/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #48210380

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1MiB, 1280x1280, chronix.png

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:53:21 No.48210380 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>48210405 >>48210651 >>48210684 >>48211091 >>48215870 >>48216771 >>48217098 >>48217774 >>48219267 >>48219280 >>48219300 >>48219765 >>48220258 >>48222724 >>48226061 >>48226386 >>48227615 >>48227760

ITT: Pokemon who need buffs

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:55:34 No.48210393 Report

Quoted By: >>48210394 >>48213935 >>48216495 >>48217763

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:56:10 No.48210394 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210393
Why is her sword so veiny?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:57:33 No.48210402 Report

Quoted By:

>48210393
Thread ruined

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:57:59 No.48210405 Report

Quoted By: >>48210441

>>48210380
Umm...Eviolite Go??

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 22:59:24 No.48210417 Report

Quoted By:

should get dragon rage

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:02:41 No.48210441 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210405
Still has piss-poor Attack and a 4x weakness to Water and Gayass

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:06:19 No.48210460 Report

Quoted By: >>48210507 >>48211018 >>48218821 >>48222844 >>48224551

I win

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:13:17 No.48210507 Report

Quoted By: >>48211039 >>48218821

>>48210460
This is true, I love gen 2 pokemon but GameFreak has a grudge against Johto. They gave a few pokemon buffs over the years but those were random flukes. Like Azumarill getting Huge Power, and Fairy typing, or Mantine getting HP buff + Roost. I dont think more cross-gen evos is the solution. The backwards stat distribution and sloppy design of back then needs to be corrected now to compensate for the retarded power creep over the years.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:36:29 No.48210651 Report

Quoted By: >>48219267 >>48221747 >>48222402 >>48222490

>>48210380
Had to dig to find this again. I'd definitely change a couple things on this like making Onix faster but I'm too lazy to right now.

I remember when I did the damage calcs this made them slightly bulkier on both sides, but not absurdly so. I like when massive Pokémon have massive HP stats to help convey their size.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:38:46 No.48210671 Report

Quoted By: >>48210769 >>48211526 >>48211566 >>48219225 >>48227558

Typhlosion

Give him thunderbolt and earth power. It goes with his volcano theme when you think about it

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:41:01 No.48210684 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210380
How would you even buff this and would it effect Steelix?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:48:14 No.48210728 Report

Quoted By: >>48210750 >>48210794 >>48211416 >>48211593 >>48216599 >>48222831 >>48224099 >>48226372

Love this one

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:51:57 No.48210750 Report

Quoted By: >>48210774

>>48210728
That not at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:54:00 No.48210769 Report

Quoted By: >>48219225

>>48210671
Or better yet, give him better stats and not just Charizard copy pasted ones

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:54:50 No.48210774 Report

Quoted By: >>48210811

>>48210750
not what at all? loved by yourself? I think Sawsbuck changing types and shit is great. makea it way more unique. What is even the point of changing form with the season if it is literally 100% aesthetic?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 15 Sep 2021 23:58:53 No.48210794 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
add a second type to summer

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:02:29 No.48210811 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210774
Holy fuck, I must of had a stroke. That was meant to be 'That's not bad at all'.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:31:05 No.48211018 Report

Quoted By: >>48211033 >>48211036 >>48220090 >>48231007

>>48210460
>Rate my autism:

Regional form and evolution for Sentret based in Mythological Tanuki

Regional evolution for female Ariados based in jorogumo

Gigamax form for Crobbat based in Transylvania and Dracula castle

Regional evolution for Chinchou based in moster fish

Gigamax for Xatu literally a totem pokemon

Gigamax form for ampharos, a light house

Dunsparce ....he is cool guy

Regional Snubull and Grandbull

Evolution and Gigamax form for Quillfish based in a warship

Evolution for Schuckle....ghost type

Regional Slugma and evolution based in a snail and a wooden house grass type

Gigamax octyllery based in a kraken and a tank (Rival of quillfish)

New Pokemon goat based in Krampus, is rival of Delibird

Mantine Gigamax based in B-2A with quillfish bombs

Skarmory pre-evolution

Regional Smeargle dark type based in Bansky

Miltank/Tauros prevolution

Gigamax Chansey, literally a wall

Regional legendary beasts based in tornados, earthquakes, snowstorms

Gigamax Tyranitar based in shin godzilla

Shadow Lugia

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:33:01 No.48211033 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211018
>Regional
Try again

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:33:29 No.48211036 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211018
I mean that would be sick

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:33:37 No.48211039 Report

Quoted By: >>48211078 >>48218821 >>48220206 >>48221720

>>48210507
>Game Freak has a grudge against Johto
Especially against the starters and its not just Game Freak its TPC too
>no unique menu sprites in Gen II when the KANTO starters got them
>boring, unfun movepools that make them a chore to use
>almost no anime appearances
>almost no merch
>almost no cards
>no hidden abilities until Gen 6 and most of them are direct downgrade of Kanto’s
>skipped over for Megas despite needing them more than any other starter
>Johto was targeted the most by Dexit
>Gen I mons being use more often than Gen II mons by important characters in Johtogames. (PChal is a shitposting tool, but the fact that Gen II pokemon appear so rarely on Gen II boss teams doesn't really make sense, especially since every other Gen had no problem putting the new Pokemon in the spotlight.
>intertwined to Kanto, ("But going to Kanto was cool". Yeah it was. But it pretty much cucked the Johto region forever because KANTO is only thing anyone thinks about when talking about the Johto games and contributes to the idiotic belief that Johto can't stand on its own.)
>Johto starters stats are just rearranged from Kanto starters (except Typhlosion was stuck with the unique dishonor of being a Charizard clone without the movepool, respect, or worship that Charizard gets just for existing.)

There's a schizo theory that either the Johto starters were intentionally make worthless so that Kanto starters would look better in comparison, or TPC/Game Freak hate the Kansai region that Johto is based on. Until Game Freak treats the Johto starters like actual Pokemon and gives makes the Johto starters useable, I'm going to have to believe those.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:40:55 No.48211078 Report

Quoted By: >>48211764 >>48212445 >>48218821

>>48211039
Feraligatr is perfectly viable, it's really just Typhlosion and especially Meganium that suck ass.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:43:47 No.48211091 Report

Quoted By: >>48211099

>>48210380
How about a 100% accurate Rock Type move that scales with height?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:45:12 No.48211099 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211091
Or give it better stats

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 00:50:45 No.48211135 Report

Quoted By: >>48211406

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 01:42:48 No.48211406 Report

Quoted By: >>48211872

>>48211135
Play da game

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 01:44:45 No.48211416 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
I like the idea of exclusive moves/abilities to certain forms. Don't think any type changes are needed, though
I'd also generally improve Sawsbuck's base stats. Have the same stats for all forms, but improve the Attack by like 115 and Speed by 105

