>>89248824>Babymetal being metal idols.I'd arguee there's a difference between and "Alt" idol and someone who is a subversive idol. Alt idols are still very much idols, the alternative part of them comes in the way they work within the idol framework, how the experiment with the music genere generally associated with idols and their presentation, something like Brand-new Idol Society, their songs GO HARD, their concerts have mosh pits and their music doesn't really fit into what people usually associate with the j-pop produced by more idols, but they do the singing, they do the dancing, their fans take breaks from beating the shit out of each other to wotagei, they're idols, just "alterntive" idols, someone being a subversive idol, for me is someone who doesn't attempt to even work within the idol framework, they're not idols by any means, their fans do not see them as idols, they're people who take the "idol' branding and attempt to muddy it and mock it, there's no respect, there's no passion, it's just grifting.
