/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #46691137

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:43:24 No.46691137 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>46691203 >>46691345 >>46692597 >>46693826 >>46695882

Now that the dust has settled, did it deserve to be banned?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:44:02 No.46691147 Report

Quoted By:

yes it is a racist caricature and i do not want to see it ever again

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:50:41 No.46691191 Report

Quoted By:

yes, but it was fun while it lasted

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:52:37 No.46691203 Report

Quoted By: >>46691238 >>46697868

>>46691137
It doesn't deserved to be banned since it's a choice band user that can only use one move, and can easily be countered

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:55:49 No.46691225 Report

Quoted By:

>gf makes good ice type for once
>immediately gets banned

Shieeet

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:56:24 No.46691234 Report

Quoted By: >>46691339

>Automatic choice band as an ability, all while having 140 base Atk
>Slapping a choice band is basically a swords dance Darm upon switching in
>Double switching, U-turning, teleporting, volt switching, flip turning. It is braindead easy to get the safe switches with Darm
>G.Tactics letting it have an immediate power boost means you can also slap a choice scarf, base 95 + scarf is a really good speed tier
And when you account the dex culling, the limited dex at the time did not have anything that could be considered a counter to gdarm, and whatever high speed choice scarfer there was, it would just get all of its attacks sponged by G-Darm's teammates because it turns out that TEAMS HAVE 6 POKEMONS, G-Darm is never alone
>Really good coverage, Flare Blitz deals with Steel/Flying mons, EQ deals with everything else since Ice/Ground is stupidly good coverage (moreso when it's the sole reason Toxapex is afraid of switching in), even has Rock Slide to deal with Rotom-H (the only mon whose typing covers GDarm's main assault)
But let's address the elephant in the room because having coverage means jackshit
>Has U-turn
Gee like i don't fucking know about you chief but a mon that is choicelocked 99% of the time having the quintessential pivoting move just lets it forget about coverage and just bring in something that scares niggas out. And Banded U-Turn did a hilarious amount of damage to Rotom-H to resists, just imagine dealing with the annoying scarf u-turn spam
>Only priotity move it's probably scared off is Scizor's bullet punch, but scizor is a trash mon in this generation and he cannot switch into G-Darm because it really fucking fears Flare Blitz
>Clefable & friends still exist so whatever argument that can be made about Stealth Rocks is nullified when you remember Wish Pivotting is what assisted G-Darm and Dracovish when they were around
SPEAKING OF
>Everytime there's a savage ass mon that tears offense and defense alike, semi-stall becomes the norm

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:56:56 No.46691238 Report

Quoted By: >>46691251 >>46691358 >>46691402

>>46691203
Name a counter

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 19:58:57 No.46691251 Report

Quoted By: >>46691636

>>46691238
smogon will never be a serious competitive metagame

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:12:13 No.46691339 Report

Quoted By: >>46692669 >>46694603

>>46691234
Oh yeah i forgot one more thing
>inb4 "but that was the limited dex back then, we have better physical walls now!"
Melmetal lacks reliable recovery so while it might withstand some hits from G-Darm, it cannot safely switch into EQ and Flare Blitz
Buzzwole may have reliable recovery but god forbid you get flinched by Icicle Crash
Moltres and Rotom-H get FUCKED by Rock Slide
Kanto Slow twins get fucked by U-Turn, Galar Slow twins get fucked by EQ and also don't resist I.Crash
Mons with priority moves cannot switch in, espeically Rillaboom and if it's needed, Lele can fuck over priority
Swampert just gets U-Turned on or takes a chunk from I.Crash since he's neutral to it
Toxapex dies to EQ

To dance around and switch into G.Darm, you need an entire team of walls to deal with G.Darm, an offensive team with 1 or 2 walls just gets fucked by scarf darm, a full stall team gets fucked by banded darm and the average smogonite is allergic to fun sets so Zen Mode G-Darm will fuck anyone that thinks G-Darm can only exist with Gorilla Tactics

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:13:20 No.46691345 Report

Quoted By: >>46691509

>>46691137
G-darmanitan is the ultimate proof of choice items being the problem

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:15:37 No.46691358 Report

Quoted By: >>46691376 >>46691382 >>46691636

>>46691238
REMINDER that smogon's "counters and checks" definitions are completely arbitrary and don't actually coincide with the other more universal definitions that other games use
Their definition is literally a guarantee that their shitty stall can't possibly be ban worthy