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 02:05:33 No.48211526 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210671
>volcanic lightning
I didn't even know this was a thing, this makes Typhlosion having Thunderpunch completely justified

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 02:12:46 No.48211566 Report

Quoted By: >>48219225

>>48210671
Boomburst also fits the volcano theme as well + Throat Spray shenanigans

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 02:16:26 No.48211593 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
The summer one should be fire or normal at least

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 02:49:55 No.48211764 Report

Quoted By: >>48218821

>>48211078
>really just Typhlosion and especially Meganium that suck ass.
That makes sense, Venusaur is Game Freak's Favorite and Charizard is TPC's favorite. Meganium and Typhlosion were made completely worthless in order to make those two look better. Blastiose isn't put on a pedestal like the other Kanto Starters, so Feraligatr is allowed to be an actual Pokemon.
.
The only reason Game Freak was allowed to use Cyndaquil for Legends was because Masuda was working somewhere else for BDSP.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 03:08:47 No.48211872 Report

Quoted By: >>48214279

>>48211406
Is this the defacto go-to response every time someone has the audacity to say that an Ice-type Pokémon should be buffed?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 05:13:15 No.48212445 Report

Quoted By: >>48212525 >>48212529 >>48218821

>>48211078
Typhlosion would be fine too, if only Gamefreak let the poor fucking thing have anything resembling a special movepool. At least in gen 2/3 it had thunderpunch, but now its coverage is like, Focus blast and Extrasensory as an egg move. The fact it still doesn't learn earth power absolutely boggles the mind. Maybe Legends will finally deliver some long awaited buffs.

Meganium however, is basically beyond salvation. The only thing that might have made it see play was if they changed its HA to be Grassy Surge, and that's a big might.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 05:20:08 No.48212469 Report

Quoted By: >>48212495

Why doesn't Heracross get U-turn?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 05:29:32 No.48212495 Report

Quoted By:

>>48212469
Because her catapults you, not himself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 05:39:40 No.48212525 Report

Quoted By: >>48216875 >>48218821

>>48212445
>if only Gamefreak let the poor fucking thing have anything resembling a special movepool
It’s painfully obvious that it’s movepool was intentionally made wrong to make it worse Charizard. Reminder that it doesn’t even get Swords Dance the most basic set up move on the game, so it can’t use the physical movepools Game Freak bloated it’s movepool with. However since it’s Legends Game Freak doesn’t seem to hate it any more so it should get something.
>least in gen 2/3 it had thunderpunch
The Phys-spec split created more problems than it solved. Even if you give Typhlosion the special movepool it should have had a fucking decade ago, it would still have 84 Base stats completely wasted. Before pokemon needed both attacking stats to make the most of certain coverage options. But after the split, the concept of having two attacking stats is obsolete because only the higher offensive stat matters anyway. There is no reason for Pokémon to have “balanced” offenses.

>>48212445
Not happening, Rillaboom stole it and as far as I know, no starters share hidden abilities (Yes Libero pretty much is Protean and exists solely to make Shillerdace broken, but it counts as a different ability) The best thematically appropriate abilities Meganium can hope for are Flower Veil or Triage and those are special snowflake signature abilities.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 05:40:50 No.48212529 Report

Quoted By:

>>48212445
>Meganium however, is basically beyond salvation.
AND THAT IS A GOOD THING, HERE'S WHY:
Play the game.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 11:35:15 No.48213935 Report

Quoted By: >>48216495

>>48210393
Needs Leaf Blade, and pic related needs Focus Blast

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 13:18:31 No.48214279 Report

Quoted By: >>48217377

>>48211872
Aurorus doesn't need a buff

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 16:30:21 No.48215325 Report

Quoted By: >>48215864

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 17:34:32 No.48215864 Report

Quoted By: >>48216361

>>48215325
dogshit, and ugly ass formatting, i'm upset i had to read through that eyesore just to see a bunch of bullshit

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 17:36:05 No.48215870 Report

Quoted By: >>48215966 >>48216536

>>48210380
Steelix is the buff

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 17:46:44 No.48215966 Report

Quoted By: >>48216505 >>48216516 >>48216701

>>48215870
Steelix is an entirely separate Pokemon

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:35:29 No.48216361 Report

Quoted By:

>>48215864
Yeah, you're right. Tried to go for something more visual, but it didn't workout
They're a pain in the dick to make, as well

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:53:01 No.48216495 Report

Quoted By: >>48217466

>>48210393
>>48213935
These swshit shillmons dont need shit you retards.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:54:19 No.48216502 Report

Quoted By:

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:54:49 No.48216505 Report

Quoted By: >>48216876

>>48215966
NFEs don't need buffs. That's retaded as fuck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:55:58 No.48216516 Report

Quoted By: >>48216701 >>48216876

>>48215966
No, it's the evolution of Onix.
Buffing Onix would be pointless and redundant.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 18:58:18 No.48216536 Report

Quoted By: >>48216560

>>48215870
What would you think about buffing Scyther?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:00:32 No.48216560 Report

Quoted By:

>>48216536
Still pointless, perhaps more so given that Scizor is very strong in every generation

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:04:17 No.48216599 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
Winter Swasbuck learn Triple Axel Kick due to bucks being able to jump up high but honestly who cares about logic just have it learn the cheesiest "almost broken if it connects all times" ice type attack.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:16:42 No.48216701 Report

Quoted By:

>>48215966
>>48216516
This is why I don't like cross gen evos.
I don't want the shitmon I like to be replaced by something I may not like.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:25:48 No.48216771 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210380
>Weaker than a fucking energy Tick

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:38:30 No.48216875 Report

Quoted By:

>>48212525
torterra and samurott both have shell armor :3

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 19:38:47 No.48216876 Report

Quoted By: >>48222491

>>48216505
>>48216516
Onix is way different from Steelix, in terms of concept and playstyle. It could stand on it's own, anyway

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 20:05:10 No.48217098 Report

Quoted By: >>48218024

>>48210380
This Pokemon sucks. Not only is it weak but it's a shit design too. Just a boring row ov rocks with a face. It's something a 5 year old could come up with. Poorly designed monsters shouldn't get buffs.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 20:17:38 No.48217207 Report

Quoted By: >>48221768

give snorlax slack off already

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 20:37:26 No.48217377 Report

Quoted By: >>48217586

>>48214279
Unironically post your ELO or Pokè Ball tier then.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 20:53:20 No.48217466 Report

Quoted By:

>>48216495
it's just banter, anon
squeeze the weewee out of your ass

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:09:57 No.48217586 Report

Quoted By:

>>48217377
Elo: 9999
Poker Ball Tier: Master(bait in your mom's face) Ball

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:29:48 No.48217723 Report

Quoted By:

