/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #46306931

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Gen 8 OU Viability Rankings Update

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 01:55:46 No.46306931 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>46308260 >>46311283 >>46316460

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ss-ou-dlc2-viability-ranking-thread-read-post-235.3674058/page-17#post-8762697

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ss-ou-dlc2-viability-ranking-thread-read-post-235.3674058/page-17#post-8763393

Rises: Landorus-T, Tornadus-T, Corviknight, Dragapult, Hydreigon, Slowking, Tapu Koko, Hippowdon, Kyurem, Dragonite, Skarmory, Scizor, Zeraora, Rotom-Wash, Tapu Bulu, Reuniclus, Bisharp, Blacephalon, Glastrier, Mamoswine and Weavile

Drops: Melmetal, Excadrill, Mandibuzz, Tapu Fini, Moltres, Suicune, Blaziken and Buzzwole

Unranks: Exploud, Porygon2 and Regidrago

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:00:34 No.46307035 Report

Quoted By:

>shitmogon
lol

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:01:25 No.46307054 Report

Quoted By: >>46307169

>Landorus-T doesn't need to be banned, I swear!

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:04:07 No.46307091 Report

Quoted By: >>46307142 >>46307169 >>46308224

>is the lone S-tier
>has remained the most used pokemon in the game for eight (8) years
>but it isn't overcentralizing because we say so

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:05:35 No.46307117 Report

Quoted By: >>46307169

LE GENIE OF HEALTHY META

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:07:05 No.46307142 Report

Quoted By: >>46307183

>>46307091
It isn't over centralizing though.
It doesn't force subpar "counters" on teams to deal with it like Spectrier and Dracovish do.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:08:18 No.46307162 Report

Quoted By:

K N E E L

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:08:37 No.46307169 Report

Quoted By: >>46322184

>>46307054
>>46307091
>>46307117
Filtered. Also just because the rankings give it a rank doesn't mean anything. The rankings constantly shift and especially now that Cinderace and Magearna are gone it's going to shift again. Shit like Toxapex is way worse.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:09:46 No.46307183 Report

Quoted By: >>46307253 >>46307276 >>46307478 >>46308383

>>46307142
>Glasterior, Weavile, Hippowdon, Rotom-W, and Kyruem all got viability buffs entirely off the fact they counter it
>literal UU shitmons being brought in to counter broken shit isn't overcentralizing because we say so

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:14:07 No.46307253 Report

Quoted By: >>46307358

>>46307183
Quote where Lando-T is mentioned in either of their rises.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:15:36 No.46307276 Report

Quoted By: >>46307372

>>46307183
People who don't play really love to pretend that every Pokemon that isn't OU by usage is an unviable shitmon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:20:06 No.46307358 Report

Quoted By: >>46307543

>>46307253
>implying Smoggies are actually going to ever address the landorus boogieman in viability rankings

lol

why do you think that, despite making a massive paragraph for every single pokemon on the list (AND after stating Landos going to be "a large part in defining the metagame"), they never mention it once?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:21:09 No.46307372 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307276
>the entire point of smogon is to rank pokemon by viability into different tiers
>however, these tiers don't matter EXCLUSIVELY when countering lando is involved

lmao smoggiesssss

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:29:33 No.46307465 Report

Quoted By: >>46311620

Does yawnfag refresh /vp/ 24/7 in hopes of finding a Smogon thread? You forgot to post one of your epic reaction images.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:31:15 No.46307478 Report

Quoted By: >>46307642

>>46307183
You don't even know what counter means.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:36:37 No.46307543 Report

Quoted By: >>46307642

>>46307358
Yes, literally every pokemon that you've listed aside from max HP / SpDef Hippowdon gets OHKO'd by specs Magearna. Even SpDef Hippowdon gives said Magearna a free switch.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:46:38 No.46307642 Report

Quoted By: >>46307696 >>46308319 >>46308428

>>46307478
>what normal people define a "counter" as: a counter
>what smoggies define as a "counter": you must be able to have an option to use against X, at any point in the game, regardless of what the player using X does, to switch in 100% risk free with 0 threat or consequence towards yourself

You raise a good point, though, smoggie- Lando doesn't have any counters! I guess that would be a problem for other Pokemon, but it magically doesn't apply to when we're looking and Lando. Weird, isn't it?

