/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #51455478

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Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:23:48 No.51455478 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>51455489 >>51455502 >>51455514 >>51455531 >>51455565 >>51455619 >>51455662 >>51457882 >>51457993 >>51458422 >>51458737 >>51460097 >>51460580 >>51460808

>elemental punches in gen 1 were exclusive to jynx/electabuzz/magmar and hitmonchan
>jynx, electabuzz and magmar all learn moves that objectively outclass the punches because they're special attacks
>hitmonchan can't make good use of the punches because his special stat is complete shit
really, what WERE they thinking

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:25:39 No.51455489 Report

Quoted By: >>51455530 >>51465294

>>51455478
They were thinking about what children would think was cool, not what some metagaming fucktard would think was or wasn't good 30 years after the fact.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:25:43 No.51455490 Report

Quoted By: >>51463000

Probably the RP aspect of the RPG for immersion's sake.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:28:06 No.51455502 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
the punches are level up moves and not TMs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:29:50 No.51455514 Report

Quoted By: >>51455531 >>51456402 >>51458020

>>51455478
They didn't want Hitmonchan to be able to OHKO CHARIZARD with ThunderPunch

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:32:31 No.51455530 Report

Quoted By: >>51460580

>>51455489
no kid is gonna think hitmonchan is cool when he hits like a fucking wet noodle

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:32:36 No.51455531 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
Serious Answer:
It's likely that the people at GF setting up learnsets weren't fully aware that there was no Physical/Special Split, thereby they thought Hitmonchan would hit pretty damn hard with these moves, which in Gen 4 and onward, he does.
In short: Poor communication
Meme Answer: >>51455514

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:38:11 No.51455565 Report

Quoted By: >>51455573 >>51455579 >>51456767 >>51462820

>>51455478
Thats why physical/special split is still the best thing to happen in Pokemon. The only thing that comes near to it is the introduction of Abilities

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:39:41 No.51455573 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455565
Fr fr no cap straight bussin. People who hate the physical special split are mentally retarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:40:39 No.51455579 Report

Quoted By: >>51455601 >>51455607 >>51455642 >>51456447 >>51456822 >>51460162

>>51455565
>power creep is the best thing to happen in Pokemon
zoomer moment

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:44:17 No.51455601 Report

Quoted By: >>51455610

>>51455579
Phys/Spec split didn't cause powercreep. Shillmon Pandering did.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:45:12 No.51455607 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455579
You can keep playing that Pokemon Yellow, Gruncle Jeff. No one is stopping you. Oh no no there's no boogeyman hiding behind the door to steal your 25 year old moldy cartridge either.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:45:38 No.51455610 Report

Quoted By: >>51455642 >>51456405 >>51456822 >>51459999

>>51455601
>Phys/Spec split didn't cause powercreep
Yes it did.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:46:35 No.51455619 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
They were thinking "let's make a cool monster collecting RPG that will likely be a cult favorite"

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:50:46 No.51455642 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455579
>>51455610
>filtered by powercreep
Why all boomers have low IQ like this, guys? No wonder the world turned into a literal cesspool right now

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 02:54:34 No.51455662 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
Tackle isn’t any pokemons best move either, ig it shouldn’t exist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 05:38:24 No.51456393 Report

Quoted By:

>jynx, electabuzz and magmar all learn moves that objectively outclass the punches because they're special attacks
GF balanced RB around the single player. By the time they learned the punches, most Pokemon of their types would learn weak ass moves with 10-35 less BP unless you already used the stronger one-use TMs. They're solid if you wasted them like an idiot or just wanted a second mon with Ice/Electric/Fire attacks. The real problem is being outclassed by the fucking birds.
>hitmonchan can't make good use of the punches because his special stat is complete shit
Because it's the punching Pokemon and someone must've thought it was cool to put in. Nearly every move he gets by leveling up is a punch.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 05:41:48 No.51456402 Report

Quoted By: >>51457747

>>51455514
is there a rock punch move yet?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 05:43:09 No.51456405 Report

Quoted By: >>51456437 >>51460160

>>51455610
>making more pokemon viable created powercreep
Now THIS is zoomerposting

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 05:52:02 No.51456437 Report