Honestly cross gen evos should happen more often. Some pokemon need it. What sucks is that some of the mega evolutions looked great as new evolutions for pokemon that didn't evolve or had one stage evos.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:36:08 No.48217763 Report

Quoted By: >>48217801

>>48210393
fp always bp
zacian needs to be able to transform without a sword so it can have a choice band

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:37:41 No.48217774 Report

Quoted By: >>48218027 >>48219469

>>48210380
here's ur buff bro

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:42:41 No.48217801 Report

Quoted By: >>48217855

>>48217763
Mega Rayquaza, but doge.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 21:50:38 No.48217855 Report

Quoted By: >>48221777

>>48217801
I agree.
Isn't Sord Doge already more OP than MegaFug despite not having an item tho?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 22:19:05 No.48218024 Report

Quoted By:

>>48217098
>This Pokemon sucks. Not only is it weak but it's a shit design too. Just a boring row ov rocks with a face. It's something a 5 year old could come up with. Poorly designed monsters shouldn't get buffs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 22:19:34 No.48218027 Report

Quoted By: >>48219069

>>48217774
They gave him another buff with mega Steelix (should've been a permanent evolution)

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 22:25:59 No.48218075 Report

Quoted By: >>48222865

>Give Onix 510 bst like Steelix
>Make a new item called "Dematalizer" or something
>Now Steelix can be reverted back to Onix and vice versa
>Do the same for Scyther and Scizor

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 16 Sep 2021 22:47:02 No.48218238 Report

Quoted By: >>48218665 >>48218821 >>48219031

With regard to the Johto starters:

Meganium's biggest design flaw seems to be being spread too thin, every stat is merely decent with no strong point to focus on. Docking to 60 Attack, then boosting Sp. Attack to 95 and Sp. Defense to 110, would be one way to give a specific point to the 'Mon. Move-wise, Heat Wave and/or Overheat could be given if interested in offensive coverage, while Life Dew, Wish, and/or Grassy Terrain would go well with Aromatherapy as a "cleric". Pollen Puff's also noteworthy as it's Bug-type damage and can heal an allied Pokemon in Double Battles.

For Typhlosion, the apparent key issue is the move pool being at odds with the stats and covering poorly. Either flip Attack and Sp. Attack, or give Earth Power and/or Mud Shot, possibly Energy Ball if we're being obsessive about standing alone. Could just as well Solar Beam with Sunny Day setups, including Meganium funnily enough, but it mostly seems to be a lack of coverage and too much focus on Physical moves for a Special attacker, so coverage with the attack it uses it is.

Feraligatr's core issue seems to be that it's too easily countered, out-sped by too many sweepers and survived by too many walls. Either increase Attack and Speed to make a solid Sweeper, or increase bulk to trade another turn with Electric and Grass types. Not too sure about any movepool issues to address, since it seems to be more a matter of the overall type chart making Crunch too valuable for general-use coverage for Bulldoze to be worth using than actually lacking anything. Maybe chuck in Fire/Thunder Punch just to fill space?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 00:02:05 No.48218665 Report

Quoted By: >>48219029 >>48219054 >>48222333

>>48218238
You've never used Sheer Force Gator, have ya?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 00:29:30 No.48218821 Report

Quoted By: >>48219054 >>48219259 >>48219947 >>48222203

>>48210460
>>48210507
>>48211039
>>48211078
>>48211764
>>48212445
>>48212525
>>48218238
Meganium doesn't need a buff. Play the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:02:12 No.48219029 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218665
For point of reference, a Jolly Feraligator needs +2 attack, Sheer Force, and Life Orb to be sure to OHKO Meganium with Ice Punch. Meaning being wide open as a non-defensive 'Mon for two turns to Dragon Dance there and taking more damage each turn after, unless you Baton Pass a boost.

In the same time, Blaziken can Swords Dance once, then one-shot Feraligator with several different moves, without even needing Life Orb. It doesn't *matter* that Feraligator can one-shot twice over without a boost, because it will never land that Liquidate.

Mega Y Charizard brings Draught, one-shotting Feraligator with Solar Beam no chargeup. Mega X has to eat a Liquidate before attacking to not two-shot. Feraligator takes over half its health from a regular 'Zard using Overheat, and needs to boost to one-shot Gigantimax Charizard to prevent G-Max Wildfire.

Choice Band Infernape out-speeds if there isn't a boost, such as each leading with it, and deals at least 80% damage with Close Combat, leaving Feraligator to die to its own Life Orb if it knows what's good for its damage breakpoints.

To move away from Fire-type Starters tending to take out or cripple a Water-type "sweeper" specifically because of speed, the above-mentioned Feraligator needs +2 to two-shot a Ferrothorn, who can use Knock Off in response to end up dealing no less than 44.4% of Feraligator's health if I have the math right and stripping a chunk of health. Without Life Orb, it's a three-hit KO *after two turns of setup*, leading to death by wall.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:02:24 No.48219031 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218238
Most nugen powercreep pokemon benefit from having uniquely tailored abilities and stat spreads, especially gen 7 where every Alola pokemon had a unique ability,

Older pokemon would benefit from better stat spreads and stat buffs, + unique abilites but they get stuck with throw away useless abilities that's handed to everyone.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:05:32 No.48219054 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218821
>>48218665
Again, it doesn't have any strong point to focus on. There's loads of walls able to survive lots of things it can't, plenty of clerics who can *actually heal the team in singles*, plenty of Grass Types that are faster or have higher damage or more coverage, usually several, to be better sweepers.

There's nothing it can do you can't say "X does it better" for a good pile of 'Mons, because it's spread too thin and is left with an incomplete movelist for any task it can do. It isn't that Meganium is outright shit, it's that Meganium is a Master Of None and doesn't have enough BST to make that work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:08:23 No.48219069 Report

Quoted By: >>48227827

>>48218027
No, you evo fags need to die. Stop wanting an evolution on everything for fucks sake. If you had your way, a new generation of pokemon would just be pure cross gen evos, making all previous pokemon obsolete, and introducing no new lines.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:29:20 No.48219225 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210671
>>48210769
>>48211566
Best move would probably be to make it a fast special-oriented SR pivot with the additions of Earth Power, maybe Thunderbolt or Energy Ball (covers water/grounds and is kind of just a move given to random shit at this point), maybe Boomburst (volcanos are loud, I guess), maybe Scald (again, volcano), U-Turn (badger) and Stealth Rock (volcano, again). Gives it a different niche compared to Charizard’s niche as a sun sweeper while still having coverage to threaten most things out there. Make it slightly less bulky while upgrading it’s speed and boom.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:35:50 No.48219259 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218821
That’s what people in the early 2000’s did and even then they said it sucks ass, you try playing the game.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:37:22 No.48219267 Report

Quoted By: >>48220398 >>48220425 >>48222651 >>48222661

>>48210380
>>48210651
Onix was literally designed to be the first gym boss RBY.