>>46307543
We're not talking about Magearna, smoggie.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:51:40 No.46307696 Report

Quoted By: >>46307731

>>46307642
>Lando doesn't have any counters! I guess that would be a problem for other Pokemon, but it magically doesn't apply to when we're looking and Lando.
Neither does Tyranitar, Latios, Garchomp, Lele, or Heatran but those are never getting banned either.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:54:41 No.46307731 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307696
Stop replying to yawnfag please. He posts the same garbage in every thread.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 02:58:16 No.46307786 Report

Quoted By: >>46307951 >>46321037

whys finchinator so fucking stupid

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:12:18 No.46307951 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307786
What did he do?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:35:10 No.46308224 Report

Quoted By: >>46309282 >>46322450

>>46307091
tell me what makes it centralizing or in any way makes the meta game more unhealthy with its presence

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:38:14 No.46308260 Report

Quoted By: >>46308268

>>46306931
>magearna gets banned
>bird spam and slow dragons all get bumped up
>zeraora gets bumped up for seemingly no reason, it doesnt even beat most of the mons above it

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:39:31 No.46308268 Report

Quoted By: >>46308360

>>46308260
Zeroara was raised because it's been performing very well in smogon premier league.
It's not really anything to do with the ban.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:42:00 No.46308319 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307642
toxic landorus counters landorus

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:45:29 No.46308360 Report

Quoted By: >>46308764

>>46308268
to be fair spl uses balance cores that are super weak to electric move + knock. reminds me of gen 7 in a way where bolt beam killed every meta core. bird + ground + psychic + toxapex cant really deal with a properly supported zeraora. perhaps its better at higher points on the ladder, im only around the 1600s

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:47:33 No.46308383 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307183
>BAN A FUCKING FIRE AND A STEEL TYPE, BOTH OF WHICH ARE SUPER EFFECTIVE AGAINST ICE
>ice types go up
>/VP/ complains because they think it can only be due to lando

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 03:50:30 No.46308428 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307642
Most physical walls counter Lando, specially if they are inmune to ground like Skarm and Corvi.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 04:16:58 No.46308764 Report

Quoted By:

>>46308360
The main reasons it's good right now is that it can actually abuse being a fast pivot with HDB and that it threatens everything with item removal since Knock Off is so spammable without mega stones or Z-crystals. Also helps that it's good anti-Dragapult speed control.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 05:11:52 No.46309282 Report

Quoted By:

>>46308224
It's ugly and it's not my shitmon bro

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 07:10:39 No.46310365 Report

Quoted By: >>46312734 >>46313102 >>46314360 >>46315025

it's amazing to me that people think Zamazenta-C will dominate a meta like this
it was obvious as fuck that Dragapult and Corviknight, which are Uber-worthy, were only being suppressed by shit like Cinderace and Magearna, and now they can go to down with their unpredictability and fat immortality
fucking Blaziken is UUBL and it shreds offense, offence is basically extinct until you ban HDB

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 09:16:02 No.46311259 Report

Quoted By: >>46312168

Landorus isn't overpowered or overcentralizing, you absolute nonces.
The reason it gets so much usage isn't because it's amazing at anything, but because of role compression.
Let's just say you want an electric immunity, ground immunity, physical tank, hazard setter, hazard remover, and offensive pivot.
You could run 6 different mons for those roles, or you could have Landorus-T do all of that and use the other 5 slots for a more creative team.
And most importantly, it's not particularly difficult to kill or to wall. It's got a 4x weakness to ice and no reliable recovery, and its only reliable STAB is the type with the most mons immune to it.
You don't need to run a shitmon that counters Lando and does nothing else like you had to do with Seismitoad back in the Dracovish days.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 09:20:36 No.46311283 Report

Quoted By:

>>46306931
>Exploud got unranked

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 10:16:59 No.46311620 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307465
He's either multiple people or a bot.
If it was one human, we'd see lulls in activity when he sleeps. But he never seems to stop.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 11:59:11 No.46312168 Report

Quoted By: >>46315039

>>46311259
>All this smoggie cope for trying to justify why "most used Pokemon for eight years straight" isn't actually overcentralizing

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 12:22:15 No.46312274 Report

Quoted By: >>46312401 >>46314446 >>46315059

2020: Melmetal was banned into Ubers.
2021: Hey, let's drop him!

