/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #48125622

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:29:44 No.48125622 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>48125628 >>48125633 >>48125638 >>48125648 >>48125700 >>48125816 >>48126059 >>48126500

>Oh damn, looks like there's some bullshit happening at the power plant with dynamax shit
>It's okay Victor/Gloria, you go do the gym challenge, I'll investigate this!

NO YOU FUCKING NIGGERFAGGOT I'VE BEEN DOING THE GYM CHALLENGE STRAIGHT FOR THE PAST FEW HOURS AND IT'S BECOME HORRIBLY REPETITIVE AND MONOTONOUS EXCEPT THAT TIEM I HELD HANDS WITH MELONY. I WANT TO RAID A FUCKING TERRORIST CELL WITH MY POKEMON LIKE I DID IN OLDER GAMES. EVEN XY AND SM GOT THIS RIGHT AT LEAST. FUCK

DOESN'T HELP THE ONLY VILLAIN TEAM BASE IN THE GAME IS A FUCKING ELEVATOR.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:30:41 No.48125623 Report

Quoted By: >>48125665

I’m glad. The evil team segments are always the most boring parts of every game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:31:32 No.48125628 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125622
Stay mad.
Cynthia, Steven and Wallace are irresponsible, incapable & shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:31:58 No.48125633 Report

Quoted By: >>48125660

>>48125622
Nobody listened when I said removing gyms was a good idea
I don't give half a shit, I play Pokémon games to invade the fucking terrorist hideouts, I want MORE emphasis on fighting the evil teams
SM/USM was the closest we ever got, but I want it even more than that

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:33:02 No.48125638 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125622
You can literally go battle giant pokemon in the wild area if you wanna do it so badly, plus you get to do his job in the post game anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:33:50 No.48125646 Report

Quoted By:

god this game is so fucking boring

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:34:00 No.48125648 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125622
>hurr i want incompetent champs like cynthia back!!

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:35:19 No.48125660 Report

Quoted By: >>48125682

>>48125633
Just play the Orre games. The entire game is just you vs. terrorists with like 1 gym.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:35:46 No.48125665 Report

Quoted By: >>48125752

>>48125623
Retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:37:24 No.48125682 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125660
Maybe I will

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:40:57 No.48125700 Report

Quoted By: >>48125712

>>48125622
>Oh okay, that must mean the last gym is really important and will be even more grand than some epic raid battles with Leon, right?
>The 8th gym doesn't even fucking exist and you just teleport to an older area to do some random battles before teleporting back to a generic stadium
>Then you actually do raid battles with the gym leaders in the post-game, rather than when it would have made sense right here
FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU
I'm convinced they cut the raid battles with the gym leaders so they could try and say they gave you SOMETHING for the postgame. They were so out of place in the final it's not even funny.
Also, the gyms were the one thing interesting these games had, and they couldn't even do SEVEN OF THEM jesus fucking christ. They did exactly six, scraped exactly one more "gym" out by making Spikemuth the gym, and then completely gave up and didn't even try to give Raihan one.
WHAT THE FUCK WERE THEY THINKING? I was literally in disbelief when I played the leaked version of this shit. Raihan was the most interesting gym leader and they gave him jack shit for a gym. The only other time my mouth gaped in awe at a game being so bad was an hour later when Oleana goes bipolar for literally no reason.
These games are a fucking disaster, and I would have gladly eaten them up if they just cared to let you do the first three gyms strategically in any order from the wild area, if Pokemon Home was synced with your Bank subscription, and if they didn't LITERALLY make the gameplay formula the same as Sun and Moon which was already criticized for being unlike Pokemon in terms of how guided and linear they were.
Gen 8 was supposed to be a return to form, not the same exact shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:42:20 No.48125712 Report

Quoted By: >>48125725

>>48125700
>The only other time my mouth gaped in awe at a game being so bad was an hour later when Oleana goes bipolar for literally no reason.
Surprised you didn't react to the weird hairdo faggots