>Resists normal, flying type attacks, Immune to electric if you luck out a Pikachu, which 90% of mon are running
>Defense is galactically big to make your ATTs pointless
>Speed decently high, better than any of your early shitmon so it always goes first
>Tiny HP pool so you aren't absolutely WALLED by its Defense stat
>paper thin Special Attack/Defense
>Only moves are Are Tackle, Bide, and Screech
>Tackle so it can actually do damage
>Screech to stop you from rising your defenses against its shit attacks
>Bide to actually take advantage of its tanking and hit you back for being a dumbass using physical moves.

Onix was meant to teach you the mechanics of the game. How defense and special differentiate, typing, and how debuffs work.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:39:39 No.48219280 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210380
Onix is fine. I soloed ORAS with one and it wasn't that hard.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 01:42:11 No.48219300 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210380
Fur Coat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 02:07:24 No.48219469 Report

Quoted By:

>>48217774
>Fletchinder used Ember

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 02:10:53 No.48219485 Report

Quoted By: >>48219961 >>48221623 >>48222450 >>48225904 >>48225939

@everyone

Abomasnow doesn't need a buff.
Aerodactyl doesn't need a buff.
Archeops doesn't need a buff.
Aggron doesn't need a buff.
Ampharos doesn't need a buff.
Armaldo doesn't need a buff.
Aurorus doesn't need a buff.
Avalugg doesn't need a buff.
Bastiodon doesn't need a buff.
Beartic doesn't need a buff.
Cacturne doesn't need a buff.
Carracosta doesn't need a buff.
Cradily doesn't need a buff.
Cramorant doesn't need a buff.
Druddigon doesn't need a buff.
Electivire doesn't need a buff.
Feraligatr doesn't need a buff.
Flareon doesn't need a buff.
Flygon doesn't need a buff.
Frosmoth doesn't need a buff.
Furret doesn't need a buff.
Girafarig doesn't need a buff.
Golisopod doesn't need a buff.
Granbull doesn't need a buff.
Heracross doesn't need a buff.
Heatmor doesn't need a buff.
Kabutops doesn't need a buff.
Lapras doesn't need a buff.
Ledian doesn't need a buff.
Lycanroc doesn't need a buff.
Magmortar doesn't need a buff.
Mawile doesn't need a buff.
Meganium doesn't need a buff.
Misdreavus doesn't need a buff.
Noctowl doesn't need a buff.
Omastar doesn't need a buff.
Onyx doesn't need a buff.
Pinsir doesn't need a buff.
Poliwrath doesn't need a buff.
Rampardos doesn't need a buff.
Sableye doesn't need a buff.
Shiftry doesn't need a buff.
Spiritomb doesn't need a buff.
Syvally doesn't need a buff.
Thievul doesn't need a buff.
Tropius doesn't need a buff.
Typhlosion doesn't need a buff.
Tyrantrum doesn't need a buff.
Vikavolt doesn't need a buff.
Walrein doesn't need a buff.
Wooloo doesn't need a buff.
Wurmple doesn't need a buff.
Xatu doesn't need a buff.

These Pokemon DESERVE to be SHIT. Fuck YOU and FUCK Rock-fags AND Ice-fags in particular.

And play the game.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 02:56:42 No.48219765 Report

Quoted By: >>48226372

>>48210380

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 03:31:44 No.48219947 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218821
Meganium is shit even in-game, Grass doesn't have an advantage against any of the Johto gyms and is weak against many of them. Even if you wanted to use a grass type it's outclassed by Victreebel, Vileplume, and Exeggutor.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 03:34:48 No.48219961 Report

Quoted By: >>48220061 >>48220112

>>48219485
I mean, this guy has a point. A lot of pokemon are simply designed based on things other than competitive play.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 03:49:57 No.48220061 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219961
That pretty retarded then, Pokemon was intended as a social game since inspection and 99% of the multiplier is battling.
Reminder that the biggest reason Johto gets shit on al the time is due to over 90% of Gen 2 pokemon being objectively worthless. (Ledian, Unown, Delibrd, Sunflora, Stanler, Girafarig, like what the fuck? Reminder that Charizard has more forms than Typhlosion has moves).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 03:54:18 No.48220090 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211018
>that last one
Hi James Turner! When will you finally make a good mon again? Have you lost your touch since Buzzwole?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 03:58:02 No.48220112 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219961
>failing to identify bait

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 04:14:38 No.48220206 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211039
Legends will probably buff typhlosion

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 04:24:14 No.48220258 Report

Quoted By: >>48231082

>>48210380
Buffs in the form of an evolution.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 04:25:08 No.48220266 Report

Quoted By:

Buff my bro, please?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 04:48:13 No.48220398 Report

Quoted By: >>48220814 >>48222302 >>48231348

>>48219267
>Onix was literally designed to be the first gym boss RBY.
This is a dumb argument. Cranidos is the first boss in gen 4 with 125 attack and no dual weakness.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 04:53:55 No.48220425 Report

Quoted By: >>48220814 >>48222302

>>48219267
Onyx being "the first/tutorial boss" is about as invalid as Chikorita being gen 2's "hard mode".

Inexcusable, especially in Chikorita's case due to being a starter.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 06:45:18 No.48220814 Report

Quoted By: >>48222218 >>48222267

>>48220398
>This is a dumb argument. Cranidos is the first boss in gen 4 with 125 attack and no dual weakness.
And paper-thin defenses and low speed. Neither Cranidos or Onix are good Pokemon so what's your point?

>>48220425
No it isn't. Onix is the ace of Kanto's first gym leader, which means it has to be relatively weak just like the pokemon of every other first gym leader. Pidgeotto is shit. Nosepass is shit. Cranidos is shit. The gen 5 monkeys are shit, etc. If you buffed Onix itself to a level comparable to something like Arcanine it'd be too strong to fulfill that role in the games, hence why they opted to give it an evolution instead of directly buffing it in gen 2. Just use Steelix, no one complains about not being able to viably use Pidgeotto or Nosepass either so why is it suddenly a problem when Onix sucks too?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 10:51:50 No.48221623 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219485
Lapras got an amazing buff in gen 8 with its gigantmax form. It was one of the most dynamaxed pokémon for a good while.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 11:20:34 No.48221720 Report

Quoted By:

>>48211039
>(PChal is a shitposting tool)
He's entirely correct

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 11:24:04 No.48221736 Report

Quoted By: >>48222213

>does not get Brave Bird
>has shit abilities
>outclassed by Dodrio in every aspect
>not even better than Pidgeot anymore due to it getting a mega
It feels like Fearow was made to only be used by early-to-mid npc's rather than the player.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 11:27:50 No.48221747 Report

