/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #46615074

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Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:09:41 No.46615074 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>46615109 >>46615173 >>46615230 >>46615277 >>46615372 >>46616219 >>46616543 >>46616597 >>46616683 >>46618395 >>46619675

>OHKO moves and Evasion must be banned because they are too luck based!
>Flinch locking with or without paralysis is perfectly fine!
Explain to me why this is okay.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:13:46 No.46615109 Report

Quoted By: >>46615120 >>46615732

>>46615074
The first one feels worse to lose against than the latter.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:14:21 No.46615120 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615109
I would disagree but even if that is true it's not a valid argument.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:17:21 No.46615144 Report

Quoted By: >>46615166 >>46615206

You can avoid getting paralyzed and move's that flinch have an incredibly low chance to trigger so there's always the chance to actually strike back/swap out before your mon get's killed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:17:29 No.46615146 Report

Quoted By:

>comparing an effect on a handful of moves with near useless gimmick moves and a cheese strat
OP doesn’t play smogon or know how bands work

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:19:08 No.46615166 Report

Quoted By: >>46615220

>>46615144
30% chance to flinch isn't that low. And it's 60% with Serene Grace.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:19:09 No.46615167 Report

Quoted By:

Go play on cart, you can do whatever there. I've had some fun with Double Team+Baton Pass. Doesn't always work, but it sure is fun.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:20:09 No.46615173 Report

Quoted By: >>46615206 >>46620724

>>46615074
Post elo

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:24:51 No.46615206 Report

Quoted By: >>46616621

>>46615144
>What is Serene Grace
>What is Kings Rock+Skill Link
>>46615173
You first.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:26:30 No.46615220 Report

Quoted By: >>46615263 >>46615290 >>46615296 >>46620772

>>46615166
30% is low, and there's only two mons that have serene grace that are legal in OU. Togekiss is easily outspeed and Jirachi can be easily taken care off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:27:52 No.46615230 Report

Quoted By: >>46615245

>>46615074
Because smogon is retarded and there's a reason why they isolate in their own little circlejerk.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:29:39 No.46615245 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615230
>he says while isolating in his actual little circlejerk on /vp/

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:31:25 No.46615263 Report

Quoted By: >>46615361 >>46615792

>>46615220
Uh-hu, and would minimize be fine if only one Pokemon got it? How many viable Pokemon ACTUALLY get OHKO moves? Fuck off retard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:32:11 No.46615277 Report

Quoted By: >>46615301

>>46615074
HOKO moves hurt stall
Smogon loves stall
Simple as

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:33:18 No.46615290 Report

Quoted By: >>46615361

>>46615220
>30% is low
So why are KO moves banned?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:34:08 No.46615296 Report

Quoted By: >>46615400

>>46615220
>30% is low
What a coincidence! The same odds of a OHKO move hitting! Better unban them right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:34:25 No.46615301 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615277
>Send out Togekiss
>Nasty Plot
>Sub
>Munch on leftovers
>Flinch everything to death with Air Slash and fuck over every Corviknight with Flamethrower
Flinch murders stall. Stall wins by having more turns to do shit than the opponent.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:39:38 No.46615361 Report

Quoted By: >>46616408

>>46615263
Evasion is banned simply because it isn't fun to go up against. And there are about 7-8 viable mons that do get ohko moves.

>>46615290
"Ohko moves aren't risk reward, they're mindless clicking of buttons for potential free kills. We're in the process of banning Wobbuffet because it lessens the amount of skill needed to battle."

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:40:30 No.46615372 Report

Quoted By: >>46615718

>>46615074
>Literally any Electric type or Pokemon with certain abilities just ignore the first half of paraflinch
>Pokemon with other abilities ignore the second half of paraflinch
>Requires two halves to really get gross because most flinch abusers aren't especially fast and need paralysis to outspeed and paralysis on its own isn't especially bad either
>Can just carry a Lum Berry, a generally good item, to worry less about paralysis
Basically neither half of Paraflinch is especially bad on its own, and have multiple ways to play around it that aren't exclusively about playing around that thing. Every way around evasion is only really there to counter evasion and makes your team worse against non-evasion strats. The only really viable way to play around OHKO is Sturdy and while it's a good ability it's unreasonable to demand every team have at least one Sturdy user.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 19:42:58 No.46615400 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615296
A mon flinching dosen't spell the death of it unless its a gaurenteed 2hko and you were a dumbass and kept it in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 20:22:21 No.46615718 Report

Quoted By: >>46617704

>>46615372
>The only really viable way to play around OHKO is Sturdy
Every OHKO move has a type immune to it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 20:23:24 No.46615732 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615109
Bullshit, I used to make people ragequit online on PBR using ParaFlinch Togekiss.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 20:27:55 No.46615792 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615263
>would minimize be fine if only one Pokemon got it?