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 12:44:12 No.46312401 Report

Quoted By:

>>46312274
Yes.
Is a different game now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 13:49:26 No.46312734 Report

Quoted By:

>>46310365
Zamazenta is way too fucking bulky and fast for how hard it hits. 130 without any item or ability boosts might not be that strong but it has 2 reliable high base power STAB moves and decent enough coverage to threaten most stuff that doesn't care about its STAB combination. It can set up a Howl on most of the meta since it's so disgustingly bulky and it can also afford to run adamant since once again, it's so bulky and it's fast enough to outspeed almost every non-scarfer. It's would be really easy to support it with shit like Grassy Terrain, Teleport, Wish passing, reliable hazard removers for Spikes etc.

Obviously it wouldn't rape OU as hard as even more broken Ubers but it would still be cancer. Nothing but really strong fire or ground moves would reasonably revenge kill it unless it's already weakened and most Pokemon that can wall it either don't threaten it back, don't have enough durability or are overly passive and let it switch out for free. It double resists Stealth Rock and is immune to Toxic and Sandstorm. Contact damage would be annoying but it's really not that hard to make it stick around with the right team support. +1 Zamazenta threatens a large majority of the meta and it's easy as fuck to get a +1 on lots of OU Pokemon. Your Toxapex or Aegislash or whatever else resists Steel + Fighting isn't gonna enjoy a +1 Wild Charge or Crunch.

Sucking ass in Ubers doesn't change that it would be too much for OU. That bulk and speed tier on a Pokemon with a strong STAB combination and acceptable coverage is too overbearing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 14:31:56 No.46313102 Report

Quoted By: >>46314441

>>46310365
>Bro Zamazenta-C would be fine in OU
252 Atk Choice Band Landorus-Therian Earthquake vs. +1 0 HP / 0 Def Zamazenta-Crowned: 258-306 (79.3 - 94.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 16:19:39 No.46314062 Report

Quoted By:

Umm sweetie just use Scarf Blacephalon with Fire Blast haha

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 16:41:10 No.46314300 Report

Quoted By: >>46314580 >>46315244

So is Zamazenta-C going to be like Manaphy? First Ubers then OU? How low must the usage be?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 16:47:19 No.46314360 Report

Quoted By:

>>46310365
i dont care if it wouldnt be viable i dont want to see it in gameplay
legendaries get the FUCK out my tiers

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 16:55:36 No.46314441 Report

Quoted By: >>46315272

>>46313102
>NOOOOOOOOOOO SOMETHING LANDORINO DOESN'T AUTO WIN AGAINST, BAN IT BAN IT RIGHT NOW!!!!!!

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 16:56:16 No.46314446 Report

Quoted By:

>>46312274
It's almost like a fuckton of powerful mons returned in Crown Tundra and made Melmetal manageable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 17:09:21 No.46314580 Report

Quoted By:

>>46314300
Usage has nothing to do with being drop worthy. Manaphy was drop worthy in gen 6 because perma-rain wasn't a thing anymore and speed-tiers and strong priority also increased.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 17:49:12 No.46315025 Report

Quoted By: >>46320957

>>46310365
>corviknight
besides pp stalling i seriously cant understand the hatred for this pokemon. theres so much that gets packed on meta teams that can deal with it. cinderace did threaten its core partners pretty well like slowbro but other balance breakers will be discovered throughout the metagame with cinder banned. i do think balance is going to be more viable with magearna gone though because that pokemon was basically the most unstoppable wincon if you didnt have enough offensive pressure on your team. corviknight will be fine, its just that his prefered playstyle and teammates will become more viable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 17:51:39 No.46315039 Report

Quoted By: >>46315192

>>46312168
define overcentralizing and why landorus falls into that role.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 17:53:37 No.46315059 Report

Quoted By: >>46315978

>>46312274
its a bit like kyurem black was in b/w where he was head and shoulders above OU mons but the metagame was already capable of checking him with things like driller, dragon gem garchomp, ferrothorn, lati, etc. melmetal is pretty fucking obnoxious but hes nothing that we cant handle in the tier.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 18:04:19 No.46315192 Report

Quoted By:

>>46315039
Why are you asking yawnfag for an explanation?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 18:08:22 No.46315244 Report

Quoted By:

