/vp/ - Pokémon » Thread #52896637

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Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:19:02 No.52896637 View View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>52896741 >>52896830 >>52896847 >>52896853 >>52896921 >>52898017 >>52898082 >>52900169 >>52900200 >>52900214 >>52900602 >>52901291 >>52902517 >>52904935 >>52905886 >>52906145 >>52908731

Why did all the battle formats introduced after double battles flop?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:20:39 No.52896649 Report

Quoted By: >>52896827 >>52897006

Rotation was just an awful idea
Also very jarring with the already garbage pixels

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:29:21 No.52896711 Report

Quoted By:

rotation was kind of confusing and I never got the hang of it
triple was great though because it was during weather wars so if you could just pile it on
this was the generation that gliscor was immortal in the sand

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:33:41 No.52896741 Report

Quoted By: >>52905401

>>52896637
Gen 4 and 5 were just unoriginal, unambitious rehashes of gen 3 that didn't even try to shake things up. Later gens realized that gimmicks mechanics that could be used in regular battles were better than formats that were themselves gimmicks.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:35:33 No.52896754 Report

Quoted By: >>52896769 >>52896824 >>52896879 >>52904863 >>52905327

Rotation sucked, it was just singles but without any penalties that switching normally has.
Triple battles were okay, but not as intuitive as double battles.
The wonder launcher just made stalling too strong.
Sky battles were a meme and caused irreparable damage to the series despite being wholly optional in their introduction.
Inverse battles didn't even support pvp.
Battle royale sucked because it ended when one person lost.
Did gen 8 even try to add anything new? Or was it just raids?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:37:42 No.52896769 Report

Quoted By: >>52896775 >>52898166

>>52896754
Flying pokemon using their wings in combat is not irreparable damage to the series

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO xatu-f.png, 3KiB, 120x120

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:38:47 No.52896775 Report

Quoted By: >>52896789 >>52896849 >>52898166

>>52896769
It is when they just awkwardly hover in place, or have been exclusively portrayed as not constantly flying previously.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:41:23 No.52896789 Report

Quoted By: >>52896798 >>52898166

>>52896775
That's not the fault of the sky battles when the majority of the flying pokemon have flapping animations.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO doobs.png, 459KiB, 1981x698

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:42:06 No.52896795 Report

Quoted By: >>52900114 >>52904811

doubles are a meme

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:42:40 No.52896798 Report

Quoted By: >>52896822 >>52898166

>>52896789
It is when Pokemon like Xatu or Skarmory have been grounded for every previous portrayal, but now just float above the ground with wings outstretched. Not even flapping them, just perpetually gliding with no movement.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:46:07 No.52896822 Report

Quoted By: >>52896831

>>52896798
Only a minority of them glide in place. Those specific few just represent a bad design choice rather than some sort of inherent flaw connected to sky battles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:46:25 No.52896824 Report

Quoted By: >>52896831

>>52896754
Irreparable damage…? For flapping wings/levitating? What a drama queen.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:46:50 No.52896827 Report

Quoted By: >>52896863 >>52897151

>>52896649
ok hardcore muh ps5 realistic graphics nerd

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO fuck this i'm out.gif, 3MiB, 352x403

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:47:36 No.52896830 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
they didn't flop, game freak just fucking outright refused to support them
inverse and triples would've been kino down the line

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:47:46 No.52896831 Report

Quoted By: >>52896852

>>52896822
No, it represents the animations being made shit in order to better fit into a gimmick battle type that existed for exactly one game and was completely optional. Thanks to TCP's laziness, those animations will never be properly updated.
>>52896824
>it's not damage unless it makes the game unplayable