Quoted By: >>51458954

>>51456405
Not that anon, but the thing about the split is that it affected everyone, so both shitmons and Game Freak's Golden Children got better making it a lateral chance for the most part. The thing about the split is that it made it easy to make shillmons more broken since you can just put all its offense stats in one basket and give it a broken movepool based on that one stats, that's why you get bullshit like Cinderace.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 05:55:09 No.51456447 Report

Quoted By: >>51456504 >>51456767 >>51458757 >>51460151

>>51455579
I don't give a shit. It's gay as fuck how many pokemon are just cucked out of coverage moves for entire types because one of their offensive stats was too low.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 06:08:25 No.51456504 Report

Quoted By:

>>51456447
NTA but certain Pokémon are still cucked out of coverage moves even after the split.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 07:08:19 No.51456767 Report

Quoted By:

>>51456447
>>51455565
gen 3 is the best balance and replayability ever achieved in a pokemon metagame

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 07:22:48 No.51456822 Report

Quoted By: >>51458757 >>51460151

>>51455579
>>51455610
Get a load of this retard who thinks there would be no power creep if not for the split

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 12:36:25 No.51457747 Report

Quoted By: >>51465189

>>51456402
Nope. Reading the move descriptions, the closest that could be considered for interpretation as a rock punch is Accelerock. Majority of the others describe rocks being thrown or hurled at the opponents. You'd think there would be at least one that describes a body part hardening into solid rock and striking the opponent. Why won't they describe body parts hardening into solid rock?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 12:48:35 No.51457799 Report

Quoted By:

The trio learned the punches before the better moves, so they're a temporary thing. That's like complaining about Bulbasaur learning vine whip when he has razor leaf.

But also Electabuzz doesn't learn Thunderbolt by level up (and thunder is a shit move), so if you wanted to use your thunderbolt TM on someone else then Thunderpunch is a decent move for Buzz.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO hitmonchan_gen1.png, 19KiB, 558x385

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 13:03:25 No.51457882 Report

Quoted By: >>51458400

>>51455478
>HP: 50
>Special: 35
>KO'ed by a fucking water gun
What the hell they were thinking?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 13:28:44 No.51457993 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
Gen 1 was straight up made by a small indy team of literally who’s. It’s a miracle the thing even worked and balance was way out of their thoughts

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 13:34:50 No.51458020 Report

Quoted By: >>51458584

>>51455514
Rent free. Mentally ill.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 14:50:47 No.51458400 Report

Quoted By: >>51460663

>>51457882
man, doduo and togebliss have seen better days

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO heres your elite trainer bro.jpg, 67KiB, 1024x576

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 14:54:56 No.51458422 Report

Quoted By: >>51461988 >>51462411

>>51455478
Genwun GF were pretty retarded and still learning how their own game worked.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1661096080078141.jpg, 970KiB, 1080x1979

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 15:31:56 No.51458584 Report

Quoted By: >>51458983

>>51458020
TPC is mentality ill, I agree

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 15:59:16 No.51458737 Report

Quoted By: >>51458765

>>51455478
There are quite a few Gen 1 hate threads popping up recently. Why is that?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 16:02:58 No.51458757 Report

Quoted By: >>51465196

>>51456447
>>51456822

Lots of Pokémon got nothing from the split. Several Pokémon that were already good got much better, some Pokémon that were good got nerfed, but the majority of Pokémon that weren't good remained not good.

Power creep was definitely kicked off with the split.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 16:04:56 No.51458765 Report

Quoted By:

>>51458737
Discord realized it gives more (You)s than gen 5 hate threads.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 16:38:36 No.51458954 Report

Quoted By:

>>51456437
Only non retarded coomzoomer in this pathetic thread
If gamefreak weren't dumb fucks they could've prevented powercreep despite the split, which is in itself a good mechanic
Would it be easier for brainlets to understand what powercreep is if Mewtwo and Snorlax were introduced in gen 2?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 16:45:01 No.51458983 Report

Quoted By:

>>51458584
>BUT TPC!!!
Like clockwork. You are mentally ill, regardless of TPC

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 19:50:14 No.51459999 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455610
It didn't directly cause power creep, but it did happen in the same generation that every type got a 120+bp move.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 19:53:09 No.51460013 Report

Quoted By:

>mfw zoomers think gen 1 was designed with pokemon being a franchise in mind
There were 0 expectations for these games to be more than 1 or 2 game series.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 20:11:08 No.51460097 Report

Quoted By: >>51460663

>>51455478
>OP talks about Hitmonchan
>post Doduo taking a shit
I don't understand…

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 20:22:16 No.51460151 Report

Quoted By: >>51463072

>>51456822
That's not even remotely what the post implies, ESL.