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:18:00 No.46691376 Report

Quoted By: >>46691396

>>46691358
Okay then, what counters g-darm based on your own logic?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:18:57 No.46691380 Report

Quoted By: >>46691418 >>46691636 >>46694523

>Pokemon threatens ClefPex
>Gets banned

Very sad, many such cases

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:19:13 No.46691382 Report

Quoted By: >>46691424

>>46691358
Yawn

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:21:10 No.46691396 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691376
Another, bigger G-darmanitain.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:22:09 No.46691402 Report

Quoted By: >>46691422

>>46691238
a bulky fighting/water type.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:23:38 No.46691418 Report

Quoted By: >>46691451

>>46691380
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 304-359 (100 - 118%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 515-608 (130.7 - 154.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Wtf bros I thought anything that beat clef pex was banned

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:23:56 No.46691422 Report

Quoted By: >>46691449 >>46691467

>>46691402
If only the smogonfags had thought to use physically defensive poliwrath in OU, maybe the meta could have been saved

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:23:57 No.46691424 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691382
Shut the fuck up, yawnfag

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:27:34 No.46691449 Report

Quoted By: >>46695143

>>46691422
Was Poliwrath even in the game when this was banned?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:27:42 No.46691451 Report

Quoted By: >>46691478 >>46691636 >>46696164

>>46691418
>N-nuh uh!!!! This unusable NU shitmon is a "counter" if you let it get a swords dance up against a haze user

Smoggies getting desperate now

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:29:38 No.46691467 Report

Quoted By: >>46691594

>>46691422
>Policrap
252 Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Poliwrath: 140-165 (36.4 - 42.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Then i switch out g-darm because Poliwrath is stupidly easy to wall it's not even funny how pathetic that mon is, especially since that mon's only form of recovery is drain punch

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:31:06 No.46691478 Report

Quoted By: >>46695151

>>46691451
>Every stallmon has haze
>It’s impossible to get a swords dance up against a completely passive team
>UU is NU
? post ball rank

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:32:07 No.46691488 Report

Quoted By: >>46691541

>nidoking threatens clefpex, gets banned
>crawdaunt threatens clefpex, gets banned
>kartana threatens clefpex, gets banned
>heatran threatens clefpex, gets banned
>landorus-t threatens clefpex, gets banned
>tapu lele threatens clefpex, gets banned
>meanwhile offense killers that don't threaten clefpex like pheromosa remain unbanned

Why can't smogon stop showing their bias.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:34:22 No.46691509 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691345
it was better when it was just band

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:37:53 No.46691541 Report

Quoted By: >>46691568 >>46691636

>>46691488
>Three extremely weak NU shitmons only up because ClefPex is so overcentralizing
>Three extremely dubious "counters" that are extremely easy to wear down and outplay while being abusable in ClefPex cores anyway

Sad!

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:40:50 No.46691568 Report

Quoted By: >>46691572

>>46691541
>Three extremely weak NU shitmons only up because ClefPex is so overcentralizing
Who are the 'three NU shitmons' in that list?
>Three extremely dubious "counters" that are extremely easy to wear down and outplay while being abusable in ClefPex cores anyway
Where are these also?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:41:41 No.46691572 Report

Quoted By: >>46691599 >>46691625 >>46691636

>>46691568
You can figure it out, smoggie

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:44:16 No.46691594 Report

Quoted By: >>46691606

>>46691467
>Yawnfag doesn't refute this post
lmao @ your waste of life.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:44:20 No.46691599 Report

Quoted By: >>46691622

>>46691572
I geniunely cannot

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:45:22 No.46691606 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691594
I was being sarcastic anon. Poliwrath is obviously shit
t. not yawnfag

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:46:37 No.46691622 Report

Quoted By: >>46691636

>>46691599
Then the Smoggie cult has truly burned out your critical thinking skills

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:46:51 No.46691625 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691572
>elaborate on that
>no
? post ball rank

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:48:10 No.46691636 Report

Quoted By: >>46691672

>>46691251
>>46691358
>>46691380
>>46691451
>>46691541
>>46691572
>>46691622
? post elo

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 20:52:16 No.46691672 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691636
1972

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:11:02 No.46691841 Report

Quoted By: >>46691883 >>46691943 >>46692685 >>46694563 >>46695160 >>46695907

>Something not many people know is that the elo system in pokemon showdown doesn't mainly depend on you're winning ratio, but on the ammount of turns you're won battles take. So higher elo rated players are not better, just play longer battles, aka stall

>The smogon council is biased and bans offensive pokemon like darmanitan, cinderace, dugtrio and dracovish, while stallmons like ferrothorn, who see much more usage in ubers, are kept

>The VGC bans being based on the top 10 pokemon is something much more objective than the council quickbans decided by 5 normies or their elitistic suspects, were only a small minority of high elo players can vote. That's why a lot of things like dynamax had +90% pro ban vote, only stall users could vote.

