissey instead of Eviolite Chansey

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:51:49 No.44930675 Report

Quoted By: >>44930683

>>44918298
Blissey is finally better than Chansey after a decade because of Boots. Blissey does give afuck about hazads because it turned 3HKOs into 2HKOs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:51:52 No.44930677 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930649
>Have you ever fucking opened showdown before?

Yes, it usually goes like that
>HO vs Stall
>SR somehow ends up on the stallfags side (most probably magic bounced, since SR is a stall move)
>stallfag sends Blissey
>Blissey loses 1/4th of HP
>HO mon uses some move, Blissey loses very few HP
>Blissey used Soft-Boiled
>HO use move
>Blissey uses Toxic

Then Blissey just heals until HO is defeated

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:53:12 No.44930683 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930675
>2HKOs

Only possible after 16 Soft-Boiled
So basically only in Stall vs Stall

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:53:56 No.44930684 Report

Quoted By: >>44930949

>>44930657
No, your logic doesn't make sense, you idiot. Knock Off exists and plenty of times in actual games people will manage to land a Knock Off on a boots Pokemon even if good players will obviously try to play around that.

Is this board so illiterate as to not understand the simple concept of a Pokemon that cares about hazards carrying HDB. It's like saying you don't care about rain because you have an umbrella with you. Why the fuck do you have an umbrella with you if you don't care about rain? This is some elementary school logic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 22:55:31 No.44930698 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930568
>What other place is as bad at its dedicated topic as /vp/?
/co/ when it comes to comics (but I can't exactly blame them for that, /co/ is majorly cartoons, and like half of current comics are offensive to the mind and psyche).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 23:35:22 No.44930949 Report

Quoted By: >>44931084

>>44930684
>n-no u
epic dude

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 25 Sep 2020 23:52:59 No.44931084 Report

Quoted By:

>>44930949
That's all you could come up with after someone called out your non-sense? I guess at least you're not quite as retarded as the other genius who thinks SR is a "stall move".

/vp/ is embarrassing as I said, I need to stop coming here. Don't bother replying with some retarded garbage, if someone responds it's not me.

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