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:44:38 No.48125725 Report

Quoted By: >>48126999

>>48125712
>Surprised you didn't react to the weird hairdo faggots
I was mindbroken after seeing the entirety of the game's climax occur through a series of stills while still not even understanding who or what Macros Cosmos even was or why they were bad. Swordward and Shielbert were just okay in the grand scheme of things but they obviously would have been better if they were the ones trying to fund Rose to do the shit he does or something.
Maybe that was also something they decided to cut from the campaign and shove in the postgame. It makes a hell of a lot more sense than whatever the fuck they ended up doing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:48:20 No.48125743 Report

Quoted By: >>48125768 >>48125795 >>48126092

>Be Lamce
>Champion of the Indigo League
>Investigating team rocket's fuckery at lake of rage, need backup
>Should I ask Pryce, the local gym leader who isn't doing anything?
>No, this ten year old is all the backup I need
>God I love capes

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:49:50 No.48125752 Report

Quoted By: >>48125777

>>48125665
Retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:51:42 No.48125768 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125743
Based Lance letting the player actually participate in the plot of the game that you're playing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:52:48 No.48125777 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125752
RETARF

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:56:31 No.48125795 Report

Quoted By: >>48125811

>>48125743
A game story doesn't always have to make the most logical choices. But it does have to at least be interesting. Helping the champion is far more interesting that being sidelined.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:58:59 No.48125811 Report

Quoted By: >>48125823 >>48127893

>>48125795
it's lazy writing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 17:59:56 No.48125816 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125622
Allister's daddy

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:00:52 No.48125823 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125811
It's based writing

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:21:36 No.48126001 Report

Quoted By:

This. Gym challenges are actually fucking boring and is just a mandatory gate to another portion of the game. No one actaully cares about gym trainers or whatever fapbait or forgettable monotype user there is.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:28:18 No.48126059 Report

Quoted By: >>48126079 >>48126169

>>48125622
If only there was a game that actually focused on the evil team.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:30:32 No.48126079 Report

Quoted By:

>>48126059
>Game focuses on the evil team AND makes the gym leaders relevant
I tolerated XY for being par for the course, but it really was a downgrade from how BW hit all the good notes like that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:31:35 No.48126092 Report

Quoted By: >>48126096

>>48125743
>should the player help Lance and participate in one of the most badass sequences in the entire series, clearing out a whole rocket base with the champion as if you're buddy cops?
>nah the old man should help and this should all take place offscreen
SwShfags have such shit taste, why do they think Leon doing shit is such great writing?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:32:32 No.48126096 Report

Quoted By: >>48126153

>>48126092
Don't respond to them, they don't understand the concept of agency or content and just call them buzzwords.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:38:19 No.48126153 Report

Quoted By: >>48126172

>>48126096
Perhaps it is good contentwise yet bad writingwise, though I'd say this sequence is actually more than fine
The Rocket Hideout raid, and the LoR clearly happens in the moment. You're not just sitting around, you're in the right place at the right time
RSE & DP have a lot worse writing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:40:24 No.48126169 Report

Quoted By: >>48126194

>>48126059
>Game focuses on the evil team AND makes the gym leaders relevant
I tolerated BW2 for being par for the course, but it really was a downgrade from how BW hit all the good notes like that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:40:49 No.48126172 Report

Quoted By: >>48126198

>>48126153
If you need to think about it like that then you're missing the point. You're in the right place at the right time because you are the player.
Because you are the player, you should be given the agency to do something in response to the event that is taking place; that agency is the difference between the player being some sort of awesome Mary Sue or the characters TELLING YOU that you're a Mary Sue like in Gen 7/8.
In short, it has purpose and it benefits the player. That's the part of game design philosophy that GameFreak lost from Sun and Moon onwards.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:42:51 No.48126194 Report

Quoted By: >>48126212

>>48126169
You're not wrong. XY and BW2 are very structurally similar, but you could argue BW2 did a better job at rounding out their gym leaders outside of the gym, as was the case with Cheren, Roxie, Skyla, Marlon, Drayden, and Burgh just off the top of my head.
Do you even like XY or are you just falseflagging? I never said they didn't do it because keep in mind that all of the XY gym leaders are still more fleshed out than the Trial Captains despite doing literally nothing in the story.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:43:11 No.48126198 Report