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:50:51 No.52896847 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Rotation is hard to grasp initially.
>It basically is single but with aspects of doubles play.
>You can switch the normal way or you can rotate.
>Switching activates abilties that pop when you switch it in but rotation doesn't.
>Rotation does not reset conditions like confusion and bad poison, or reset Ability counters like Slow Start.
>Rotation adds more aspects of speed control into the game since rotation doesn't remove debuffs when rotating as well as letting you use say Tail Wind then rotate to another mon to do shit asap.
>Moves that only work on turn one such as Fake Out will be conserved until the user rotates in.
>Perish Song only counts down on the turn an afflicted Pokémon has been rotated in or stays in play.
>abilities and moves that announce their presence such as Mold Breaker and Air Balloon will not be shown if the Pokémon with them are sent out in the back.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:51:16 No.52896849 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896775
xatu should still hover above the ground with it's wings outstretched, but it should do so with it's body upright, as if it's not flying using it's wings, but it's psychic abilites. that's also the pose that makes it look the most like a totem pole.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:51:50 No.52896852 Report

Quoted By: >>52896873

>>52896831
Like I said, the gliders represent a minority of flying types that have normal flapping animations. There is nothing connected to sky battles that forces them to glide as opposed to flapping their wings.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:52:01 No.52896853 Report

Quoted By: >>52900242 >>52900263

>>52896637
I still think about the part in the new game where they fight a whole group of wild pokemon one at a time like 3 or 4 times instead of just doing a triple battle
Even more double battles would have been nice

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:54:04 No.52896863 Report

Quoted By: >>52907071

>>52896827
why even make this post

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:55:10 No.52896873 Report

Quoted By: >>52896910 >>52897174

>>52896852
They'd look like shit if they were flapping their wings as well. But it's even more awkward when they don't.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:55:24 No.52896874 Report

Quoted By:

i don't understand why people like triples. triples are fucking ass.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:55:56 No.52896879 Report

Quoted By: >>52896894

>>52896754
>Triple battles were okay, but not as intuitive as double battles.
Elaborate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:57:48 No.52896894 Report

Quoted By: >>52897146

>>52896879
Just in the way move targeting worked. There were a lot more rules than just "you either pick one target, or the move hits both automatically"

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 04:59:48 No.52896910 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896873
I think most flying types are better suited for flapping their wings in combat as it better reflects their ground type immunity. That said, Xatu should have always stayed on the ground just like how they did the same for Hawlucha, Delibird, and others as it better reflects his design that way. Him and Tropius. Others like Skarmory should flap.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO epic quest.jpg, 40KiB, 616x474

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 05:01:34 No.52896921 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Because Charles killed himself after being dumped for x-times so the art of triple and rotation battle died with him

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 05:13:12 No.52897006 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896649
>Rotation was just an awful idea
you got fooled a lot, didnt you? Every team i versused during that event would always rotate into type disadvantages. I havent lost one battle then

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 05:37:38 No.52897146 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896894
Considering triple battle were literally 2 double battles happening at the exact same time, I think that was intentional.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 05:38:51 No.52897151 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896827
based

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 05:43:00 No.52897174 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896873
>They'd look like shit if they were flapping their wings
Ah, so you're just supremely autistic. Good to know.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1611017372326.jpg, 816KiB, 825x1200

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 09:06:13 No.52897988 Report

Quoted By:

Too complex for kids, please understand.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 09:12:56 No.52898017 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
The average pokemon player is too smooth brained for doubles let alome triples

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 09:27:08 No.52898082 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Too complex for regular fans and even moreso for people who like competitive pokemon like smogon, hence why the hatred for gen5 as a whole, and as well as Masuda realizing the series should be dumbed down.

And it worked, gimmicks like Dynamax and Terastlization replaced convoluted mechanics like that, and people clamor for more as proven by the millions of sales of SV.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 09:48:06 No.52898166 Report

Quoted By: >>52898185 >>52898849

>>52896769
>>52896775
>>52896789
>>52896798
play the games. some of the terrible flying models have been changed to be grounded. well, i say some but i only really know of Tropius, which had one of the worst flying models, so there's hope more have changed/will change

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 09:52:44 No.52898185 Report

Quoted By:

>>52898166
>play SV
nah

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 11:27:33 No.52898530 Report

Quoted By: >>52898540 >>52901260

GameFreak wasn't brave enough to commit to them properly; instead of making them appear often they are used as gimmicks for a couple of battles.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 11:30:03 No.52898540 Report