Quoted By: >>48226258

>>48210651
>hurr durr just give the first gym leader's ace 190 hp and 105 attack
Literal retard take.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 11:35:14 No.48221768 Report

Quoted By:

>>48217207
I don't think it'd take that over Rest still. It's a sitting duck for status.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 11:38:01 No.48221777 Report

Quoted By:

>>48217855
Yes and no. Zacian gets hard countered by Quagsire. Mega Rayquaza has no hard counters, only checks. Zacian has overall better matchups against more legendaries, but Mega Ray is able to run physical, special, and mixed sets, set up sweep, revenge kill, and delete weather.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 13:36:06 No.48222203 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218821
It sucks in game too

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 13:39:29 No.48222213 Report

Quoted By:

>>48221736
>>does not get Brave Bird
Of course it doesn't. It's a cowardly mammal

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 13:40:47 No.48222218 Report

Quoted By:

>>48220814
>And paper-thin defenses and low speed
Cranidos has decent bulk and speed, for the point of the game at which you fight it. You're likely not killing the thing with just one move

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 13:51:58 No.48222267 Report

Quoted By:

>>48220814
>No it isn't. Onix is the ace of Kanto's first gym leader, which means it has to be relatively weak just like the pokemon of every other first gym leader. Pidgeotto is shit. Nosepass is shit. Cranidos is shit. The gen 5 monkeys are shit, etc. If you buffed Onix itself to a level comparable to something like Arcanine it'd be too strong to fulfill that role in the games, hence why they opted to give it an evolution instead of directly buffing it in gen 2. Just use Steelix, no one complains about not being able to viably use Pidgeotto or Nosepass either so why is it suddenly a problem when Onix sucks too?
Ok, and?
Gen 1 is over. Game Freak can buff Onix now, without it being too strong for the first boss
The first boss argument falls apart anyway, since in the same game, one of the Elite 4 members uses two Onix's on his team

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:00:32 No.48222302 Report

Quoted By: >>48222334

>>48220398
Its literally the games first foray. GF was literally having to figure out how to get kids to understand special/physical split and debuffs in what they assumed was gonna be a one off game for children.

Onix is a genius implementation of that. And Steelix being its godly defensive evolution in the second gen is a great way to circumvent the fact that Onix was literally designed to be shit in most way but difficult in only the "early Gen 1 route" way

>>48220425
Chikorita was poorly designed, but in general Gen 2 was rushed. Quilava line are carbon copies of Charizard line in stats and Feraligatr is a physical sweeper 2 gens before it could get access to good physical moves.

Things can be mended down the line, but early gen design aspects like Onix are really good JRPG tutorials that can be accommodated by things like better abilities (see Marril) or evolutions (see Steelix)

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:06:30 No.48222333 Report

Quoted By: >>48222341

>>48218665
just use dragon dance Gyarados. Feraligatr is kept low by the fact Gyarados literally outclasses it as a physical dragon dancing water type it gets all of Feraligatr's moves plus some all while having better over all stats. I cant even think of a way to get one over Gyarados... uhh superpower?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:06:32 No.48222334 Report

Quoted By: >>48222402

>>48222302
>Onix is a genius implementation of that. And Steelix being its godly defensive evolution in the second gen is a great way to circumvent the fact that Onix was literally designed to be shit in most way but difficult in only the "early Gen 1 route" way
Or they could've circumvented it by buffing Onix's piss-poor stats in the remakes. Instead of having to make Steelix. Not saying Steelix should've never existed, but it would've been cool if Onix and Steelix were like Scyther/Scizor, in the way that they share the same BST, just redistributed
Does it reaslly matter if Onix is too strong for earlygame, if you never fight it earlygame?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:07:34 No.48222341 Report

Quoted By: >>48222378

>>48222333
Feral Alligator takes neutral damage against Rock + isn't 4x weak to Electric
It also has Aqua Jet, which Gyarados doesn't

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:13:16 No.48222378 Report

Quoted By: >>48222401

>>48222341
just use Crawdaunt

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:18:07 No.48222401 Report

Quoted By: >>48225215

>>48222378
Crawdaunt is frail as shitballs. Feraligatr has like 100 Defense

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:18:16 No.48222402 Report

Quoted By: >>48222483

>>48222334
>Buff Onix
>make remake
>Have to deal with this at your first Gym:
>>48210651

Good fucking luck getting OHKO'd by tackle. Deal with it that Onix is a NFE mon just like charmeleon and will suck by its stats.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:27:11 No.48222450 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219485
Unironically post your elo and ball level then you wojakshitter.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:33:23 No.48222483 Report

Quoted By: >>48222583 >>48222652

>>48222402
>>Buff Onix
>>make remake
>>Have to deal with this at your first Gym:
Nerf it for the remakes, then
Then buff it again, after the remakes

Either do that, or add some earlygame Grass/Water-Type Pokemon, to make buffed Onix less of a problem

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:34:28 No.48222490 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210651
Onix should have high Defense, Attack and Speed. Make it a speedy, offensive Rock/Ground-Type

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:34:29 No.48222491 Report

Quoted By: >>48222495 >>48222579

>>48216876
How does it stand without legs

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:35:29 No.48222495 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222491
It stands on it's massive cock

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:49:00 No.48222579 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222491
It's a snake

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:50:12 No.48222583 Report

Quoted By: >>48222626

>>48222483
Lvl 14 0+ SpA Poliwag Bubble vs. Lvl 14 0 HP / 0 SpD Onix: 52-64 (67.5 - 83.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Even STAB 4x water wouldn't be enough to OHKO it before it hits you like a fucking train with 70% Rock Throw in the Remakes. And that is calculated with 0 IVs across the board on onix and max IVs on poliwag.

If Brock rolled the right nature and IVs he could still obliterate any water type earlymon with fucking rock throw and tank any attack to sweep your team.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:54:09 No.48222605 Report

Quoted By:

If steelix wasn't a trade evolution people wouldn't be complaining

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 14:57:21 No.48222626 Report

Quoted By: >>48222653

>>48222583
Ok, then just nerf it, for any Kanto games. Make it actually viable and as strong as it's design would suggest, for any games where you don't fight Onix in the earlygame

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:03:56 No.48222651 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219267
I think it would be better if boss pokemon like gym leader mons got their own stat distributions, so the battle feels unique and pokemon like Onix or Floatzel can be viable in game team members instead of shitmons doomed to mediocrity by being given the role of story boss.