Quoted By: >>48126219

>>48126172
I agree, but things not making sense in-lore is still a valid critique. Yes, SwSh is retarded and took it to the extreme, but the champion also shouldn't look like an idiot for letting the player handle literally everything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:45:03 No.48126212 Report

Quoted By: >>48126230

>>48126194
>in mind that all of the XY gym leaders are still more fleshed out than the Trial Captains
The Trial Captains are more fleshed out than the Unova Gym Leaders so you're contradicting yourself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:45:32 No.48126219 Report

Quoted By: >>48126268

>>48126198
>the champion also shouldn't look like an idiot for letting the player handle literally everything.
They don't, though. The interaction with Lance and Team Rocket happens with you alongside. Contrast that with Leon sending you to do something else while being babysat by Hop as if there's supposed to be some reasonable solution that you could do that wasn't just Hop asspulling the woods out of nowhere.
Again, the player is given the agency to follow the events themselves rather than being strung along by an NPC. That's the difference.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:46:33 No.48126230 Report

Quoted By: >>48126240

>>48126212
But that's false, since XY's gym leaders are far more fleshed out than the Trial Captains but are still literally whos compared to Unova's gym leaders getting actual relevance both in and out of the story without being one note cutouts like every character in Gen 7 or 8.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:47:56 No.48126240 Report

Quoted By: >>48126294

>>48126230
The Unova Gym Leaders popping up in the most contrived way possible in the climax doesn't make them fleshed out. it just makes them lazy plot devices. The Trial Captains have more substantial characters and personalities.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:51:09 No.48126268 Report

Quoted By:

>>48126219
I agree. Hence saying I think the Rocket Raid is fine.
I have the most gripes with Cynthia in this regard. Team Galactic are obvious as shit, dangerous as hell, take hostages, use explosives, raid several significant locations across Sinnoh and are targeted by Interpol, yet she does absolutely nothing until it's too late even while literally walking past their base.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:53:44 No.48126294 Report

Quoted By: >>48126324

>>48126240
>The Unova Gym Leaders popping up in the most contrived way possible in the climax doesn't make them fleshed out.
t. never played the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 18:55:31 No.48126324 Report

Quoted By: >>48126379 >>48126380

>>48126294
I played the game. Their characters are barebones and just they just show up to make the plot move forward.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:01:24 No.48126379 Report

Quoted By: >>48126396 >>48126427 >>48126521

>>48126324
They have more to their character than the Trial Captains do. Which again, isn't saying much since even the fucking Kalos gym leaders get more meaningful dialogue and character building than the Trial Captains did.
Unova's gym leaders are actually relevant. That's how they should be. Alola just treats all of its characters like pump-and-dump cutouts. They act more like fire emblem characters which only are relevant for one act of the story and then do nothing in the back of your party for the rest of the game. Unova has them take part each step of the way through.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:01:29 No.48126380 Report

Quoted By: >>48126427

>>48126324
>Throughtout the whole game, the gym leaders have been fighting and dealing with Team Plasma
>Clay in Twist Mountain tells you and Cheren that all of the gym leaders were meeting together to figure out how to deal with Team Plasma
>Bianca at Route 10 says she will do anything she can to assist you
>In N's Castle, the gym leaders shown up because Bianca called them for help and knew that they couldn't ignore Team Plasma
>"What?! They just popped out of nowhere! So contrived!"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:03:05 No.48126396 Report

Quoted By: >>48126521

>>48126379
>Kalos gym leaders get more meaningful dialogue and character building than the Trial Captains did.
?
half of them literally do not even leave their gym

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:06:09 No.48126427 Report

Quoted By: >>48126454 >>48126520

>>48126379
>They have more to their character than the Trial Captains do
No they don't. Trial Captains all have developed histories, families, hobbies, personalities, etc. There's literally an optional side event that shows Kiawe getting laid off from his part time job after you go to his house because he was too busy working on his other duties.

Unova Gym Leaders only exist to conveniently show up to move the plot like when Elesa inexplicably convinces Bianca's dad to fuck off. Their actual personalities are near non-existent.