>>51456447
Nothing is stopping you from using coverage moves except for your own autism.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 20:23:18 No.51460160 Report

Quoted By: >>51460670

>>51456405
>>making more pokemon viable
Name three Pokemon that became more viable after the split. I'll gladly wait.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 20:23:37 No.51460162 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455579
Not this autist again

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 21:38:59 No.51460580 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
Hitmonchan has no excuse, but Jynx, Electabuzz, and Magmar learned their respective punches in the early 30s-40s, while they didn't learn the stronger move of that type until the early-mid 50s. And TMs didn't grow on trees in those days. So that's a good stretch of the campaign where they'd be very useful to the player.

>>51455530
Yeah, this. When I was a kid, I initially thought it was an extremely cool gimmick for Hitmonchan to have all three elemental punches, but I was immediately turned off when I realized that he was throwing pillow fists.

Shit, it's not like his Special had to be 120 or whatever, but it's got one of the worst Special stats in the game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 21:42:52 No.51460614 Report

Quoted By:

Hear me out. Elemental kicks.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 20200604_231744_6BC7A511-FA42-48 (...).jpg, 30KiB, 504x504

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 21:52:31 No.51460663 Report

Quoted By:

>>51458400
>>51460097
not even the right sprite you niggers

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 21:53:31 No.51460670 Report

Quoted By: >>51462428

>>51460160
Viable in what way? Declare your standards of viability or forever remain a faggot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 15 Sep 2022 22:15:39 No.51460808 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455478
Pretty much everything that's dumb or illogical about Gen I can easily be explained by Game Freak focusing more on getting the games to work at all than stuff like balance or movesets. Keep in mind that when Game Freak originally made these games, they'd done something that nobody else had ever done before.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 01:39:33 No.51461988 Report

Quoted By:

>>51458422
Slowbro's moves are appallingly bad

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:02:19 No.51462411 Report

Quoted By: >>51462416

>>51458422
>I understand the game better than the ones who literally created it!

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:02:57 No.51462416 Report

Quoted By: >>51462445

>>51462411
Do you think that's an uncommon thing?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:04:51 No.51462428 Report

Quoted By: >>51462673

>>51460670
Rose to OU after never being there before.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:08:07 No.51462445 Report

Quoted By: >>51462458 >>51462484

>>51462416
Dunno, but saying that the then-passionate group of 20 somethings who made this incredible game for the Game Boy didn't understand their game more than people with 26 years of hindsight is quite pretencious.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:09:43 No.51462458 Report

Quoted By:

>>51462445
The original statement that made you so butthurt was "still learning how their own game worked.", which from the perspective of someone with 26 years of hindsight is absolutely, objectively true.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:13:29 No.51462484 Report

Quoted By: >>51462498

>>51462445
Do I need to dig up the Aegislash quote?
Most trainers in gen 1 just used level up movesets. I think they were allowed one Pokemon with a custom moveset.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:14:57 No.51462498 Report

Quoted By: >>51462507

>>51462484
Well, yes but they had space limitations. Red and Green ran on a 512 KB cartridge

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:16:13 No.51462507 Report

Quoted By: >>51462598

>>51462498
Nothing was stopping them from using a 1mb cart.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:30:19 No.51462598 Report

Quoted By:

>>51462507
They had a low budget.
They had even less space before Miyamoto offered them more.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 03:44:47 No.51462673 Report