Quoted By:

>>52898530
They committed to them the same way Hoenn committed to double battles. A gym used them everywhere and they’re scattered around the map.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 12:50:27 No.52898849 Report

Quoted By: >>52898876

>>52898166
SV only changes them for wild battles. Anything with a fixed camera uses the old 3DS animations.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 12:56:53 No.52898876 Report

Quoted By:

>>52898849
It depends on the mon, Tropius stands by default roaring moon and Charizard fly

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:19:49 No.52900114 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896795
This

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:26:00 No.52900169 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Rotatio battles would make the 3DS crash

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:29:17 No.52900200 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Genuinely think these were only phased out due to GF struggling with the hardware.
X&Y had triple battles and they ran like shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:30:05 No.52900214 Report

Quoted By: >>52900490

>>52896637
Doubles flopped. Just because it's shilled in VGC doesn't mean people like it. It's literally never featured in the games

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:33:52 No.52900242 Report

Quoted By: >>52900263

>>52896853
I miss how emerald and platinum had not only way more double battles (both story and trainers outside of dedicated pairs like twins) but you even had trainers who could be fought as either a double or a single depending on how you approached the trainer

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:37:12 No.52900263 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896853
>>52900242
I even forget doubles existed for most of SV.
No idea why they're so against doubles when its the VGC format

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 16:41:00 No.52900297 Report

Quoted By:

I loved triples because it allowed me to use my full in game team in the facilities.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 17:04:43 No.52900490 Report

Quoted By: >>52900497

>>52900214
>doubles is a flop because people play it where it actually matters instead of the retarded baby campaign where you do nothing but mindlessly click A twice every turn to win

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 17:05:34 No.52900497 Report

Quoted By: >>52900557

>>52900490
The only reason VGC is doubles is so games don't take 20 minutes and clog up their single-elimination bracket.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 17:13:57 No.52900557 Report

Quoted By: >>52904973 >>52908597

>>52900497
singles games don't take 20 minutes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 17:18:01 No.52900602 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Triple battles were ugly, also they introduce way too much variance to be more than just a gimmick.
I would have liked to have an inverted types competitive season though, that sounds fun once in a while.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 18:37:05 No.52901260 Report

Quoted By:

>>52898530
yeah, the only games that did try were colosseum and xd which were doggypoo otherwise.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 18:40:45 No.52901291 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Triples was fine but the consoles were going to melt with GF's inability to code

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 05 Jan 2023 21:10:52 No.52902517 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896637
Too high IQ for Pokémon fans

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 01:15:24 No.52904811 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896795
this png turned my opinion

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 01:22:24 No.52904863 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896754
Based and true.

Sky Battles and Gen 6 as a whole were entirely garbage and hot trash.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 01:22:58 No.52904868 Report

Quoted By: >>52905290

Aren't normal RPG battles with 3-5 guys on your side at once normally? Why did Pokémon turn out the way it did with 1v1 being the default?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 01:28:11 No.52904935 Report

Quoted By: >>52905472

>>52896637
Too many possible actions in a turn such that it becomes a complete guessing game
Single battle: 4 moves + up to 5 switch-ins: Up to 9 actions (before accounting for tera/dynamax/z-move)
Double battle: 4 possible moves on one of 3 targets twice, plus 8 switches (4 possible switches for each mon): Up to 32 actions
Not gonna do the math for triple/rotation but you can see what I'm getting at

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 01:31:58 No.52904973 Report

Quoted By: >>52906281

>>52900557
They do on cart

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:00:22 No.52905290 Report

Quoted By:

>>52904868
Pokémon’s battle system is so fucking slow and simple that it becomes overly cumbersome when any more than 2 Pokémon are on screen at a time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:03:43 No.52905327 Report

Quoted By: >>52905387

>>52896754
>Sky battles were a meme and caused irreparable damage to the series despite being wholly optional in their introduction.
I missed this gen, what was this in? What dmaage did it do?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:08:55 No.52905387 Report