I've been saying this here since gen V, but every time I post this, I get shit for it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:04:23 No.48222652 Report

Quoted By: >>48222700

>>48222483
>Nerf it for the remakes, then buff it again, after the remakes

Why make so many unnecessary stat changes to this shitmon that can evolve anyway just to please its autistically retarded fanbase that can't understand how it's supposed to be an early game boss?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:04:30 No.48222653 Report

Quoted By: >>48222678 >>48222692 >>48222746 >>48227791

>>48222626
You don't seem to understand how base stats and early gyms can impact the game relative to the tools available at the start.

This is why Whitney is so notorious due to have a mon with incredibly high stats a Fully Evolved mon that completely dumps on earlymon. This coupled with its typing and lack of fighting types / fighting moves makes it daughting to take advantage of, especially for younger players.
And even for experienced players, certain mechanics weren't even known when the game launched (lack of special/physical split leaving many in the dark as to why their Gengar's shadow ball sucks ass).

Having a first Gym Fully Evolved mon have insane base stats completely dumps on the player. Onix is a Not fully evolved pokemon designed for a specific reason. Deal with it and appreciate Steelix. Nobody is asking for Ivysaur buffs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:06:05 No.48222661 Report

Quoted By: >>48227747

>>48219267
This.

I swear Onix's fanbase is more obnoxious and retarded than Flygon's and Dragonair's combined.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:10:06 No.48222678 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222653
Reminds me of this fan game where the guy made the first gym dragon type and gave the leaders ace dragon rage

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:12:33 No.48222692 Report

Quoted By: >>48224474

>>48222653
That's why I say nerf Onix for any Kanto games, you retarded nigger

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:14:08 No.48222700 Report

Quoted By: >>48222790

>>48222652
Because a 20ft boulder snake shouldn't have stats lower than a fucking tiny-ass spider

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:17:47 No.48222724 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210380

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:20:53 No.48222746 Report

Quoted By: >>48222794 >>48222872 >>48224536

>>48222653
Whitney's Miltank isn't even that hard. You don't even need any Fighting-Types to defeat it. Pokemon like Geodude and Gastly resist or are outright immune to Miltank's attacks, while Pokemon such as Flaaffy, Bayleef and Butterfree can cripple it with status conditions

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:29:14 No.48222790 Report

Quoted By: >>48222797

>>48222700
Doesn't matter, both are NFEmons.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:29:44 No.48222794 Report

Quoted By: >>48222801

>>48222746
Fairly positive miltank outspeeds most of those examples

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:30:16 No.48222797 Report

Quoted By: >>48222863 >>48222864

>>48222790
So is Scyther. Yet, it's stats aren't total dogshit

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:31:24 No.48222801 Report

Quoted By: >>48222822

>>48222794
Doesn't matter. It just needs to be able to take hits from Miltank's attacks, to cripple it or chip it away with it's own attacks to kill it

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:34:43 No.48222822 Report

Quoted By: >>48222838

>>48222801
And you think that those lvl 15l/16 pokemon are going to do that?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:35:11 No.48222831 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
>pokemon that changes wether you like it or not
holy shit soul. Some people would be annoyed but it is S-S-S-SOUL.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:36:11 No.48222838 Report

Quoted By: >>48222862

>>48222822
Against a lvl 16 Miltank with Stomp as it's strongest move, sure

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:36:37 No.48222844 Report

Quoted By: >>48223266

>>48210460
I came to believe they realized kanto mons were overbuffed, and just didn't want to repeat the "this is the best one of the typing" trope.

They wanted you to actually struggle a bit trought the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:38:56 No.48222862 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222838
Stomp flinches.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:39:00 No.48222863 Report

Quoted By: >>48222874

>>48222797
Scyther isn't the first boss's ace.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:39:00 No.48222864 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222797
Scyther's BST is the same as Scizor's

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:39:09 No.48222865 Report

Quoted By:

>>48218075
literally why

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:39:59 No.48222872 Report

Quoted By: >>48222946 >>48222986

>>48222746
Nobody said Whitney wasn't beatable or didn't have options in the game at that point, but how many kids and even inexperienced players whited out to her is because its an early game fully evolved mon with great base stats.

The stats she employs with it are just the icing on top that make her a very difficult boss based on a lot of factors people wouldn't know for years
>Milk drink PP + Physical special splits
>Rollout getting stronger every turn to snowball damage and punish switch in, kills ghosts
>STAB Stomp (BP 70 in the early game) with flinch
>Attract to shit on your starter who 9/10 is male

Whitney was a massive difficulty spike and tried to fit too many learning moments for the player into one
- Teaching new infatuation status
- Teaching new recovery moves
- Teaching the importance of type coverage

This is made worse given the first 2 gyms are Bird and Bug which are a cake walk, especially when Scyther run FURRY CUTTER.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:40:11 No.48222874 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222863
Doesn't matter. Onix exists separately from Brock

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:51:07 No.48222946 Report

Quoted By: >>48222986 >>48223053

>>48222872
>The games should never be difficult because think of da kids
Also
>STAB Stomp (BP 70 in the early game) with flinch
Was Stomp nerfed at some point? Wasn't it always 60 base power?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 15:55:50 No.48222986 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222946
>>48222872
It's 65 with 100 accuracy

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 16:06:07 No.48223053 Report

Quoted By: >>48225392 >>48225432

>>48222946
Well its the 3rd gym in a rushed game. If you never played RBY and picked up GSC, or were just a kid in general, you probably got the shit stomped and rolled out of you by Whitney because she was made to be a difficulty jump, but was WAY to high from the prior 2 due to the mechanics of the game.

Mud-slap hack can only do so much in the first gym for shitmon

Fury Cutter Scyther and lower base stat bugmon are a cakewalk

GF probably thought "Oh well they're 2 badges in I think they are ready for a challenge." but didn't realize they hadn't even stimulated you or taught you any real strat other than accuracy hax at that point.

GSC as its own game a VERY poorly designed at teaching anything about the games base mechanics and fails completely in teaching the new ones.
>Steel is a late gym that is completely out of context
>There is no Dark type gym or trainers
>No gym to show new Special Attack / Defense Split

Basically, if you didn't learn shit in RBY, you're fucked walking into GSC. And even then, the learning curve is breakneck.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 16:32:18 No.48223266 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222844
>Gen 1 Pokemon were broken so Gen 2 Pokemon had to suffer
So basically, the entire Johto region got Porygon'd except Porygon reaps the benefits of KANTO-shilling while Johto mons will be stuck as the most usless in the entire franchise forever

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 18:25:56 No.48224099 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210728
Summer should be normal grass like the original.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:17:12 No.48224474 Report

Quoted By: >>48224484

>>48222692
What's more reasonable, just using the buffed evolution of the Pokemon that was created to alleviate the exact problem you retards are complaining about or creating a unique special case just for Onix where it has buffed stats in half the games for no reason?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:18:40 No.48224484 Report

Quoted By: >>48224578

>>48224474
>half of the games are kanto
Based retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:25:39 No.48224536 Report

Quoted By: >>48224567

>>48222746
>Pokemon like Geodude and Gastly resist or are outright immune to Miltank's attacks, while Pokemon such as Flaaffy, Bayleef and Butterfree can cripple it with status conditions
In HGSS Miltank has Scrappy and Lum Berry, so it hits Ghastly and cures its own status (and will kill any of those status dealers if they try to spend the two turns to get through the Lum). Geodude walls Miltank pretty well but unless you get lucky with Magnitude RNG it'll ultimately get whittled down by Rollout and/or Stomp Flinches since Miltank has Recovery.