>>46314300
manaphy was undying and it was overwhelming to face on b/w rain stall because it was unstatusable and it could rest under rain with hydration and spend no sleep turns. if you won the weather war, manaphy won the game 90% of the time just by coming in on a good match up and tail glowing once. it also had a good match up vs basically any pokemon that couldnt 2hko it because it can rest on them and wear them down.
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Manaphy: 343-405 (84.9 - 100.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
lati was actually a really underated pokemon at this point in the metagame but it was one of the few mons that could even attempt to revenge kill it with neutral coverage. obviously it would have a bit of damage on it from the last pokemon and be forced out by the threat of specs latios draco. once perma weather was gone it couldnt run rest anymore and become a much more managable wincon

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 18:10:37 No.46315272 Report

Quoted By:

>>46314441
But in this case, Lamdorus-T does beat it, retard.
However, despite being part Steel, Zamazenta-C can still tank a Choice Band Base 145 Atk STAB Earthquake without any investment just shows how riduculous its bulk is on the physical side, and its special bulk isn’t too shabby either.
252 SpA Volcarona Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Zamazenta-Crowned: 218-260 (67 - 80%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This is also the Pokemon with 130 Atk, 128 Speed, a x4 resistance to rocks, immunity to Sand and Toxic, on top of having the Steel typing.

Knowing you, I would be fearful that Zamazenta-C starts going into Defensive sets on Stall teams, with how much it can tank hits.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 19:17:55 No.46315978 Report

Quoted By: >>46316176

>>46315059
If it was head and shoulders above everything in OU it wouldn't have dropped.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 19:21:29 No.46316006 Report

Quoted By: >>46318995 >>46319110

why wasn't lando-t S tier in the 1st place?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 19:39:42 No.46316176 Report

Quoted By: >>46316477

>>46315978
kyurem black is better in a vacuum than everything in ou bar maybe keldeo. its issue is that mons that were already really popular in the tier had an easy time revenge killing it so it cant just run away with the game and has to be played as a breaker. it really hurts kyurem that it cant just outrage for free because its movepool is basically outrage and fusion bolt. finally it has to cement itself in the choiced attacker or mixed attacker role because it has no set up/wincon potential. while it has literally no counters by smogons definition of the word mostly because of the physical hp fire set, it is checked by everything around it in the viability rankings. i think its better than everything in the tier on paper but its crucial problems like speed and movepool that keep it below other OU pokemon when you factor the meta game into the equation.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 20:02:30 No.46316460 Report

Quoted By: >>46317384

>>46306931
Fanfic fantasy meta

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 20:04:12 No.46316477 Report

Quoted By: >>46320980

>>46316176
>crucial problems like speed and movepool
And hazard weakness

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 24 Feb 2021 21:41:49 No.46317384 Report

Quoted By:

>>46316460
Fantastic fantasy meta of fanatical fanfictions?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:03:26 No.46318995 Report

Quoted By:

>>46316006
Because Magearna was so broken that putting anything on its level would seem wrong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:12:25 No.46319110 Report

Quoted By: >>46319142

>>46316006
The obvious S-tiers were Magearna and Cinderace. They also forgot to put Toxapex up there.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:14:42 No.46319142 Report

Quoted By: >>46319174

>>46319110
pex is not good enough for S right now

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:17:22 No.46319174 Report

Quoted By: >>46319221

>>46319142
Toxapex is always good enough for S-tier. People are just in denial about it for a while, then it rises in usage again, then it drops a bit again and so on. It's been the consistently best defensive Pokemon in OU since release and it's always at the top of usage in both tournament and the ladder. There is no Pokemon as overbearingly suffocating with its defensive presence as Toxapex. No Teleport or Future Sight or hazard removal or whatever else other defensive Pokemon can do changes that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:20:51 No.46319221 Report

Quoted By: >>46319270

>>46319174
post elo

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:24:46 No.46319270 Report

Quoted By: >>46319351

>>46319221
>plenty of top players like craig or BKC think it's broken
>umm like it's not good enough Finch said you can use Future Sight to break it
Post yours

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:31:26 No.46319351 Report

Quoted By: >>46319402

>>46319270
>no u
lmao

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:36:04 No.46319402 Report

Quoted By: >>46319608

>>46319351
You keep posting and you don't actually say anything. How about you show what part of Toxapex being the consistently best and most used defensive Pokemon is wrong. It's even the best in gen 7 where it's easier to break past it with Z-moves, it has to worry about shit like Gliscor and it can't click Knock Off for free 300 times because mega stones and Z-crystals exist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 00:56:37 No.46319608 Report

Quoted By: >>46323891

>>46319402
>implying the smogon cult ever lets them adress the fact that toxapex is broken

The mod team won't be happy until they can succesful climb to 1800 with clefpex stall and 0 thought

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 01:02:11 No.46319667 Report

Quoted By: >>46319684

Zoon...