>In generation 7 the ou council assured that landorus therian would not be banned even if it reached more than 95% usage

>Dynamax is not broken and smogonalgas banned it because stall could not adapt to it

>Smogon has not removed sand veil and swagger bans despite Gamefreak nerfing them in generation 6

>Smogon has banned the moody ability even though it doesn't boost evasion anymore, because it threatens stall

>Evasion is not overpowered and can easily be countered by taunt, haze, roar, or moves like swift

>Stealth rocks are the most stall inducing move in the metagame, since it offers reliable and consistent chip damage to something as common and key as switching

>Heavy duty boots has been the most anti stall item in singles that the franchise has ever introduced, since it prevents damage from the most common status move used by stall. Of cousre a lot of smogontards are in a favor of banning it

>The move Baton Pass was banned from all smogon metagames because stall was completely unviable against baton pass supported sweepers

>The smogon forums and showdown rooms are known to be some of the most toxic and problematic places in the internet

FUCK SMOGON

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:15:14 No.46691883 Report

Quoted By: >>46691892

>>46691841
>>The smogon council is biased and bans offensive pokemon like darmanitan, cinderace, dugtrio and dracovish, while stallmons like ferrothorn, who see much more usage in ubers, are kept
>Dugtrio isn't a stall mon
>Ferrothorn is
You couldn't do one second of research?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:15:59 No.46691892 Report

Quoted By: >>46692042 >>46692149

>>46691883
>n-no! This choice band sweeper is actually STALL!

The fucking weakest of all Smoggie defenses

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:19:53 No.46691943 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691841
? Post ball rank

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:30:35 No.46692042 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691892
>Dugtrio is mostly used on stall as trapping offensive threats is one of stalls greatest boons. This was actually one of the main reasons Arena Trap was banned, as even a Diglett or Trapinch was enough to eliminate a stall threat. This is not to say that Dugtrio wasn't used to trap on offensive teams as well, but for those it was much better to eliminate threats in another way than trapping.
>Ferrothorn, though bulky and able to set up spikes/stealh rocks, is mostly used on balance more than stall. Ferrothorn's lack of reliable recovery and inaccess to any hazard clearing actually make it pretty bad on stall compared to Corviknight or Skarmory who have both, especially Skarmory who can set up rocks and has reliable recovery. This is why many pokemon without reliable recovery are on stall due to a niche that needs to be filled such as, wouldn't you know it, Dugtrio
Also Dugtrio? Sweeper? It's outclassed by pretty much every fucking ground type and without Arena Trap it's PU garbage. Stats aren't the only thing that make a pokemon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:44:03 No.46692149 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691892
>Clef
>Pex
>Bliss
>Corv
>Hippo
Justify using Ferrothorn over Arena Trap Dugtrio on a team that contains at least 4 of these doods.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 21:47:45 No.46692172 Report

Quoted By:

I know that all yawnfag does is bait but I wish that they would be honest for once. I feel like there's actual room for discussion about stuff like the definition of a counter and whether certain bans were justified or not but instead all that gets posted is the bait pasta.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 22:49:35 No.46692597 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691137
yes.
pokeaimmd is a faggot for thinking this mon should get unbanned.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 22:59:14 No.46692669 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691339
isn't "lack of reliable recovery" solved by the wishpassing that helped make dracovish/g-darmanitan busted?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 27 Mar 2021 23:01:30 No.46692685 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691841

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 00:55:19 No.46693788 Report

Quoted By: >>46694473

No. He was perfectly manageable for anyone but stallfags.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 01:00:49 No.46693826 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691137
It is basically an offensive Slaking if it got a better ability.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 01:08:54 No.46693910 Report

Quoted By:

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:18:53 No.46694473 Report

Quoted By: >>46694486 >>46695900

>>46693788
Except stall was and would be the best method of dealing with G-Darm? The only non stall threats that deal with G-Darm are either fat fucks like Melmetal and Rotom or scarfers that get smashed on the switch in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:20:39 No.46694486 Report