Without overleveling or abusing attack lowering conditions you're not beating Whitney's Miltank without throwing at least a few team members at it, and even then you can still lose if you just have some bad luck with Rollout.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:26:53 No.48224551 Report

Quoted By: >>48224639 >>48224808

>>48210460
>Feraligatr
>Crobat
>Azumarill
>Quagsire
>Slowking
>Scizor
>Heracross
>Skarmory
>Kingdra
>Blissey
>Raikou
>Suicune
>Tyranitar
>Lugia
>Ho-Oh
All of these are genuinely good. Plus a bunch of others got evolutions that made them good:
>Togetic
>Gligar
>Sneasel
>Piloswine

Not to mention that Xatu, Politoed, Ambipom, Yanmega, Espeon, Umbreon, Honchkrow, Mismagius, Forretress, Steelix, Mantine, Porygon2 and Porygon-Z, Smeargle and Entei aren't too bad either.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:29:21 No.48224567 Report

Quoted By:

>>48224536
HGSS has Brick Break Heracross, making Whitney even more of a breeze. Heracross fucking destroys Miltank, and actually makes it sense that Whitney starts crying once you kill her

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:31:08 No.48224578 Report

Quoted By: >>48224599

>>48224484
It doesn't matter whether it's a single game or 99% of them. Giving a mon variable stats like that is fucking stupid.

Onix is designed as an early game shitmon and always has been. Accept it and just use Steelix, at least it actually has a decent and useable evolution unlike Pidgeotto, Nosepass, or most of the other first gym Aces.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:33:39 No.48224599 Report

Quoted By:

>>48224578
>Onix is designed as an early game shitmon and always has been
An earlygame shitmon shouldn't have a design like Onix's. Give Onix a pre-evolution, if you wanna be that autistic about Brock having an earlygame shitmon as an ace

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 19:39:15 No.48224639 Report

Quoted By:

>>48224551
There needs to be a graph that actually shows the competitive viability of each gen. Gen 2 pokemon might not be as weak as everyone says, its just seems weaker because the ones that are complete garbage: (unnecessary babies, unown, Game Freak intentionally making 2 or the starters unusable, Delibird, etc)

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 20:04:48 No.48224808 Report

Quoted By: >>48224823

>>48224551
Gligar and Porygon2 are good with eviolite. Murkrow is pretty good with Prankster, and a decent mixed attacker, faster than its evo. Also I like putting eviolite on Togetic, Piloswine, Misdreavus as well but they aren't as viable in compfag environments. Sneasel is pretty strong too after the physical/special split, ignoring Weavile.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 20:06:31 No.48224823 Report

Quoted By:

>>48224808
>Sneasel is pretty strong too after the physical/special split, ignoring Weavile.
Sneasel actually has a niche in VGC, as a fast Ice-Type with a better matchup against Landorus-T than it's evolution Weavile, due to Inner Focus granting Intimidate-immunity

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 20:24:44 No.48224985 Report

Quoted By: >>48226641

Why is this T-Rex so shit?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 20:56:33 No.48225215 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222401
Yeah, but Crawdaunt hits way harder. It hits hard enough to bust open Toxapex and Ferrothorn.
>+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 304-359 (100 - 118%) -- guaranteed OHKO
>+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Ferrothorn: 450-530 (127.8 - 150.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Also, while Crawdaunt is frailer, it's not half bad on the physical side. It can take a resisted or neutral hit
>252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Crawdaunt: 186-220 (69.6 - 82.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

And Garchomp gets the 2HKO on both Feraligatr and Crawdaunt

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 21:20:36 No.48225392 Report

Quoted By:

>>48223053
Steel and Dark are types just like Fire and Water are types. It's not as if new players are going to be flabbergasted by Jasmine anymore than Chuck just because Steel is new. You just test out different moves and find out through trial and error what works and what doesn't, just as you would against the other gym leaders.

And why would you need a gym to show off the new split? You see attack and defense, and you see special attack and special defense in the stat screen. Why would you need a tutorial for this? The flaw is that the game doesn't tell you what types are special and which are physical, just like gen 1 and 3.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 21:26:03 No.48225432 Report

Quoted By: >>48225483

>>48223053
GameFreak has never been good at explaining its mechanics to players. Natures and the new EV system were introduced in gen 3 and the game did its best to hide how any of it worked. It took until gen 4 HGSS until natures highlighted affected stats (still hidden in DPPt), and until 6 until you could actually see your EV spread in the stat screen. Even then, you still don't have ingame resources to explain how you get certain EVs, pass down natures, etc.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 21:35:10 No.48225483 Report

Quoted By:

>>48225432
As it should be. EV's should remain a hidden mechanic

alieno

alieno Fri 17 Sep 2021 22:46:55 No.48225904 Report

Quoted By: >>48225973

>>48219485
imagine unironically wasting time to post this holy mental illness

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 22:52:45 No.48225939 Report

Quoted By:

>>48219485
>Furret doesn't need a buff.
Screw you

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:00:28 No.48225973 Report

Quoted By:

>>48225904
SwShit fags are mental illness incarnate. What else is new.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:16:59 No.48226061 Report

Quoted By: >>48226069 >>48226641

>>48210380
Regional Form
Cyrstal Onix
>rock/water
>high spedef and special attack
>gets power gem

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:18:00 No.48226069 Report

Quoted By: >>48226078

>>48226061
Give it an actual buff, nigger. Not a regional form

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:20:21 No.48226078 Report

Quoted By: >>48226147

>>48226069
It counts

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:35:56 No.48226147 Report

Quoted By:

>>48226078
No it doesn't, faglord

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:51:52 No.48226258 Report

Quoted By: >>48226273

>>48221747
Problem?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 17 Sep 2021 23:54:05 No.48226273 Report

Quoted By: >>48226460

>>48226258
Cranidos is just an inverse of Onix/Nosepass
>high attack
>shit everything else
>gets btfo by grass/water
Unova has harder first gyms

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 00:11:21 No.48226372 Report

Quoted By: >>48227076

>>48210728
>>48219765
Drayano made it op with 100 attack along with sucker punch and moxie, essentially give it a choice band, revenge kill once and ggwp

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 00:13:33 No.48226386 Report

Quoted By: >>48226641 >>48226963

>>48210380

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 00:22:48 No.48226460 Report

Quoted By:

>>48226273
Cranidos has decent bulk, for the point of the game you first fight it at

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 00:45:06 No.48226641 Report

Quoted By: >>48226728

>>48224985
Use Garchomp you whiny faggot and teach it Stone Edge. There's your Fagrantrum. Flygonfags and Tyrantrumfags are such insufferable trannies that refuse to use popular Pokémon like Pikachu lmfao.