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 01:03:35 No.46319684 Report

Quoted By: >>46319773 >>46320009 >>46320458 >>46321032

>>46319667
I wonder how the votes for good players looked like. I'm baffled so many people think this would be a healthy drop.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 01:11:51 No.46319773 Report

Quoted By:

>>46319684
It wouldnt shock me if qualified players voted in favor of unbanning Zamazenta.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 01:30:27 No.46320009 Report

Quoted By: >>46322045

>>46319684
Zamazenta is very much a case of "easily dealt with defensively, hard to check offensively" so tourney players would absolutely be in favor of it dropping.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 02:22:25 No.46320458 Report

Quoted By:

>>46319684
I think people are just bored and want to shake up the meta.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:14:35 No.46320957 Report

Quoted By:

>>46315025
>besides pp stalling
That's the main reason why it's broken. 8 PP moves that can't 2HKO Corviknight just get stalled out by Roost since we don't have mons on the level of Ash-Gren to cleanly 2HKO it.
It's basically a bulkier Skarmory with a great ability, and obviously in past metas Skarm was oppressive.
Unlike Toxapex, Corviknight is also an offensive threat which it can easily pull off with IDpress or Bulk Up. It's hell on stall teams but a nightmare for offensive teams.
Also, it has U-Turn, so it can pivot out if it wants to.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:17:36 No.46320980 Report

Quoted By: >>46321006 >>46321043

>>46316477
HP was so high hazard weakness wasn't that big of a deal, not compared to Darm-G or Cinderace at least.
KB is a mediocre dragon in a meta with faster dragons that can OHKO it, it really shouldn't have stayed in OU after Gen V. Unless you think being A+ or S- ranked in every gen makes for a healthy presence.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:20:58 No.46321006 Report

Quoted By: >>46321507

>>46320980
>Unless you think being A+ or S- ranked in every gen makes for a healthy presence.
landorus

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:23:47 No.46321032 Report

Quoted By: >>46321141

>>46319684
>I'm baffled so many people think this would be a healthy drop.
Zamazenta-C stuffs offensive teams but you won't be seeing offensive teams unless boots are banned. Boots are such a massive boost in power to defense HO is basically extinct (natdex deoxys-d is RU, Mew is UU, no other stacker is above UU) and balance is giving way to bulky offense and fat balance.
In other words, if you wanted a meta to show that Zamazenta-C isn't broken, a fat meta is the perfect place for it, and that's ultimately where Gen VIII will end up.
The only interaction that might be interesting is Zamazenta-C makes KO less free since it takes a pittance from both SR and KO. So it might be a healthy, if centralizing aspect of the meta just because of its item that can't be knocked off and its high defenses.
Which is ironic since it was designed as a defensive Pokemon that can't do defense in Ubers at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:24:12 No.46321037 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307786
Finch is surprisingly not acting like a retard this Gen. He probably realized how stupid he and his cronies were acting for Gen 7 and got pressured to actually do shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:25:09 No.46321043 Report

Quoted By:

>>46320980
What does this post even mean? Kyurem-Black isn't even ranked that highly in gen 6 or 7 considering it's a 700 BST box legendary. It's totally fine in both metas. Z-moves can make it kind of annoying in gen 7 but that applies to a lot of Pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 03:34:59 No.46321141 Report

Quoted By:

>>46321032
>Zamazenta-C stuffs offensive teams but you won't be seeing offensive teams unless boots are banned
Come back when you actually play the game

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 04:22:14 No.46321507 Report

Quoted By:

>>46321006
Yeah, Landorus is pretty based.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 05:33:58 No.46322045 Report

Quoted By: >>46322054 >>46322531 >>46323160 >>46323919

>>46320009
How exactly would you stop Zamazenta-C defensively?
Even if it can’t boosts its offenses with Choice Band or Sword Dance, there is pretty much nothing Defensive Pokemon can do back to it, besides hope for a burn, since its immune common residual damage, and due to Howl having tons of PP, it would also be hard to PP stall it (and it beats out Haze in a PP stall war too).

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 05:35:10 No.46322054 Report

Quoted By:

>>46322045
just go pex or slowbro lmao

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 05:55:52 No.46322184 Report

Quoted By:

>>46307169
>Also just because the rankings give it a rank doesn't mean anything.
>"We reserve S rank for Pokémon that play a large part in defining the metagame -- Landorus-T does exactly that."