Quoted By: >>51462809 >>51463053 >>51465082

>>51462428
So that's just kind of retarded because tier shifts will happen naturally as options as a whole widen, not just due to any single change to the system. A lot of Pokemon see tier shifts up and down between games. This is also ignoring the fact that Gen 1 is effectively its own thing and shouldn't really be compared to Gen 2+ just due to how mechanics worked so vastly differently, or how Gen 2 having a different EV system means it shouldn't be compared to Gen 3+. But to entertain you, Scizor never hit OU before Gen 4 (was UUBL) meaning it rose to OU. Kingdra is in the same boat, as well as Ninjask and Smeargle. So all of these Pokemon were clearly too strong for UU but after the split suddenly were able to be picked for OU properly because it was able to actually compete.
Using a saner comparison between Gen 3 and 4 where the biggest mechanical difference was the split, the list expands to Dragonite (UUBL in Gen 3), Machamp (UUBL in Gen 3), Tentacruel (UU in Gen 3), Umbreon (UUBL in Gen 3), Vaporeon (UUBL),
>inb4 "UUBL is basically OU so it doesn't count"

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 04:21:42 No.51462809 Report

Quoted By: >>51465170

>>51462673
>Dragonite
because (in big part thanks to the split) dragon shillmons started to become so strong that they were the first non-legends authentically banned to ubers. ultimately a negative consequence of the split for the game as a whole. nothing reliably walled them anymore. he would remain uubl forever if salamence were never banned, now hes the premier dragon type.
>Machamp
almost nothing to do with the split. he got no-guard. would still be ou without split
>tentacruel
almost nothing to do with split, he got toxic spikes. nearly identical attacking stats making his sludgebomb hit 3% harder. not really a true "ou" either, nidoqueen is a better example here people that play the tier will know. not even sure if hed be banworthy in uu. a 1% presence in ou.
>umbreon
nothing to do with special split. eevee fans jumping the gun or something overrating him. identical attacking stats, he got payback with or without split. not even sure what hes doing in ou because i cant imagine him being banworthy oppressive in uu. a 0.1% presence in ou.

real examples:
sneasel (just a mistake in design, was never going to be good and needed the evolution)
mostly other fire, ice and dark types. they got buffed in general but the type itself was still so shit by design that they still fell from usage in other forms of power creep. split is irrelevant here and they would never be good with or without it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 04:25:39 No.51462820 Report

Quoted By: >>51462827

>>51455565
It’s surprising it took them 3 gens to implement it. Why should bite be special?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 04:28:27 No.51462827 Report

Quoted By:

>>51462820
Funny enough Bite wasn't special in Gen1, it became special in Gen 2 due to becoming Dark. I'm assuming the only reason Dark was special was to be a counterpart to Ghost which was apparently physical in GEn 1.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 05:14:03 No.51463000 Report

Quoted By: >>51463070

>>51455490
Clearly they didn't think that way either. The only option left is that they literally did not think about anything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 05:30:46 No.51463053 Report

Quoted By: >>51465170

>>51462673
>Scizor never hit OU before Gen 4
wow you're right it sure did suck for scizor in gen 3 when it had to use special bug and steel attacks, the split totally saved it!

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 05:36:39 No.51463070 Report

Quoted By:

>>51463000
If they didn't think at all then how is it that you are on a board dedicated to the franchise that began with these games

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 05:37:06 No.51463072 Report

Quoted By:

>>51460151
Nothing is stopping you from using Ice Punch Gengar still except for your own autism.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 11:31:03 No.51465082 Report

Quoted By: >>51465170

>>51462673
Scizor didn't hit OU until Platinum, when it got Bullet Punch.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 11:38:29 No.51465170 Report

Quoted By:

>>51462809
I entirely agree with you, note where I called the other anon a retard for this criteria. I was just listing Pokemon that hit said shallow and thoughtless criteria.
>>51465082
Searching mid-gen changes is a bit trickier. So I gave the criteria the effort it deserved. Mostly pointing out the flaws.
>>51463053
Not part of the criteria retard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 11:40:06 No.51465189 Report

Quoted By:

>>51457747
Because that’s someone at Gamefreak’s fetish and they’ve seen how kinkshamed James Turner got for some of his designs

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 11:40:46 No.51465196 Report

Quoted By:

>>51458757
Explain why people complained about power creep in Gen 2, years before the split happened, retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 16 Sep 2022 11:51:43 No.51465294 Report

Quoted By:

>>51455489
No they weren't because Shitmonchan is OBJECTIVELY the worst fully-evolved Pokemon in RBY.

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