>>48226061
Crystals are not gems.

>>48226386
Play the game or I'll give your mother a facial with my penis.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 00:58:16 No.48226728 Report

Quoted By:

>>48226641
>Use Garchomp you whiny faggot and teach it Stone Edge
Garchomp isn't Rock-Type. Meaning, no STAB

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 01:43:37 No.48226963 Report

Quoted By:

>>48226386
Should be a physical-attacker

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 02:12:28 No.48227076 Report

Quoted By: >>48227086

>>48226372
Love Drayano. He even buffs Unown though not to the extent I'd like. The only nitpick is he falls into the same favoritism towards certain "neglected" pokemon like Flygon and turns them into a pseudo legendary lol

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 02:14:40 No.48227084 Report

Quoted By:

How would you guys feel about an item that boosts an unevolved pokemon's offensive and speed stats by 1.5? Like the inverse eviolite, covering attack/spatk/speed.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 02:15:02 No.48227086 Report

Quoted By: >>48227096

>>48227076
I'm still mostly mixed on Drayano, but he still by far does the best Pokemon buffs/reworks, out of every major romhack/romhacker. It's at least pretty neat to be able to use Dragon-Type Charizard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 02:16:58 No.48227096 Report

Quoted By: >>48227201

>>48227086
Is there a place that shows all the buffs and changes Drayano did?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 02:37:43 No.48227201 Report

Quoted By:

>>48227096
Drayano hacks normally come with documentation you can find online. Though, you do have to search around a little, because Drayano's a prick

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 03:59:43 No.48227558 Report

Quoted By:

>>48210671
Make him ground type as well so he gets STAB EP

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:14:26 No.48227615 Report

Quoted By: >>48227658

>>48210380
Onix new stats and ability

Onix
Pure power
130 HP
90 Attack
160 Defense
1 special attack
160 special defense
143 speed

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:25:32 No.48227658 Report

Quoted By:

>>48227615
>Turn Onix into faster Regirock
>Minmaxxed offensive base stats
Fuck off, retard.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:41:46 No.48227747 Report

Quoted By:

>>48222661
There was, like, 3 of us, and we were content to be sad and then these threads became the current forced meme.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:44:04 No.48227760 Report

Quoted By: >>48230039

>>48210380
You need to redesign it from the ground up to really dodge the rocky footing it's on.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:51:06 No.48227791 Report

Quoted By: >>48231561

>>48222653
Onix was fully evolved originally you retard zoomer

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 04:57:36 No.48227827 Report

Quoted By: >>48229903

>>48219069
>No, you evo fags need to die. Stop wanting an evolution on everything for fucks sake.
Dude chill out
>If you had your way, a new generation of pokemon would just be pure cross gen evos, making all previous pokemon obsolete, and introducing no new lines.
That's a big fucking stretch. All I was saying that some of the mega evolutions should've been crossgen evod (well the ones that had 1 stage evolutions or didn't evolve prior. Besides people would still use the previous evolution anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 13:43:19 No.48229903 Report

Quoted By:

>>48227827
Both crossgen Evos and mega Evos are gay as shit

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 14:13:03 No.48230039 Report

Quoted By:

>>48227760
>to really dodge the rocky footing it's on.
Hahahahahahahaha
I geddit

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 16:56:44 No.48230916 Report

Quoted By:

She's the only non-viable gorilla-arm dragon

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:08:06 No.48231007 Report

Quoted By: >>48231050

>>48211018
Anon I love all these ideas, especially the miltank pre- evo, would be cute

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:13:38 No.48231050 Report

Quoted By: >>48231109

>>48231007
Regional Forms should never be used as buffs

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:18:09 No.48231082 Report

Quoted By: >>48231110

>>48220258
Ariados is one of the pokemon I want GF to give attention to in a new game, like a regional form or G-Max, something. Its just so cool.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:21:25 No.48231109 Report

Quoted By:

>>48231050
I never mentioned regional forms, I mentioned pre-evos, which I wouldn't even want as a buff, just as a cute way to tie miltank and tauros together

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:21:30 No.48231110 Report

Quoted By: >>48231169 >>48231210 >>48231924

>>48231082
Ariados and Ledian should recieve gender-exclusive evolutions
Female Ariados's evolve, while Male Ledian's evolve
>picrel is how I would want a Ledian evo to look like. Make it Bug/Fighting, and give it Skill Link and Iron Fist (buffed to 1.5x damage, instead of 1.2x)

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:29:57 No.48231169 Report

Quoted By:

>>48231110
Either your idea or Kamen rider are obvious evos to Ledian, would be cool. And the ariados spider-lady evo that the tanuki anon posted is what I would want too

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:35:45 No.48231210 Report

Quoted By:

>>48231110
Instead of Iron Fist, the Ledian evo could get its own signature ability that makes every Punch move hit 4 times. It fits with its dex entries of using quantity over quality when punching. Also, it would allow it to spread some of its stats to its defenses/bulk/speed while still having a decent offensive presence.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 17:55:04 No.48231348 Report

Quoted By:

>>48220398
>Cranidos is the first boss in gen 4 with 125 attack and no dual weakness.
Yes, and gen 4 is shit. What's your point?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 18:30:47 No.48231561 Report

Quoted By: >>48232071

>>48227791
yeah a fully evolved pokemon designed SPECIFICALLY to be the first gym boss to teach you the games mechanics and be difficult relative to all the shit trainers you faced up to that point.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Ledian.png, 362KiB, 994x447

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 19:23:52 No.48231924 Report

Quoted By: >>48232082

>>48231110
Ledian has almost the same base stat total as Swadloon, it deserves an evolution with at least +100 base stats to equal Levanny.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 19:41:25 No.48232071 Report

Quoted By:

>>48231561
That argument falls apart, once you realise one of the final bosses you face also uses two of the same boss enemy you fought in the first boss

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 19:42:29 No.48232082 Report

Quoted By:

>>48231924
>Huge Power Ledian degeneracy

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sat 18 Sep 2021 20:15:00 No.48232251 Report

Quoted By:

Give them Shell Smash via Applin, a few stat boosts and increasing Grav Apple and Apple Acid's 80 BP to 90 and they could be quite decent

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