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 06:48:41 No.46322450 Report

Quoted By:

>>46308224
it's not centralizing,
it's worse:
it's defining

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 07:06:46 No.46322531 Report

Quoted By: >>46322657

>>46322045
Zamazenta-C doesn't have any recovery bar Rest (which is shitty nowadays). To be in the crowned form you cannot hold Leftovers.

If you can shut down its wish passing team mate, then you may need 20 turns to take it down, but it will eventually go down.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 07:26:52 No.46322657 Report

Quoted By:

>>46322531
>If you can shut down its wish passing team mate
easier said than done, given how many of the things that can "shut down" Clef can't do anything to Zama-C itself

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 07:34:56 No.46322697 Report

Quoted By: >>46323235

I think Nidoking and Slowking will be a more popular Zamazenta-Crowned partner than Clef.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 08:50:05 No.46323160 Report

Quoted By:

>>46322045
Anything that can take a hit from Kartana can check Zamazenta-C, including:

Toxapex
Slowbro
Slowking-Galar
Rotom-Wash
Rotom-Heat
Corviknight
Lando
Aegislash
Zapdos
Volcarona
Hippowdown
Chandelure
Blacephalon

Zamazenta-C isn't as constraining as Ash-Greninja, who needed a dedicated defensive check, but you do have to plan for it in a way you don't have to plan for Lando.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 09:01:00 No.46323235 Report

Quoted By:

>>46322697
Slowking will be for sure a popular partner, Future Sight support is always good for Fighting types.

Anyway Zamazenta is a meme and we should think about suspecting Toxapex, Rillaboom or indeed the Slows instead of introducing something that only serves to exacerbate the problems of the meta just for the sake of it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 10:56:02 No.46323891 Report

Quoted By:

>>46319608
They literally do address it, though.
They just love to spread their asscheeks for the tourneyfags and will never do anything about it because tournament play is dominated by stall because 1 loss is a complete elimination and they need to play safe. Unlike ladder where you can afford to take risks because you can keep climbing as long as you win more than you lose.
Honestly, ladder and tournaments shouldn't even have the same ruleset.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 11:01:04 No.46323919 Report

Quoted By:

>>46322045
Zamazenta can't really do much of anything offensively.
130 Attack sounds good on paper, but it's not allowed to hold items, its only ability doesn't boost its offense, and its movepool leaves a lot to be desired.
Unaware Quag shits on it, Taunt users shit on it, and mons that can boost their defense shit on it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 11:31:55 No.46324086 Report

Quoted By: >>46324163 >>46324304

So... can nobody actually offer up an explanation as to why Landorus is allowed despite being so blatantly overpowered, overcentralizing, and overall broken?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 11:49:40 No.46324163 Report

Quoted By: >>46324182

>>46324086
You can't explain things based on a false premise.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 11:54:02 No.46324182 Report

Quoted By:

>>46324163
>false premise
What do you mean? Are you saying Lando isn't allowed?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:17:05 No.46324304 Report

Quoted By: >>46324327

>>46324086
maybe you should first provide an explanation on how you can't counter something that gets outsped by any fast offensive pokémon and is weak to two common offensive types without having the bulk to take it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:20:04 No.46324327 Report

Quoted By: >>46324365 >>46324500

>>46324304
>it's weak to precisely two types, one of which is common because it can beat Lando

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:26:33 No.46324365 Report

Quoted By:

>>46324327
ice coverage has always been common

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:49:37 No.46324500 Report

Quoted By:

>>46324327
Ice is good against a large portion of the metagame. Also during teambuilding preparation Landorus is largely a less scary Garchomp and the two share most of the same counterplay (in fact some counterplay that is not very good against Garchomp, like Zapdos, is better against Lando). Lastly you don't need to hit Landorus supereffectively to scare it or even outright remove it, any strong special breaker does the trick.
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 382-451 (100 - 118%)

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:50:13 No.46324502 Report

Quoted By: >>46324513

>Wallbreakers that beat Lando-T and force the meta to shift around a bit get banned almost instantly
>Lando-T S tier and free to run amok once again
I'll never take Smogon seriously.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 25 Feb 2021 12:52:10 No.46324513 Report

Quoted By:

>>46324502
Literally every wallbreaker in the game beats Lando, mainly because it is not actually a wall.

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