>>48126380
>>Throughtout the whole game, the gym leaders have been fighting and dealing with Team Plasma
>>In N's Castle, the gym leaders shown up because Bianca called them for help and knew that they couldn't ignore Team Plasma
Doesn't explain them magically showing up like 10 seconds after the castle rises.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:09:09 No.48126454 Report

Quoted By: >>48126474

>>48126427
>Doesn't explain them magically showing up like 10 seconds after the castle rises.
You mean the player walk into the building through a long stairway after listening to N, Alder and Cheren to listen to all of the sages' ramblings in less than 10 seconds?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:11:07 No.48126474 Report

Quoted By: >>48126482

>>48126454
Yes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:12:01 No.48126482 Report

Quoted By:

>>48126474
Hilbert = The Flash

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:14:52 No.48126500 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125622
Yeah why’d even mention it in the first place but to leave your balls blue? Literally just have his retarded brother casually mention Leon is fighting a big threat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:17:00 No.48126520 Report

Quoted By: >>48126537 >>48126540

>>48126427
>There's literally an optional side event that shows Kiawe getting laid off from his part time job after you go to his house because he was too busy working on his other duties.
Meanwhile, Burgh...
>Meets you in Nacrene, where he is stated to have started his career and has an interaction with Lenora. You also learn that a part of his character is that he gets artist's block which is a personable trait and not some exaggerated quirk like the Trial Captains
>Helps you catch Team Plasma in Pinwheel Forest, showing his knowledge and care for the environment that houses the type he is supposed to specialize in.
>Shows even more personality with the interactions between Team Plasma and Iris before you even fight him
>Notes how he even designs the gym puzzle himself afterwards, showcasing even more of his character
Which makes it even more meaningful when he "randomly shows up" like you say.
Again, with Kalos-- even fucking Grant has more to him than any of the trial captains. He's popular in the fashion world, is a good rock climber, and shows his leader personality by winning and organizing the bike competitions in Cyllage. You get ample interaction with him before and after you arbitrarily fight him for your gym badge and even afterwards you can optionally learn more about him like how he keeps his appearance by cutting down on his eating habits or how he misses sweets but refuses to eat them because of his modeling career.
All of that is more personable than the arbitrary one-note interactions you get during an entire SIDE SEQUENCE with the trial captains. How can you call that acceptable? They could make an entire game about Kiawe but it would just be him saying the same shit over and over like every other character in Alola does. It's grating.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:17:09 No.48126521 Report

Quoted By: >>48126540

>>48126396
>half of them literally do not even leave their gym
>>48126379 is wrong to claim that they have more development than the trial captains, but saying they don't leave their gyms is also false.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:19:29 No.48126537 Report

Quoted By:

>>48126520
>>Helps you catch Team Plasma in Pinwheel Forest
i.e. he exists to be a roadblock

>showing his knowledge and care for the environment
Simply being in Pinwheel Forest before and knowing its layout is a personality? KEK

>>Shows even more personality with the interactions between Team Plasma and Iris
No he doesn't.

>>Notes how he even designs the gym puzzle himself afterwards,
Wow he's an artist. Where's his actual character tho?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 19:19:36 No.48126540 Report

Quoted By:

>>48126521
I wouldn't even use the Battle Chateau as an example. They're not necessarily wrong either, a lot of Kalos gym leaders literally are stepping stones that don't exist outside of their gym. Yet they STILL get more development than Alola's cardboard cutout gym rejects like in >>48126520
The fact is that Unova has characterization down pat. Every game should strive to the standard that Unova set, and while XY was a step down there's no denying that anything is preferable to the state of nu-Pokemon from SM onwards.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 20:14:42 No.48126999 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125725
The manga might be going this route based on the latest chapter.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 05 Sep 2021 22:05:47 No.48127893 Report

Quoted By:

>>48125811
No, lazy writing is picking the most logical choice every time. Almost no stories would exist if everything was logical all the time. Characters make snap decisions or act irrationally sometimes. But in Lance's case, he had his ass kicked by two kids about Gold's age. He sees how Gold handles the gyarados, decides to take a chance. This might not be the most pragmatic choice over choosing Pryce who has a history, but it's one that's fine within the story itself.

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