Quoted By:

>>46694473
>smoggies STILL don't understand what offensive momentum is, and why an ice type with 105/55/55 bulk would be weak to non-stall

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:25:38 No.46694523 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691380
Hmm, you’re LATE today, yawnie... You’ve been losing your touch for a while now, yknow. Keep slacking and we’ll fire you from our trolling establishment.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:31:10 No.46694563 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691841
That's honestly why VGC is just better then smogon. They address the issues in doubles which is fair to allow more outside the box teams to rise up.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:36:40 No.46694603 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691339
The entire ban for G-Darm is retard honestly. At the very least Zen-Mode G-Darm should be allowed but stall can't even handle that so the higher elo choose to just ban it entirely

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 02:44:35 No.46694641 Report

Quoted By:

>46691234
>muh fanfic meta

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:03:45 No.46695096 Report

Quoted By: >>46695112 >>46695645

I think it at least deserved to be suspected instead of banned entirely.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:07:09 No.46695112 Report

Quoted By:

>>46695096
Why suspect test something that everyone wanted gone? The only people who complained about the G-Darm ban were the ones who went 'aw :( but sweeping teams with no effort is funnnn'

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:14:52 No.46695143 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691449
No

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:16:01 No.46695151 Report

Quoted By: >>46695175

>>46691478
Toxapex has Haze, retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:19:50 No.46695160 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691841
>Boots are anti-stall
based retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 04:24:35 No.46695175 Report

Quoted By:

>>46695151
First your ball rank

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 06:23:55 No.46695645 Report

Quoted By: >>46695898

>>46695096
It's not going to. Plus those who get to vote are those who are in the higher tiers and majority of them play stall. Only a select few play balanced or hyper offensive teams.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 07:39:11 No.46695882 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691137
When it did yes, but I don't really see it as that broken due to its 'item restriction' and SR. It was nowhere near as broken as Cinderace was with HDB.
As a choiced revenge killer, it isn't that different from Tapu Lele, Victini, Rillaboom or Kartana, Where it shines is as a balance breaker banded attacker as no other mon except Dracovish has the same immediate power. Scarf sets were strong enough to have roughly the same strength EQ as Mamoswine, with a significantly stronger Icicle Crash. Ice/Ground is really hard for balance to handle since Lando/Heatran cores get shit on by predicting wrong (unless you Protect).
Yet, Mamoswine has the same matchups, and is clearly a UU mon. What exactly does Darm punish harder than Mamoswine? Well, nothing. The same UU Mamoswine checks would stop it in OU (namely the 2 Rotom forms). Choice scouting also stops it cold. It's one of the more manageable choiced attackers in the game because of how predictable it is, unlike say, a Dracovish.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 07:43:03 No.46695898 Report

Quoted By:

>>46695645
Most high ladder players use balanced teams. Some use HO, but they're usually alts trying to ladder quickly and your Elo will increase pretty easily if you just win more than you lose.
Tourneyfags are the ones who play stall because one loss means losing the entire tournament. And tourneyfags have the most influence on quickbans, to the point where most polls about whether to quickban a mon, suspect it, or leave it as-is, are only open to tournament players.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 07:43:43 No.46695900 Report

Quoted By:

>>46694473
>Except stall was and would be the best method of dealing with G-Darm?
The best method is using Protect on Heatran, Protect on Clefable, Protect on Ferrothorn, Baneful Bunker on Pex, and Stealth Rock.
It's kind of amazing how stupid people are now because of Urshifu-SS.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 07:47:03 No.46695907 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691841
>Boots
>Anti-stall
You are the embodiment of what an embarrassment /vp/ has become over the years

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 09:25:37 No.46696146 Report

Quoted By:

Why don't we just take G-darmanitan and push it into another tier

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 09:30:11 No.46696164 Report

Quoted By: >>46696300 >>46696794

>>46691451
Crawdaunt has not dropped below UU ever since Gen 6

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 10:35:59 No.46696300 Report

Quoted By:

>>46696164
Don't respond to the bait, retard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 13:03:28 No.46696794 Report

Quoted By:

>>46696164
>It's been higher ever since ClefPex came out

HMMMMM

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 28 Mar 2021 16:24:19 No.46697868 Report

Quoted By:

>>46691203
This. Just use protect.

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