Quoted By: >>52905450

>>52905327
They limited battles to just Pokémon that can canonically fly, which is kind of arbitrary in practice, and it forced the 3D models of any Pokémon that *can* fly, to be flying, even when they’re not typically portrayed as such, and because gen 6’s models were used for 7 and 8, the issue stuck around for a long time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:10:22 No.52905401 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896741
lmao what a fucking awful take

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:14:04 No.52905450 Report

Quoted By: >>52905502

>>52905387
Wait was this in X&Y or S&M? I played X&Y, but honestly cant remember a fucking thing about it except mega evos. Didnt bother with S&M.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:16:23 No.52905472 Report

Quoted By: >>52905536

>>52904935
>what is nash equilibrium
Pokemon is one of the easiest turn-based games out there stop kidding yourself with this le high iq "JUST LIKE CHESS!!!" shit, fuck off

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:20:18 No.52905502 Report

Quoted By: >>52905571 >>52905597

>>52905450
XY but the funniest thing is that there were so few sky battles that most people don’t even realize that’s where the issue stems from.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO hmmmmmmmmmmmm.png, 342KiB, 418x550

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:25:28 No.52905536 Report

Quoted By:

>>52905472
>stop kidding yourself with this le high iq "JUST LIKE CHESS!!!" shit, fuck off
I didn't claim it to be. Singles Pokemon is fun because it's easy to grasp all the possible options your opponent has (regardless if some would be more optimal), both from a casual and competitive standpoint. Easy for casuals to click SE move, not too many options for a comp player to consider their opponent might make and roll the dice against their prediction.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:29:51 No.52905571 Report

Quoted By: >>52905597

>>52905502
I am certain I never played a fucking sky battle in that game. I'm sure of it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 02:33:17 No.52905597 Report

Quoted By:

>>52905502
>>52905571
Not only were there only a few of them, they were also always optional.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 03:12:36 No.52905886 Report

Quoted By: >>52905983

>>52896637
i could bet actual money game freak couldn't optimize triple and rotation battles to work with displayed trainers in sun/moon at an acceptable framerate on 3ds
everything afterwards doesn't matter because gen 7 killed the concept of gens and newer pokemon games are self-contained packages rather than incremental upgrades

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 03:23:10 No.52905983 Report

Quoted By:

>>52905886
They couldn't get them to run at an acceptable framerate even without trainers present.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 03:45:14 No.52906145 Report

Quoted By: >>52906298

>>52896637
>singles except every turn is a rock paper scissors coin flip because switching has no cost
>doubles except you automatically lose if you send out your pokemon in the wrong order because it's literally impossible to target the thing on the far side of the field

wow I wonder why they flopped, it definitely couldn't be because they're gimmicky garbage made from game freak running out of ideas to make gen 5 seem less blatantly stagnant than it was

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 04:01:46 No.52906281 Report

Quoted By: >>52908588

>>52904973
>I dont play the games

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 04:04:41 No.52906298 Report

Quoted By:

>>52906145
yeah this is it, rotation and triple battles were extremely poorly designed. Not even touching sky battles or inverse battles, neither of which changed enough to actually be a part of this conversation.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 06:00:30 No.52907071 Report

Quoted By:

>>52896863
WYNAUT

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 11:09:44 No.52908588 Report

Quoted By:

>>52906281
yes, you don't play the games. Singles games naturally take longer than double games and in VGC timer stall is a legit strategy

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 11:11:17 No.52908597 Report

Quoted By:

>>52900557
you're right, they take 30+

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 11:28:19 No.52908711 Report

Quoted By:

Triples can't run on Switch. It's Nintendo fault

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 11:30:55 No.52908731 Report

Quoted By: >>52908741

>>52896637
Triple battles just screamed lazy gimmick
No one gave a shit about rotation battles due to triple battles leaving a bad taste. Shame because rotation is actually FUN

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 06 Jan 2023 11:32:51 No.52908741 Report

Quoted By:

>>52908731
You're retarded. Half the players on saw Rotation for most the game

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