Depends on the pokemon but yeah probably.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:14:33 No.46616219 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615074
>Evasion
Have you tried Aerial Ace?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:37:26 No.46616408 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615361
> risk: giving opponent a free turn to attack/switch/setup
> reward: 1 knock out

seems pretty risk/reward to me

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:48:44 No.46616543 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615074
Flinch locking isn't luck based, retard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:49:53 No.46616549 Report

Quoted By:

OHKO moves are dice rolls that turns the game into pure RNG without any skill on either part since it boils down to "I got hit so I lose" or "I didn't get hit so I win". It's not a risk vs reward (ie. You will die if you don't flinch this mon that is otherwise dangerous to stay in on) playstyle so much as it is betting everything on black.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:54:56 No.46616597 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615074
The real reason is because the ruleset is designed so that it could be played on cart as well as simulator, and you can't "remove" flinching from the game. If someone gets a flinch as a side effect of using a move with a flinch chance unintentionally, tough luck. Unless you want to ban every move with a flinch chance.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 21:56:38 No.46616621 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615206
>no u

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 19 Mar 2021 22:01:39 No.46616683 Report

Quoted By: >>46617744 >>46617925

>>46615074
Flinching (besides Fake Out) and Paralysis should be banned, but their reasoning is
>The flinching moves will eventually run out of PP and you will eventually get a turn to use recover or something. You also need to be faster.
and
>Paralysis being banned would ban most of the electric moves, making water types way too powerful.
I really wish the nerf to paralysis in Gen 7 wasn’t making thunder wave less accurate and reducing the speed drop, but made it so that there was no chance of being fully paralyzed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 00:02:09 No.46617704 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615718
Yes, and unlike Paralysis which is normally a minor nuisance, OHKO moves are "you're immune or dead". There's a bit of a variance in scale there.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 00:08:08 No.46617744 Report

Quoted By:

>>46616683
Additional flinch chances are put on so many important moves that banning them is near impossible unless you want to work with an extremely convoluted ban

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 00:31:39 No.46617925 Report

Quoted By: >>46620743

>>46616683
if they got rid of the thunder wave free turn I couldn’t hax through stall

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 00:33:59 No.46617939 Report

Quoted By:

OHKO moves work in online?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 01:23:46 No.46618395 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615074
The problem with banning flinching is how hard it would gimp movesets.
Dark Pulse, the fangs, Iron Head, Zen Headbutt, Rock Slide. So many Pokemon rely on those moves for coverage or even just STAB, and the flinch is only a secondary consideration.
And for paralysis, every common electric type move would have to be banned.
The only other option would be to ban Serene Grace which I'm not opposed to but that wouldn't prevent paraflinch entirely.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO incin walk.gif, 2MiB, 500x350

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 01:50:15 No.46618635 Report

Quoted By: >>46619666

>yet another"evasion is banned" meme thread that STILL dont understand that only double team and minimize are banned and not all evasion

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 03:44:02 No.46619642 Report

Quoted By:

Didn't know yawnfag was multiple people

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 03:47:54 No.46619666 Report

Quoted By:

>>46618635
The only other move that raises evasion is Acupressure, and banning that would mean banning Citizen Snips.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 03:48:38 No.46619675 Report

Quoted By: >>46620105 >>46620127

>>46615074
>Flinch locking is perfectly fine!
This. Fucking ban jirachi

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO shaymin 100% ban.png, 131KiB, 1488x778

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 04:50:13 No.46620105 Report

Quoted By: >>46620143

>>46619675
Just a reminder that Shaymin-Sky, which utilizes flinch hax heavily, is the only Pokemon in history to have 100% of the eligible playerbase vote to ban it.
It was that fucking cancerous and hated that nobody wanted to keep it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 04:52:58 No.46620127 Report

Quoted By:

>>46619675
Jirachi is fine. They already banned the only broken flincher already (and its not even in gen 8 yet)

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 04:54:56 No.46620143 Report

Quoted By: >>46620576 >>46620777 >>46621094

>>46620105
This is so gay. Why can't people just play?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 06:22:53 No.46620576 Report

Quoted By:

>>46620143
>"'""play""" against hax teams
Just flip a fucking coin then

guy

guy Sat 20 Mar 2021 06:57:33 No.46620724 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615173
post malone hehe gotteeeem boys

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 07:05:43 No.46620743 Report

Quoted By:

>>46617925
>Trying to beat Stall with Paralysis hax
In certain games, Stall would actually like paralysis making them fully paralyzed. This is because they can use less PP on their moves if they need to PP stall, and so that a status that’s actually threatening to Stall can’t affect them.
You’re absolutely just better off poisoning them with Toxic, since they can’t stall out threats forever and are forced to waste recover PP earlier than they’d like.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 07:12:44 No.46620769 Report

Quoted By:

Fanfic Meta gonna Fanfic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 07:13:07 No.46620772 Report

Quoted By:

>>46615220
>30% is low,
No it’s not You basilica lose 1/3 of all your turns and that’s not even counting when stuff like paralysis is stacked on top of that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 07:15:03 No.46620777 Report

Quoted By:

>>46620143
Shaymin-Sky actively prevented you from doing that exact thing.
So few Pokemon could outspeed it, and those who were are frail, and a liability. Same with every Anti-Flinching and Shield Dust Pokemon.
Anything that’s Weavile or Slower needed priority if they didn’t want to effectively be dead due to a single flinch, or Shaymin-Sky could simply use Seed Flare to do both high amount of damage+an 80% chance it would basically do double damage next turn.
Even playing for fun, Shaymin-Sky simply prevented you from doing that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 20 Mar 2021 08:49:40 No.46621094 Report

Quoted By:

>>46620143
>Why can't people just play?
Because they keep getting flinched and their inputs are completely meaningless.
Aren't you paying attention?

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